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60PlusWinger

Breaking bad habits of longer sticks

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I've been cutting my sticks 1 inch off full retail for quite some time now. It seemed to be the good not too long but not too short happy medium. In shoot arounds my shoots were good but in games at times the suffered as well as my puck possession. I essentially found myself being a forechecking shooter with little play down low and rarely trying to split a defender or skating around them. Playing at a higher level has me thinking that I'm not shooting enough quality shots because at 5'9 off skates my stick is getting in the way, I'm not bending my knees enough during play and that maybe cutting another inch off a P28 might actually unlock something useful to correct

those habits even though length seems to be a lot of preference. 

 

I look at a guy like Matt Duchene who uses a pretty high flex after cutting a TON off his sticks and in these pictures he gets so low to shoot and has a lazer of a shot while being excellent in traffic and really versatile offensively. Does only one inch off seem like a long stick for a 5'9 guy? Even if it's uncomfortable for a while should I stick with trying 2 inches off because it's going to force me to really get low? I have a solid shot now but the rest of my game isn't where I want it to be for B league men's hockey. Anyone else work through a lengthy uncomfortable period after cutting sticks really short only to unlock a much better everything after?

 

836018C9-A368-46AA-850E-0F86A6CC5BAD_zps

 

9717F67B-7CFE-4E80-9093-C4741AA935D2_zps

 

 

 

 

 

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I'm about the same height and trim maybe 3" - 4" off the top of my sticks with no issues.  I'm pretty sure it all comes down to personal preference to be honest, I mean look at a guy like Mats Zuccarello, he's the smallest guy on the Rangers and uses one of the longest sticks on the team, it's just what he likes.  I grew up with the Gretzky method of cutting a stick to the height of your chin when on skates (this was from a hockey tutorial VHS from the late 80's I used to rent all the time from the local video rental store... pretty sure I just aged myself haha).

 

So back on topic, if you trim off too much and find it's too short you can always add in a butt end to get back to the longer length you like so maybe experiment on an old stick at first.

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If you feel that you aren't getting enough knee bend in play then you can either shorten your sticks or go with a lower lie. The third option is to go all Toby Enstrom and continue using the lengthy sticks but drop your top hand down from the end in certain situations.

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With my stick cut 1 inch my snap shots, wrist shots and slap shots are hard but that's when I have ample time. I feel like stick length may also be hindering my release quickness. My snapshots tend to be a quick wrist snap and I'm not getting them off the toe like I do in warm ups where I have no opposing pressure. 

 

Stick handling with a stick ball is great in a house but when I'm on the ice I tend to avoid even trying to dangle or stick handle through which shouldn't be the case. I push a lot of pucks and wonder if I shortened I'd get more quality out of my game because I'm forced to get low to shoot too.

 

im using a p28 82 flex 1n right now

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4 hours ago, 60PlusWinger said:

With my stick cut 1 inch my snap shots, wrist shots and slap shots are hard but that's when I have ample time. I feel like stick length may also be hindering my release quickness. My snapshots tend to be a quick wrist snap and I'm not getting them off the toe like I do in warm ups where I have no opposing pressure. 

 

Stick handling with a stick ball is great in a house but when I'm on the ice I tend to avoid even trying to dangle or stick handle through which shouldn't be the case. I push a lot of pucks and wonder if I shortened I'd get more quality out of my game because I'm forced to get low to shoot too.

 

im using a p28 82 flex 1n right now

 

Really only one way to find that out, right? 

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When you say 1 inch off, what stick is that off? I assume 60? They all come in different lengths nowadays, heres a few of mine and its all over the place. I am about your height, and stick with 57 inch long sticks usually, but the trend nowadays seems to be longer sticks unlike the old days. 

 

IMG_5002.jpg

 

 

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I'm 5'8 and use an intermediate 67 flex cut to my collarbone on skates. Probably about a 75/80 when cut down. I've literally seen 10 year old kids have taller sticks than me. Very hard to transition if you're not used to it, so the change has to be gradual. You're probably going to hate life for a little bit, and it definitely makes finding the right lie harder.

Mine is a little messed up, I get more heel to mid tape wear so I really have to roll my wrists when stickhandling. 

 

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Full retail Bauer -1 inch is what im used to. Warm up shots are much different from game shots. I tend to shoot high with a P92, P28 not such a sailing shot but game shots are different. Sometimes I need to get a shot off quick in a game and with the P28 it's either on the toe just right and a great shot or its on the flat part of the curve and if I'm off camber its not accurate. Warm up stuff I'm sniper accurate with a P28. Unfortunately games aren't warm ups and I need to round off my game. 

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I used to cut sticks to my Adam's apple barefoot. Now I prefer to my chin barefoot. It feels perfect. A little shorter and I can tell I'm reaching for pucks. A little longer, and I feel like I'm swinging around the stick instead of through it. My elbows and shoulders feel much more comfortable and aligned at the new length. I think what kept me shorter was I stopped playing around the time OPS became common. Now that I'm playing again and that's what's available, I'm finding I can get the longer length without having to weigh down the stick with an overly long plug. I'm just shy of 6'3", so the old standard shaft and blade combo would get too heavy for me to still perceive good puck feel with an end plug 3" or so long. I haven't used a retail OPS in a while, so I'm not sure how long this ends up being compared to that, but I'm guessing it's almost the same length that you use, 60+.

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I'm 6'1 (barefoot) and when I am on skates my sticks fall between the Clavicle and Adams apple depending what curve/stick I'm using and my play style at the time. Depending on the sticks stock length I usually cut 1-3inch off at least.

 

I'll measure some of my sticks when I get home to give you a better idea how long they are.

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Hey 60PlusWinger; 

Lengths/sticks I have in the rotation depending on my play style at the time;

**Measured standing on toe flat against the wall
**All sticks were more or less the same hight from the shop, give or take half an inch

 

I can step onto the ice with any of these and know I'll have a comfortable game. Solid puck control, hard shot, good balance - I always have a 2nd stick to switch too in case I'm not feeling it though. 

 

64.5"
Bauer 1N - 95flex, P14 - Feels great all round - Particularly in defense
CCM 40K - 85flex, P29 - Feels great all round
CCM SuperTacks - 85flex, P29 (feels terrible, cutting it down)

 

64.25"
CCM SuperTacks - 85flex, P29 (Still feels terrible! Will be cutting it down to 63.75")

 

63.75"
Bauer 1N - 87flex, P28 - Feels excellent
Bauer 1X - 87flex, P14 - Feels good
True A5.2 - 95flex, TC3 - Feels excellent

CCM Tacks - 95flex - P29 - Feels great all round - But very stiff so I don't really use it anymore (It was longer stick than normal because it's 95flex which is why cutting it down to match the other sticks made it so stiff)

 

What I'm getting at here is that some sticks feel better at some lengths than others depending on curve, flex profile, play style. I'm not sure if stick weight comes into it at all or not. I generally feel the toe curves are better on shorter sticks for me. 

 

Further examples; To me the 40k feels fantastic, the SuperTacks has the same curve/flex as the 40K but felt rubbish to me at the same length. The same was true with the original Tacks, it felt rubbish at 64.5" despite the curve being the same as well. The 1N (P28), 1X and A5.2 all felt rubbish at 64.5" and feel amazing at 63.75".. But the 1N (P14) feels amazing at 64.5" and I'm not even considering cutting it shorter.

 

I'm very fortunate to have had the opportunity to try this variety of sticks in the combinations I like over the last two years and if my experiments can help other people save a buck or improve their game then that's job done as far as I'm concerned :) 

 

Tl;dr

I'd say there is no exact science and you just need to give it a shot. If you cut it too short put a plug in and don't cut your next stick so short. 

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2 hours ago, jeffg said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAOoLYZmgiQ

 

Howie Meeker  old but true

 

Definitely a good vid. It's what convinced me to start cutting my sticks down. My game was suffering a bit so I went looking for things to try and I followed a link to http://www.cuthockeysticks.com/ via some blog I was reading at the time. Have not regretted it since!

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One of the things I noticed with shooting anyway with the P28/E28 is that when I have ample set up time and the heel is off the ice for the shot it's unreal. Scott Bjugstad helped develop the pattern and always said that in order to shoot it correctly the heel had to be off the ice. I like the toe on this because it's like a security blanked and I can make weird passes at off angles because I use the toe to change the direction. Picking pucks off the boards on my shooting side is nice too. I just need to gain confidence in my

carrying and also my release. Lately my

shots have been getting tangled in sticks in close instead of being mobile enough to get it off quick without whacking another stick in my follow through. 

 

 

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Get the heel to toe down with the E28 too though. Then you can still get a solid release even if you don't have time to set up the heel-up shot.

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Precisely. Only, you have to find the sweet spot to release from. It's not actually the toe, since that's scooped up with the rocker, you'll get partial contact on the puck and flutter it. You want to stop/release just before the toe rocker. It flings nice tight saucers this way as well...heel to mid-toe. It's the aggressive toe rocker that throws people off in their normal heel-to-toe with the Kreps. But if you adjust for its geometry, much like people are told to in order to shoot with the heel up, it's a wicked puck launcher.

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Honestly, with the real effectiveness of the blade being when you shoot the puck off the toe with the hands in front of the body, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense if the 1N is best for your shot.  I use a P28 1N because I can't get much load out of a Vapor stick.  But with the cross-laid fibers in the new 1X, I'll probably be switching to that.  It comes down to where and how you shoot from.  The P28 is really best for someone who carries the puck in front of their front skate, or shoots more often off the wrong leg (which puts the puck even with the front foot and the hands out in front).  If you take more shots where you roll your wrists and move the puck from heel to toe, the P28 is proably not the best blade for you.  To do those things, you carry the puck further back in  your stance (equal to your front heel or back) and that puts the puck on the heel of the blade.  To shoot consistently, you then have to transition the puck to the toe and move your hands forward.  That's not ideal, and takes a little longer.  Maybe that is why you are having problems.  You are rushing your motion because there is pressure, leading to inconsistent shots or getting them blocked.  In warm ups, you have more time so you can get full motion shots off.

 

Edited to add- originally, the photos in your first picture didn't load for me.  But the first of Duchene is what I'm talking about.  That's an off-leg, hands-in-front shot that would be effective with a P28.  If you don't shoot like that, then this curve probably isn't the best for you.  Even the second pic, while the puck is far back, it's still only in line with his front foot and his hands will be out front on the release.  It's the hands out front that load the stick and give him the lazer of a shot, not the flex rating of the stick.  Phil Kessel is the same way.

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Reading all of this and it sounds to me like the E28/P28 curve really isn't the pattern for you. If you play a lot in traffic and rarely have time to set up the perfect shooting position in a game then you are using the wrong pattern. You would be better served using some kind of constant curve pattern where you can get quick shots off regardless of where the puck is on blade.

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47 minutes ago, 60PlusWinger said:

Would that entail a half release or a super roll of the wrist as well as going cross body with the stick?

 

Full release, as in full swinging follow through, but no not much of any wrist motion. You just time the release to happen with the puck moving from the heel to not quite the toe...you just have to try timing your release from different points until you find its sweet spot. The blade is perfectly open to get good spin and loft (when you want it) on the shot without rolling your wrists.

 

While the others above saying maybe a different pattern might be better, I know you have tried and do try a lot of different patterns, and since you have the Kreps now, why not just see if you can work out the kinks before kicking it to the curb. It really is a blade that much more versatile that just shooting from one position, exactly the same way all the time.

 

There's no ice here at the moment, otherwise I could try to make a demo video of what I mean.

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With hockey gear, I have always been a proponent of getting the equipment that fits your game and not forcing your game to fit your equipment.

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8 minutes ago, chippa13 said:

With hockey gear, I have always been a proponent of getting the equipment that fits your game and not forcing your game to fit your equipment.

 

I don't think near enough players follow this very simple philosophy. 

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For me personally I've had to work on the transition from handling/receiving the puck to getting in a shooting position while protecting the puck.  Making the transition as smooth (and then as quick) as possible.  Though I'm using a p14 so it's not as extreme as a p28.

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