Tuuk lightspeed 1 v. 2s

[Quintin 16]

LS2's have the red motion design, where the origional LightSpeeds have a grey (gray, whatever) colored one.

Not necessarily, some LS2's have the gray motion design. The way I can tell the difference is where it says "Lightspeed". LS1 just has the text. LS2 has the line above it.

[JR Boucicaut 3759]

The holder is the same. You should be worrying about the steel more than the holder itself.

[Jason16 0]

out of curiosity, do the holes for Tuuk C+ line up with Lightspeeds?

[#96 0]

I can't tell, are these LS1's or LS2's?

Umm, call me blind, but doesn't the steel itself say "LS2" on it.

Look on the steel of the front skate. All the way to the left, towards the heel end, it looks like it says kinda faintly "LS2".

[Bauer_freAK 0]

I know for sure that the new version (on the One90) the steel is longer then the first version, longer=more push and speed.

less agility on the ice...

[DarkStar50 679]

Before everybody gets their panties in a knot, think about the idea that there must be a reason the new LS 2 will have a longer blade for more glide and speed. Have you ever watched speed skating? Longer blade = more glide and more speed. Now for all these years, like over 20, when Tuuk went to Tuuk Custom, they had actually reduced the length of the blade on holder. I always skate in size 6 boots. My original Tuuks were 260 mm. When Tuuk Custom was introduced, my size 6 boots now had 254 mm. I would take those 254s off everytime and mount 260s. Now, NBH is returning to the fact that longer is faster. Thank you, NBH.

[khockey#3 0]

"Before everybody gets their panties in a knot, think about the idea that there must be a reason the new LS 2 will have a longer blade for more glide and speed. Have you ever watched speed skating? Longer blade = more glide and more speed. Now for all these years, like over 20, when Tuuk went to Tuuk Custom, they had actually reduced the length of the blade on holder. I always skate in size 6 boots. My original Tuuks were 260 mm. When Tuuk Custom was introduced, my size 6 boots now had 254 mm. I would take those 254s off everytime and mount 260s. Now, NBH is returning to the fact that longer is faster. Thank you, NBH"

aaaaamen

[jimmy 194]

Better to enlarge the gliding surface by having a custom radius. Assuming the new Bauer holders are longer, then we need to know if Bauer increased the stock radius from 9' to something else. If not, the blade will not be any faster.

[DarkStar50 679]

Better to enlarge the gliding surface by having a custom radius.  Assuming the new Bauer holders are longer, then we need to know if Bauer increased the stock radius from 9' to something else.  If not, the blade will not be any faster.

Do you really think they would invest time and money in this project without a tangible improvement in skating speed?

[cobrAA 0]

does it just happens to me or other have experienced this...

I was skating on 272 blade for like almost 2 year and a half... and when i bought my new pair of skate 280mm... i felt sooo ''weak'' unbalanced on ice...it like if the added steel was too much for me and i couldn't get used to...so i've mount my LS2 272 on my tack(280)

That means, i'M not sure if i would get used to these new LS...

[jimmy 194]

Better to enlarge the gliding surface by having a custom radius.  Assuming the new Bauer holders are longer, then we need to know if Bauer increased the stock radius from 9' to something else.  If not, the blade will not be any faster.

Do you really think they would invest time and money in this project without a tangible improvement in skating speed?

Yes I do, marketing is a demon of it's own. We need to know exactly what radius the new steel has. Also did they explain that more speed = loss of agility and turning? I doubt it.

You are a master Bauer dealer. Do you have the answers?

[hurricane 0]

are the 8090 made in Canada?

on my box it says made in Thailand......

Thought they were; talked to JR; look at the tag on the boot, Says designed in canada not made.

[DarkStar50 679]

Better to enlarge the gliding surface by having a custom radius.  Assuming the new Bauer holders are longer, then we need to know if Bauer increased the stock radius from 9' to something else.  If not, the blade will not be any faster.

Do you really think they would invest time and money in this project without a tangible improvement in skating speed?

Yes I do, marketing is a demon of it's own. We need to know exactly what radius the new steel has. Also did they explain that more speed = loss of agility and turning? I doubt it.

You are a master Bauer dealer. Do you have the answers?

"more speed = loss of agility and turning" NHLers skate at a speed that is beyond fast. They skate with little or no "loss of agility and turning" at very fast speeds so I'm not sure I understand your point or its validity. I have also watched Olympic figure skaters train in the rink I work at. The speed these skaters have going backwards into triple jumps is also extremely fast. Again, their ability to turn and their agility on takeoffs is not compromised by speed. Since I made reference to speed skates, I am interested to know the radius of those blades. Those blades have always appeared very flat to me but I have limited experience with speed skate blades. Given the even faster speeds that are reached on a longer blade, I find this concept to be an interesting cross over of sport specific application. These ideas and facts have been staring all the major skate manufacturers in the face for over 30 years. It is only now that one of them has decided to take the chance and integrate the application to hockey skates. Let us see what happens in the "real world" before we all rush to judgement.

As for marketing and its "demons", I guess it is up to us to separate fact from fiction. However, after seeing the work that does go on at RD & D in Ste Jerome, I believe a company such as NBH can back up their claims.

As for the rest of the "answers", I'll bring a list of questions to Boston to ask at the show. Let me know what the rest of your questions are.

[sogaduch 0]

i have a question will bauer give us a price break when they know we have to order four different types of runners and 3 different types of holders cause you know darkstar that the runner in the one90 doesnt fit in the holder of the vapor XXX.

[Bauer_freAK 0]

Before everybody gets their panties in a knot, think about the idea that there must be a reason the new LS 2 will have a longer blade for more glide and speed. Have you ever watched speed skating? Longer blade = more glide and more speed. Now for  all these years, like over 20, when Tuuk went to Tuuk Custom, they had actually reduced the length of the blade on holder. I always skate in size 6 boots. My original Tuuks were 260 mm. When Tuuk Custom was introduced, my size 6 boots now had 254 mm. I would take those 254s off everytime and mount 260s. Now, NBH is returning to the fact that longer is faster. Thank you, NBH.

But less agility on the ice...

sry :D you said that in the next post...

[DarkStar50 679]

i have a question will bauer give us a price break when they know we have to order four different types of runners and 3 different types of holders cause you know darkstar that the runner in the one90 doesnt fit in the holder of the vapor XXX.

The "price break" is known as a booking discount.

[jimmy 194]

"more speed = loss of agility and turning" NHLers skate at a speed that is beyond fast. They skate with little or no "loss of agility and turning" at very fast speeds so I'm not sure I understand your point or its validity. I have also watched Olympic figure skaters train in the rink I work at. The speed these skaters have going backwards into triple jumps is also extremely fast. Again, their ability to turn and their agility on takeoffs is not compromised by speed. Since I made reference to speed skates, I am interested to know the radius of those blades. Those blades have always appeared very flat to me but I have limited experience with speed skate blades. Given the even faster speeds that are reached on a longer blade, I find this concept to be an interesting cross over of sport specific application. These ideas and facts have been staring all the major skate manufacturers in the face for over 30 years. It is only now that one of them has decided to take the chance and integrate the application to hockey skates. Let us see what happens in the "real world" before we all rush to judgement.

As for marketing and its "demons", I guess it is up to us to separate fact from fiction. However, after seeing the work that does go on at RD & D in Ste Jerome, I believe a company such as NBH can back up their claims.

As for the rest of the "answers", I'll bring a list of questions to Boston to ask at the show. Let me know what the rest of your questions are.

Yes, more speed = loss of turning ability. Any time the radius (gliding surface) is lengthened speed increases, when shortened, it decreases. A smaller radius gives increased agility at a sacrifice for speed.

Speed skaters have very long radius to match their very long steel. But, they can't turn worth a crap, arc is way wide. Exactly why NHLrs do not use speed skates. Still, to argue your point, we can't use NHLrs as "real world" examples. These guys have perfect form, strength, and technique (edge control). Speed, and turning ability come from these traits as well.

A longer radius will increase speed. However, longer steel without a longer radius, will not. That's all I'm trying to say. We are anxiously awaiting the specs on the new steel. What answer we will be looking for is what is the new stock radius on the longer steel?

[DarkStar50 679]

In the post "saw the one90" JR says he saw the skate last night. He mentions a 9' radius and 4mm longer on the blade. He says that NBH went back to original "Tuuk"(before new lengths with Tuuk Custom +) lengths. This is not yet confirmed from NBH. I did request some info from NBH overnight on this issue.

Part of the "real world" problem is that consumers are getting the same blades/holders as the pros. So, how well the average or elite skater, not an NHLer, can adapt to the product remains to be seen. If these "new" lengths are in fact, the "old" lengths, the adjustment should be minimal. As I stated before, personally I always liked the 260mm over the 254mm on my boots. The Vapor XX skate I currently use I just didn't bother to change the LS 254 to Tuuk 260. I didn't notice a big difference now as I prefer to be more "agile" on my skates. My "speed" days are way behind me. The older I get, the faster I was!

On a side note, please see that I mentioned in another post that I thought all Tuuk lengths were equal to CCM lengths, except for Tuuk 272 vs CCM 271. Please let me know if I'm wrong. I won't be in the shop til later this AM to check that out.

Take it ez.

[jimmy 194]

Kids adjust to longer steel lengths every time they get a new size skate, no problems adjusting at all. Also no noticable "speed" improvements either. :)

Correct on the tuuk vs CCM lengths, but there is also a few more; 254 vs 255, 246 vs 247, 295 vs 296, and others in the smaller sizes. All within 1mm though

[Hockey DeVoTee 1]

An earlier question was, what is the blade profile of figure skates? I'm looking at a spec sheet from John Wilson skates. The range of radius of blade/rocker is 6' - 8.5'. Figure skates- longer blade shoter profile?

Very complicated subject, As a customer of Nike I hope Nike/Bauer provides technical info on how this new design enhances performance.

New design...... Performance Enhancer or Marketing Campaign/Gimmick????

[DarkStar50 679]

Kids adjust to longer steel lengths every time they get a new size skate, no problems adjusting at all. Also no noticable "speed" improvements either. :)

Excellent point! Thanks for the heads up on that thought. Now its up to better /elite skaters to have the longer blade improve their skating ability.

Peter

[skates 3]

Jimmy,

Your pov on steel radius is valid, however, regardless of what radius we were to select for our steel runners, we do not control what happens once the retailer sharpens them. Over the years pro shops have become masters at profiling & customizing steel radius for different skating styles/preferences, even positions.

We feel 9' addresses a significant player requirement base but we certainly do not pretend that this is the best for everone. We leave that expertise to you guy's.....the pro's.

As to your question “did they explain that more speed = loss of agility & turning†to DarkStar50, I can assure you that we are very sensitive to skating performance. Whenever spec changes or new ideas are evaluated & tested we do not just measure/promote the positives, we make sure & validate that we have not created areas that negatively effect skating maneuvers.

That said, with a longer runner we wanted to make sure that we did no “lose†performance in other skating areas & validated agility/tight turns with time trials. There is no indication of any loss of agility or speed. From a player perception pov the majority of our test subjects have commented on how agile this skate actually is, this in about every runner radius imaginable out there.

Cheers

[sogaduch 0]

i have a question will bauer give us a price break when they know we have to order four different types of runners and 3 different types of holders cause you know darkstar that the runner in the one90 doesnt fit in the holder of the vapor XXX.

The "price break" is known as a booking discount.

yeah i know that much but sucks on our end when they know we have to carry these blades in varying sizes,so guess ill be seein u in boston

[tburk32 0]

not to change the subject but i have a quick question. i have bauer 8090's and my steel is no longer perfectly vertical in the holder and i was told to get them replaced under warrenty. so my LHS is getting me new lightspeeds is bauer still making the original lightspeed or will i get the lightspeed 2??? im just curious cause mine came with the ls2.

thanks

ps is this a common problem that my steel is leaning one way or the other????

[jimmy 194]

Jimmy,

Your pov on steel radius is valid, however, regardless of what radius we were to select for our steel runners, we do not control what happens once the retailer sharpens them. Over the years pro shops have become masters at profiling & customizing steel radius for different skating styles/preferences, even positions.

We feel 9' addresses a significant player requirement base but we certainly do not pretend that this is the best for everone. We leave that expertise to you guy's.....the pro's.

As to your question “did they explain that more speed = loss of agility & turning†to DarkStar50, I can assure you that we are very sensitive to skating performance. Whenever spec changes or new ideas are evaluated & tested we do not just measure/promote the positives, we make sure & validate that we have not created areas that negatively effect skating maneuvers.

That said, with a longer runner we wanted to make sure that we did no “lose†performance in other skating areas & validated agility/tight turns with time trials. There is no indication of any loss of agility or speed. From a player perception pov the majority of our test subjects have commented on how agile this skate actually is, this in about every runner radius imaginable out there.

Cheers

Nice to see someone from Bauer on the board.

I agree, once a skate is sharpened once, all "factory" settings are out the window.

That's why us pro shops are here to fine tune for top performance.

So, let me get this correct, you say the stock radius is still 9'. This would explaine that your test subjects say the skate is agile, as most Bauer skates are with the smaller stock radius. What I'd like to know the "science" behind the claim that the skate is now faster because it is lengthened a few milimeters, but the radius stays the same. Doesn't jive.