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MThockeydad

Digital SLR's

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I'll have that option when I get a brighter lens. With the kit lens zoomed to 55mm, it forces the f-stop up to 5.6.

The kit lens did really well nearer 18mm shooting the candid bench shots. The 70-200 is going to be way too long to catch anyone on the bench--except from across the ice! :lol:

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I'll have that option when I get a brighter lens. With the kit lens zoomed to 55mm, it forces the f-stop up to 5.6.

The kit lens did really well nearer 18mm shooting the candid bench shots. The 70-200 is going to be way too long to catch anyone on the bench--except from across the ice! :lol:

You'd be surprised.... This is just in the stands behind the bench.... Not super far away....

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...and then one from the ice...

1_zpsd511468d.jpg

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Good point. If I'm shooting photos and not opening doors, I'll be a bit farther from the bench.

I had access to the bench Sunday as it was the final scrimmage of the girls fall hockey clinic.

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I really like shooting from the bench/box. Seems light is always better and you sometimes get some great angles.

HATE shooting through glass or nets....

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This is the 18-55 kit lens. I'm still shopping for a 70-200.

ISO 3200, most of them zoomed out at or near 55mm, so f/4.0 or 5.6

in this case you did fine. You got some good results.

Have you ever thought about a used prime lens like 50 mm 1.8 or 85 mm 1.8 ? If you are on the bench, you can get some very sharp and bright pictures. The only problem is no zoom.

Personally I think the 50 mm 1.8 is one of the best value lenses out there. Sharp, fast, small, light and inexpensive relatively. You can carry that lens around and use it for a whole bunch of other applications other than hockey.

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in this case you did fine. You got some good results.

thank you!

Have you ever thought about a used prime lens like 50 mm 1.8 or 85 mm 1.8 ? If you are on the bench, you can get some very sharp and bright pictures. The only problem is no zoom.

Personally I think the 50 mm 1.8 is one of the best value lenses out there. Sharp, fast, small, light and inexpensive relatively. You can carry that lens around and use it for a whole bunch of other applications other than hockey.

Absolutely. I think its a great value--and would be good for indoor/party/candid/landscape/etc. shots as well.

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The shots you got were better than what most parents usually take! Exposure's fine, not too noisy and only a little blur in one photo which works depending on what you're aiming for.

When I was shooting hockey, it was from the bench. The other thing to take into account is if the camera is full-frame or crop sensor. If it's crop sensor, the 70-200 will seem a big longer. Anywhere from 1.3x to 1.5x, but I'm not sure of the exact numbers with Canon.

I love 50mm lenses. Felt it was a bit long on my D40 and D90 which were crop sensors and would have probably opted for the 35mm 1.8 had it been out at the time. But it's a great focal length on my D800.

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thanks! I abhor cell phone photos--taken by others or me.

Who cares if they're 18 megapixel if the lens is only 1/8" across and obscured by a single fingerprint and dust!

I'm 99% sure they're crop sensor.

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Some photos from this weekend. Canon T3 with a rented Canon 70-200 2.8 lens:

(I know, Sunny 16 is easy!)

Younger daughter in the red helmet

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Pic taken with my camera by another parent while I was coaching:

Oldest daughter:

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Night shots--the only time the 2.8 exposure got used:

IMG_6772b_zps921b4bb0.jpg

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Nice!

Something special about outdoor rinks.... Though the comforts of indoor is sure nice, I still wish we had a few around here. If we're outdoors, it's on a pond.

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Great shots! Yeah, I rarely dip to 2.8, but it's nice to have the ability to go there. Usually shoot in the range of 4-5.6 so that most of the subject is in focus, but still get some nice depth of field.

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good job, how do you like using the lens ?

just out of curiousity where is this rink/city ? Outdoor rink this early in the winter season ? the ice conditions look great especially in the open sun. (usually melts some of the ice)

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I like it. Rented one for the weekend.

Just found a T5i with a Tamron 18-270 for $650 on eBay. It's 3.5-5.6, so it will be a little dark inside, but should be great outside.

Kalispell, MT. We opened Oct. 27. We had 2 days with sunshine and over 40 and the ice got soft, but we're typically overcast all winter.

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It will be interesting to see photos with your new camera and lens and how much of a difference there is.

Kallispell, MT. I did a google search and its not too far from Calgary, Alberta. Is it easy to drive up to Canada ?

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I'm hoping to have it tomorrow and get some shots this weekend.

It's ~4hr to Calgary in the summer time, probably 5+ given winter roads?

The easiest border crossing at Del Bonita is on some poorly maintained gravel this time of year!

We're only 2h south of Fernie, BC, and 1h south of the border crossing at Roosville. (first 7 photos in post 34 are against Fernie in black)

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I got some great photos with the Tamron 18-270 lens.

I did give up some speed against the Canon 2.8, but I liked having the longer and shorter zooms on both ends.

Lighting was a bit funky--foggy during the day and the night lighting was dimmer than our local rink.

I shot most of these at ISO-6400, which is pretty grainy.

For my use, and my budget, I think its a good compromise, and I can always rent the 2.8 for big events.

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EJB, are you the one who recommended keeping your finger on the shutter for celly shots? GREAT ADVICE!!

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Edited by MThockeydad
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great pictures, I really like the first shot the best. Something different and creates imagination.

Are you using matrix metering ? Have you tried spot or center metering ?

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Matrix at this time.

I am realizing I have a TON to learn.

I got into photography about 14 years ago and had a 35mm Elan IIE and shot a lot of b&w. Then we had kids and they got busy and it was mostly point-and-shoots that I could tuck in my pocket.

Hockey is too fast (and sometimes too dark and too far) for the point and shoots, plus I have the "luxury" of standing outside the glass with nothing else to do, so why not take photos?

We played in Salmon, Idaho. Really friendly small town (3,100 people) rink. The lighting conditions with low night lighting and daytime fog were a little challenging, but added a lot to the photos.

Here's what their scenery normally looks like:

IMG_0003_zps0d1ee25d.jpg

Yes, that is chain link! :)

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I handed off the camera to my 13 year-old daughter to snap pics.

Same rink as earlier in the thread (previous photos taken with the kit 18-55mm lens) but now with the Tamron 18-270.

I definitely got spoiled using that 2.8 lens for a weekend.

The megazoom gives up quite a bit of speed (f-5 for most photos taken with moderate zoom), and the camera took most photos at ISO 6400.

Not bad--much better than a cell photo or point and shoot, but not as great as the 2.8

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I'm going to add my 2 cents to this thread. I know I'm late to the party, but you seem to be buying gear cheap and trying new stuff out (which is the smart way to go about it IMO) so hopefully I can help a little.

You cant expect to shoot moving objects effectively with a Canon T3. It has a 9 pt AF, with only a center cross point. Only 2 FPS shooting Raw. Can you even change one of the buttons on the back to be a focus button, and have the trigger only work the shutter? This is a *MUST* for AI Servo shooting. Step #1 is setting up your camera this way.

You will probably think I am crazy, but I would much, much rather shoot an original 1D than that T3. I bet they are 200 bucks or less these days. 45 pt AF, 8 FPS. Megapixels are not a concern unless you make money shooting. I still shoot a 1D2 for anything action, and it blows any of these Canon crop sensor cameras out of the water for that until pretty much the 7D... and I would still take it over a 7D. I bet a 1D2 is a sub 500 dollar camera now.

Now, you will miss out on the advances made in high ISO performance. That is by far the biggest differences in todays digital cameras 6-8 years ago. The algos for cleaning up noise are incredible. But the T3 doesnt have a very good sensor, you dont gain much with Canon in those regards. Nikon led that charge in crop sensors IMO. Plus, all this being said, its all about hitting exposure. When I hit exposure at 1600 with my 1D2 its super easy to clean up any noise in post processing.

In regards to lenses... There are two versions of the 70-200 2.8. Thats why the prices used are all over the place. The v.1 had a noticeable difference in image quality vs the v.2... aka the v1 is worse so its much less sought after. A used v.1 should be 1000-1200 these days. Personally I shoot a lot of primes so I always like getting as much speed as possible, and the 200 2.8L is one of the sharpest lenses you can buy for the money, but I dont know if I would want that for hockey. The 70-200 f/4 L IS is probably a good middle ground for you. You get the 70-200 flexibility, its a sub 1000 dollar lens (used for sure), you get IS so you can shoot f/4 and take advantage of that to keep the ISO lower to make up for some of the light you lose with f/4 vs f/2.8.

Just some things to think about.

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I'm going to add my 2 cents to this thread. I know I'm late to the party, but you seem to be buying gear cheap and trying new stuff out (which is the smart way to go about it IMO) so hopefully I can help a little.

You cant expect to shoot moving objects effectively with a Canon T3. It has a 9 pt AF, with only a center cross point. Only 2 FPS shooting Raw. Can you even change one of the buttons on the back to be a focus button, and have the trigger only work the shutter? This is a *MUST* for AI Servo shooting. Step #1 is setting up your camera this way.

You will probably think I am crazy, but I would much, much rather shoot an original 1D than that T3. I bet they are 200 bucks or less these days. 45 pt AF, 8 FPS. Megapixels are not a concern unless you make money shooting. I still shoot a 1D2 for anything action, and it blows any of these Canon crop sensor cameras out of the water for that until pretty much the 7D... and I would still take it over a 7D. I bet a 1D2 is a sub 500 dollar camera now.

Now, you will miss out on the advances made in high ISO performance. That is by far the biggest differences in todays digital cameras 6-8 years ago. The algos for cleaning up noise are incredible. But the T3 doesnt have a very good sensor, you dont gain much with Canon in those regards. Nikon led that charge in crop sensors IMO. Plus, all this being said, its all about hitting exposure. When I hit exposure at 1600 with my 1D2 its super easy to clean up any noise in post processing.

Thank you!

I wasn't very clear in post #38. I bought a T5i with the Tamron lens, and have sold the T3.

I am pretty sure I can configure one of the rear buttons for focus--THANK YOU for that suggestion. Shooting through mesh above the glass was frustrating yesterday as the AF kept trying to focus on the mesh. I wanted a depth of field shot with a little blur on the mesh.

In regards to lenses... There are two versions of the 70-200 2.8. Thats why the prices used are all over the place. The v.1 had a noticeable difference in image quality vs the v.2... aka the v1 is worse so its much less sought after. A used v.1 should be 1000-1200 these days. Personally I shoot a lot of primes so I always like getting as much speed as possible, and the 200 2.8L is one of the sharpest lenses you can buy for the money, but I dont know if I would want that for hockey. The 70-200 f/4 L IS is probably a good middle ground for you. You get the 70-200 flexibility, its a sub 1000 dollar lens (used for sure), you get IS so you can shoot f/4 and take advantage of that to keep the ISO lower to make up for some of the light you lose with f/4 vs f/2.8.

This is the first I've been told to go for IS over lens speed.

A friend of mine was shooting the same league finals I did in post #45, he has the 70-200 f/2.8 non-IS lens and his photos were unbelievably crisp. (Not to take anything away from his skill, either!!). He mentioned that the non-IS lens has 7 fewer elements and has better sharpness. It's in a similar $1k used price range as the f/4 L IS.

IS f/4 is a lot better price for my budget than the IS f/2.8 I rented, but do you think I'd be better with the IS f/4 vs. non-IS f/2.8?

IS f/4 $949 used

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801145893-USE/canon_1258b002_ef_70_200mm_f_4l_is.html

non-IS f/2.8 $879 used

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801146073-USE/canon_2569a004_ef_70_200mm_f_2_8l_usm.html

Another poster recommended the older 80-200 f/2.8 "Magic Drain Pipe" lens. There are some good prices to be had, but it doesn't sound like support is available to repair them anymore.

Here's a non-IS f/4 lens for $529 used. It would arguably give me better shots than the Tamron when zoomed--especially since it's f/4 through its whole range:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801146563-USE/canon_2578a002_ef_70_200mm_f_4l_usm.html

For a couple hundred more, the f/2.8, would be a better long-term purchase for me.

I hate to sound like a lazy consumer, but I really like the zoom range of the 18-270 Tamron; it's not going to turn out as the perfect indoor hockey lens, but I'll enjoy it for a lot of outdoor photography, and it's smaller and lighter than the big Canons.

Edited by MThockeydad

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Thank you!

I wasn't very clear in post #38. I bought a T5i with the Tamron lens, and have sold the T3.

I am pretty sure I can configure one of the rear buttons for focus--THANK YOU for that suggestion. Shooting through mesh above the glass was frustrating yesterday as the AF kept trying to focus on the mesh. I wanted a depth of field shot with a little blur on the mesh.

This is the first I've been told to go for IS over lens speed.

A friend of mine was shooting the same league finals I did in post #45, he has the 70-200 f/2.8 non-IS lens and his photos were unbelievably crisp. (Not to take anything away from his skill, either!!). He mentioned that the non-IS lens has 7 fewer elements and has better sharpness. It's in a similar $1k used price range as the f/4 L IS.

IS f/4 is a lot better price for my budget than the IS f/2.8 I rented, but do you think I'd be better with the IS f/4 vs. non-IS f/2.8?

IS f/4 $949 used

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801145893-USE/canon_1258b002_ef_70_200mm_f_4l_is.html

non-IS f/2.8 $879 used

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801146073-USE/canon_2569a004_ef_70_200mm_f_2_8l_usm.html

Another poster recommended the older 80-200 f/2.8 "Magic Drain Pipe" lens. There are some good prices to be had, but it doesn't sound like support is available to repair them anymore.

Here's a non-IS f/4 lens for $529 used. It would arguably give me better shots than the Tamron when zoomed--especially since it's f/4 through its whole range:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/801146563-USE/canon_2578a002_ef_70_200mm_f_4l_usm.html

For a couple hundred more, the f/2.8, would be a better long-term purchase for me.

I hate to sound like a lazy consumer, but I really like the zoom range of the 18-270 Tamron; it's not going to turn out as the perfect indoor hockey lens, but I'll enjoy it for a lot of outdoor photography, and it's smaller and lighter than the big Canons.

T5i has new hybrid phase type AF, but you cant take advantage of that with the lenses you are shooting... Nor would you want to, its designed for the new STM lenses from what I can tell. So it boils down to a 9 pt AF, although all cross type. You won't have issues when a player is skating at you, but you will have issues when you have to pan. The 9 pt AF's just dont keep up, IMO.

I'm not telling you IS over speed, but you gain a stop with IS. I shoot more lenses without IS than IS, and almost all primes. So I would be remiss if I told you IS over speed. But you are looking for a lens within a budget. The non-IS f/4 lacks image quality. The 70-200 non-is and v.1 IS aren't known for being very sharp... IIRC. Honestly I'd have to research the non-IS or shoot it again, its been a while. I do recall theres a reason its not extremely popular. The two 70-200's with the best image quality are definitely the f/4 IS and the 2.8 IS v.2. So it comes down to how picky you are as well. All will be better than your Tamron. The magic drainpipe is very sharp for the money but has a slow AF that will cost you in these action sports, especially in low light situations. I wouldn't recommend it for you.

I hate those high magnification zooms. I shot Nikons 18-200 vrII for a while and couldn't stand it. To each their own.

Edited by ridindirty
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You cant expect to shoot moving objects effectively with a Canon T3. It has a 9 pt AF, with only a center cross point. Only 2 FPS shooting Raw. Can you even change one of the buttons on the back to be a focus button, and have the trigger only work the shutter? This is a *MUST* for AI Servo shooting. Step #1 is setting up your camera this way.

Good post, but I am a bit confused at how does a back button focus specifically help better focus ? I have a Nikon D2Hs set up with back focus button and sadly my results for motion are not much better than my D90 with shutter focus.

Also, how does the number of focus points improve the ability to track motion ?

THx

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