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Playmakersedge

Keeping the local hockey shops alive

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4 hours ago, Kgbeast said:

I do not think LHS can exist unless it is actually a completely different thing with LHS as an added value thing on the side. For example like what Playmakeredge is talking about: skating and hockey classes which would be the real business, then sharpen skates and sell tape as a side.

Since it is impractical to stock all skates in all sizes, these should have a Bauer and ccm scanners and be a VH fitting center, so for a fee, they can fit a pair of skates without actual skates and then get them from etailer. Then when the skates showup, make sure they fit and then bake sharpen. Perhaps this kind of LHS can have an additional discount or free expedited shipping agreement with an etailer in exchange for preferential status or something like that. Basically it would be all about service only. Stock tape, protectors, laces, inserts and and other things that do not need excessive stock or investment. Also perhaps have an embroidery machine and offer some customization and repair, but that is obviously depends on the additional skillset which one may or may not poses. 

 

I just do not see any scenario for a reseller retail kind of success, that boat has sailed, keeps on going further and further out of sight with development and improvement of the manufacturing and sizing tech. Within next 10 years, even hockeymonkeys of sorts might struggle to keep their viability with manufacturers. If you can make 3d scan with your phone, what is there need to go to a shop? If mfg can make a pair of skates just for you based on the scan within hours, what is the reason to manufacture tons of generic skates and ship them around the country to collect dust?

In my industry (pro electronic equipment) no one mass produces anything. The mfg lines are no longer locked to a generic model, they now can make any model with autoretooling taking a minute if that. Most distributors are merely taking orders and arranging for a drop shipping between mfg and the end-user (or an integrator in my case)

What I would try to do is set up a relationship with the hockey supplier as I did with my auto repair shop . Act as a salesman for Napa. And we would work together.  If they show me having a set of brake pads ,they would say do you have a x car in for brakes  . No ok I'm gonna send a driver to grab them and we will replenish you in the morning.  They owned all the parts I had on hand . All based on the top ten part #'  based on the make of cars I worked on . I set it up . I wasn't calling them for 80% ish of common parts .  With skates  I get the call and they say your inventory shows you got 7ee jet speed , if you aren't selling them now can you ship them off to Joe's pro shop in Maine and we will restock you on the stock order .      This is the way it has to be done.  In the big picture the customer wins,the lhs is making money, supplier is making money  . Maybe even more money because they are doing less return merchandise.  

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6 hours ago, Ps12 said:

A vending machine for tape is an awesome idea!!!

We have one also. Tape, laces, heck even socks (both skate socks and hockey socks). Also mouth guards and water bottles. You know, all the stuff people forget. It’s fantastic! Over priced of course but when you’re desperate...

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16 hours ago, Leif said:

I've had my skates done at a local rink, and it wasn't good. Everyone says to avoid the two local rink shops. I've seen a sharpening at the other rink, and he'd left a step along the length of the hollow, where the skate wasn't high enough to allow the full width to engage the wheel. My last three sharpenings have been bad. Two at a good shop were out by 4/1000". They'd previously been good. One at another shop must have been 3/8" and not 5/8" as requested as that evening at hockey training I could barely skate. They felt too deep. Sharpening is a nightmare. I'm taking my BAT gauge to the sharpeners today! 

A LHS is going to fail, or do poorly, unless they invest in stock and provide good service. I bought mid range skates - Bauer Vapor x500 - at a local rink, and it took me months to realise they were far too big. I was constantly falling over for an unknown reason. I suspect it was because the balance point was off. I didn't try on a range of skates, doubtless because they did not have the stock. I then went to a proper shop, and tried on Bauer Vapor, Supreme and Nexus in a range of sizes and bought a Supreme one full size down from the Vapor's. The proper shop has invested a huge sum in stock. They are not cheap, but I will pay for service. I want to be sure that skates and pads fit. 

That sucks . With me I have to catch up to what direction the industry took in the time it took to get my legs to work.  And just before the spine issue I was using what I had and it was good enough to accel in the beer league so I didn't pay much attention.  I just did my own skates at the rink on a blade master.    So I would need to educate my self  on certain makes fit ,the model in the make  . But I would  . Then I would train staff . The sharpening machine would be on camera on a flat screen. And I will be eyeing it .  It's not hard it's just giving a crap . Realising messing up could hurt someone.   I read hockey stick with grip ,I'm like what do you mean grip ? I'm soaking it in .  All I can do is put the effort in .    

someone in the thread said if a guy is good a servicing skates they can survive.    Here are the economics:  The machine to do profiling and sharpening single head is almost 4k , the rivit machine is 600-700 ,blade straightener 300 (?) . 

This single head for profiling is slow.  To do commercial work the profile machine alone is 3500 , then to get my machine I have here call It 2000  . So 7k to set up efficient do it all hockey skate service.  Labor for holder change 50-75 . Labor for profile 50-80 . I charge 150 but I evaluate the player skating discus ,then do the work  . A sharpening 5 if I am doing a team.  10 if they come to my house.   You got consumable stuff on top of this.  It takes time before you are making money  .  Then you are talking about a side line gig as far as financial gain 

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What I find with the rink sharpening.  Not the pro shop at a rink.  I'm talking about rink has rental skates and a sharpener and you gotta drop the skates off.: They usually make there pass pivoting the skate holder heel to toe or toe to heel and take off the toes and the heels way to much and they push way to hard .  . Versus sliding the holder across the wheel   .   

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4 hours ago, Playmakersedge said:

Touching and seeing isn't spending money  . You spend  $4 a roll because when you need the lhs for good sharpening, or blade holder change  . You are keeping the shop open so there knowledge is available.  

stroesdefence34, in your profile pic is that you skating up ice with the puck? Or is it your kid or player on a team you coach?  I can't tell when I enlarged the pic .

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12 hours ago, Playmakersedge said:

stroesdefence34, in your profile pic is that you skating up ice with the puck? Or is it your kid or player on a team you coach?  I can't tell when I enlarged the pic .

Thats me.

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Unfortunately supporting my local hockey shop would mean either buying overpriced items that I don't want, or settling for a sharpening that includes uneven, banana bladed edges done at a hollow I did not ask for.

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1 hour ago, beanhead said:

Unfortunately supporting my local hockey shop would mean either buying overpriced items that I don't want, or settling for a sharpening that includes uneven, banana bladed edges done at a hollow I did not ask for.

Well if they are doing a shit job then no you shouldn't go there . If they did do good work . Then you could have them get what you are seeking. Or talk to them  . And pay a little more to keep that service convenient.     .    I'm hearing alot of people saying the sharpening is crap .  I'm surprised people are leaving the establishment with a shit job  . And if they are ruining the blades by killing the toes and the heels that folks aren't say you ruined the blades now put steel in and do it right this time .

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i definitely support my local proshops as much as i can. unfortunately, i don't play at the rink with the best proshop. but i'll stop there after work when i need my skates sharpened(they do flat bottom V and also did a great job profiling my steel) and often buy sticks off their great clearance rack and occasionally other stuff since their prices are good and their selection is good.

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2 minutes ago, asgoodasdead said:

i definitely support my local proshops as much as i can. unfortunately, i don't play at the rink with the best proshop. but i'll stop there after work when i need my skates sharpened(they do flat bottom V and also did a great job profiling my steel) and often buy sticks off their great clearance rack and occasionally other stuff since their prices are good and their selection is good.

That's great.   When I said about sharpening jobs @ the rink I meant the rink that doesn't have a pro hop. Just a sharpener  next to rental skates .    Yes we can get stuff a little cheaper on line.  But the stuff  you can't get on line is what they are supposed to be specialists in . If they stink then that'that's an entire different problem.  

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On 12/10/2017 at 12:16 PM, strosedefence34 said:

I play in a private pick up with some friends and Pond hockey. 

I got a decent size side yard  and a second cousin in the pool manufacturing business.  I'm going to see if I can get him to donate an above ground pool liner  to make a nice rink 

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I try to buy local when possible and when the costs are in the same ballpark; I'm not going to pay $400 for something that I can get for $200 online but I'd pay $225 for it. It appears that my LHS has prices comparable to the online folks so that's cool. The issue that I'm having is there is the lack of stock and size of the place. They didn't stock any XL senior helmets for me to try on which is a necessity for me since it's going to be a nightmare for me to get a complete set of gear that fits me properly. The second issue is the size. I know that it's not reasonable to expect a LHS shop the size of a Dick's Sporting Goods in Birmingham, Alabama but the one here at the municipal rink is about the size of my bedroom with a good third of the space devoted the figure skating gear. There is not enough room in it to sit down to try on skates or shin pads. Third is brand selection: 95% of their gear is Bauer or CCM, they don't even have an account with Warrior which is an issue since the minor league team in the building is in the SPHL in which the official equipment company of the league is them. The other major issue with it is that the two ladies who run the shop I believe have figure skating backgrounds and have never played hockey in their lives. As a new player who is big & tall, I need the old man from Mighty Ducks or some grumpy ex-player with a mullet to give me advice and be able to help figure out what gear will work for me. As others have mentioned above, the lack of marketing isn't helping them; they don't even have a Facebook page. If they even had that where you could be notified when they get a shipment of something in would be nice or be able to IM them to ask if they have something in stock.

If they did set up Ecommerce or the very least a social media presence, that would immensely help. It looks like I'm gonna have to drive to Atlanta to get fitted for different gear and to pick people's brains. We need to keep these stores in business. If they go out, I'd have to drive to Huntsville (almost two hours) to get skates sharpened or to be able to try anything on or buy something in person.

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8 hours ago, CigarScott said:

I try to buy local when possible and when the costs are in the same ballpark; I'm not going to pay $400 for something that I can get for $200 online but I'd pay $225 for it. It appears that my LHS has prices comparable to the online folks so that's cool. The issue that I'm having is there is the lack of stock and size of the place. They didn't stock any XL senior helmets for me to try on which is a necessity for me since it's going to be a nightmare for me to get a complete set of gear that fits me properly. The second issue is the size. I know that it's not reasonable to expect a LHS shop the size of a Dick's Sporting Goods in Birmingham, Alabama but the one here at the municipal rink is about the size of my bedroom with a good third of the space devoted the figure skating gear. There is not enough room in it to sit down to try on skates or shin pads. Third is brand selection: 95% of their gear is Bauer or CCM, they don't even have an account with Warrior which is an issue since the minor league team in the building is in the SPHL in which the official equipment company of the league is them. The other major issue with it is that the two ladies who run the shop I believe have figure skating backgrounds and have never played hockey in their lives. As a new player who is big & tall, I need the old man from Mighty Ducks or some grumpy ex-player with a mullet to give me advice and be able to help figure out what gear will work for me. As others have mentioned above, the lack of marketing isn't helping them; they don't even have a Facebook page. If they even had that where you could be notified when they get a shipment of something in would be nice or be able to IM them to ask if they have something in stock.

If they did set up Ecommerce or the very least a social media presence, that would immensely help. It looks like I'm gonna have to drive to Atlanta to get fitted for different gear and to pick people's brains. We need to keep these stores in business. If they go out, I'd have to drive to Huntsville (almost two hours) to get skates sharpened or to be able to try anything on or buy something in person.

You're from Michigan, right?

Sounds like you need a trip back home to "visit family".  :-)

Mark

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Yeah, that may have to happen. I did call a couple shops "back home" looking for equipment in oddball sizes (see my other thread) and even they didn't have skates in my size.

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On 1/6/2018 at 2:27 AM, CigarScott said:

I try to buy local when possible and when the costs are in the same ballpark; I'm not going to pay $400 for something that I can get for $200 online but I'd pay $225 for it. It appears that my LHS has prices comparable to the online folks so that's cool. The issue that I'm having is there is the lack of stock and size of the place. They didn't stock any XL senior helmets for me to try on which is a necessity for me since it's going to be a nightmare for me to get a complete set of gear that fits me properly. The second issue is the size. I know that it's not reasonable to expect a LHS shop the size of a Dick's Sporting Goods in Birmingham, Alabama but the one here at the municipal rink is about the size of my bedroom with a good third of the space devoted the figure skating gear. There is not enough room in it to sit down to try on skates or shin pads. Third is brand selection: 95% of their gear is Bauer or CCM, they don't even have an account with Warrior which is an issue since the minor league team in the building is in the SPHL in which the official equipment company of the league is them. The other major issue with it is that the two ladies who run the shop I believe have figure skating backgrounds and have never played hockey in their lives. As a new player who is big & tall, I need the old man from Mighty Ducks or some grumpy ex-player with a mullet to give me advice and be able to help figure out what gear will work for me. As others have mentioned above, the lack of marketing isn't helping them; they don't even have a Facebook page. If they even had that where you could be notified when they get a shipment of something in would be nice or be able to IM them to ask if they have something in stock.

If they did set up Ecommerce or the very least a social media presence, that would immensely help. It looks like I'm gonna have to drive to Atlanta to get fitted for different gear and to pick people's brains. We need to keep these stores in business. If they go out, I'd have to drive to Huntsville (almost two hours) to get skates sharpened or to be able to try anything on or buy something in person.

Hi , I think what we are experiencing is a situation we as the hockey consumers created.  What I'm saying is at one point the online hockey site and the lhs coexisisted. 

  Then I think what happened was not by any intention;  The consumer  started buying more and more from the e commerce sites for large ticket items . Then this cut down the lhs volume , low volume means less buying power the result is paying more there for having to charge more ..     So the consumer says I'm not paying that  . Then they go online where there is next to no expertise.  Then big box stores where there is about the same expertise 

 Now we are saying: The nearest lhs is 60 miles away, they have low stock , I can't get a good sharpen , I have to order skates and get multiple sizes to get a good fit  and send back the others . The product isn't as expected.   

So ultimately everyone shot them selves in the foot to save (in the beginning a marginal amount of money)   . It didn't correate every time I buy at the lhs I'm insuring that the expertise is available to me . That didn't register.    Then as an argument I hear they have inconsistent sharpening. The reason the owner can't afford good help . 

The economics of sharpening:  when you see a three head blade master and custom radious equipment that is about $16,000 of equipment.   That's alot of $5-10 sharpening.   

We made the bed 

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