Keeping the local hockey shops alive

[Playmakersedge 58]

I have noticed in other discussions that there seams to be a shrinking of the amount of lhs and folks are having trouble getting properly fitted for skates and other services.  

What can we do to revive the lhs . How can we as lovers of the game keep such an important, necessary part of that around ? 

[chocks86 82]

By limiting what you buy online. I love to get my hands on the skates, sticks, gloves, and protective gear and try them on / out. If I spend a lot of time in the store trying stuff, I will usually buy it from them. Plus I don't like to pay for shipping and definitely don't like waiting for things in the mail. I'm a little bit impatient some times. 

[215BroadStBullies610 434]

Near impossible to do with deals out there between big box stores having huger e-commerce presences and third party sites (eBay, Sideline Swap, our very own MSH Gear Exchange, etc.). Topple that off with the pro stock market, no way LHSs can keep up with all that. What they need to focus on is customer services and provide top-notch maintenance for hockey equipment.  

[caveman27 208]

Part of it is wanting to buy from a store that has competitive prices. 

Larger businesses leverage their size to sell on a national level. If you have a small or medium store, you can only have so much in inventory. Too much inventory and you have unsold product at the end of a season. Too little inventory and no one wants to buy from your store. Your customers are basically the hockey players in the local areas. Cities can have bigger stores and can even try to have an ecommerce site to leverage their size. Guys from small towns might want to go to a big city store in lieu of online and local hockey store. I will travel to these far-away hockey-only stores. Local hockey store has a limited inventory. Online store only has pictures.

So, in order to be competitive, the local hockey stores need to price match, which can eat away at the profit margin, but will allow them to be competitive. There's no need to special order anything from a small store because you can always buy something from an online store, usually. That's a disadvantage for the local hockey store.

The only thing a local hockey store can leverage for their advantage is service, like custom sharpening, skate baking, equipment fitting, and stuff to get on the fly, like tape, water bottle, laces, sticks.

[strosedefence34 175]

nevermind not worth it...

[IPv6Freely 2082]

Disclaimer: I'm primarily a goalie at this point who wears almost nothing that can be purchased at retail, so that skews my opinions a bit. 

A few things cover my general feelings:

1. Give me a reason to not shop online. Whatever that entails. Whether that's customer service, or actually carrying what I'm looking for (which I know is a significant battle for the stores - they can't keep unlimited stock of everything, it's just not feasible). I truly do not have a problem paying a bit more locally for some things as long as it's a reasonable amount. I look at that like... I'm paying an extra 5-10% to get it in my hands right this second, which is fair to me.
2. Provide good pro shop services. This means you need to do a good job sharpening, you need to be quick within reason (I'm not dropping my skates off and coming back later), and you need to actually have stable sharpening hours. 
3. Be local. This one is out of their control but the farther away your store is, the less likely I am to shop there. 

Unfortunately all three of these things is an issue where I live. The only store within an hour is Tron (less than 10 minutes) but I will not shop there. The couple of pro shops around here all produce crap sharpening or have wonky hours. The big box stores are nice to check new gear out but I rarely buy from them. I always go up with a plan of what I want to try on, and then decide what I like and take that information home and do more research, look at reviews, etc. Then I usually buy online.

Monkey makes the same whether I buy in store or online so I don't really feel all that bad about it. I feel its important to do my research before buying and I don't see myself driving over an hour to go back to the store to make the purchase just for warm fuzzies. If there was an IW locally I'd likely buy everything in person, but they aren't. Their free overnight shipping and the customer service from @IW Team - Chase is the reason I keep going back to them.

In summary, for me personally, I couldn't care less if the LHS becomes a thing of the past. I have a Sparx because the LHS was unable to provide that service, and I have IW (and Monkey, and Pure, in that order) to get my stuff from online. Being able to try stuff on in the store is nice but its super inconvenient for me. Now to be clear, if there was a LHS locally my tune might be different, but as it is I don't really need them.

 

[NiCnoK 61]

Now that we have a vending machine for tape, I have absolutely no need for a LHS.

They can go the way of the video rental store for all I care.

[puckpilot 312]

For me, one of the biggest things, IMHO, a LHS can do for themselves is get a good website going. I find one of the best ways for the local stores to get me to go in is if I can view their inventory online. Basically shop from home and go in to checkout in person, or if I wanted to, buy online and pick up.

This brings me to the second thing, IMHO, which someone mentioned above, train your sharpeners properly and give good sharpening. While I wait for my skates, I walk around the store and shop. I stopped going to a store that I frequented for over twenty years because they screwed up my skates twice, giving me some unconvincing BS as to why my edges were messed up.

The shop I goto is across the city from where I live. There are at least 3 other LHS between me an it. The reason I go, aside from customer service, is because, one,  they've never messed up my skates no matter how busy they were. And two, before I make the trip, I can check online to see what sales they have and what their inventory is like on stuff I'm eyeing. It takes more time to travel there, but I think I also save time because I can plan the trip to coincide with picking up/ checking out some new piece of equipment without fear of them not having it in stock to look at.

[Davideo 99]

In addition to maintenance, sharpening, etc., I see at least two areas where LHS are still important. Skates, where fit is critical and manufacturers often change the fit or change the lines. And new/novice players who don't know exactly what gear they need, what size, etc., and need a little more hand holding.

Many posters I think are like myself, an adult who has been playing for years and with the previously mentioned exception of skates, know what we want and what size we want.

That being said, when I lived near a LHS I would support them when the pricing wasn't much different as they are convenient. However, it's now 4 hours to the nearest one and aside from skates a few years ago, I'm online only.

[bondoao1 8]

My nearest LHS is 1 hour drive north. Luckily they are Ice Warehouse, so I can either make the drive if i'm getting skates or something like that or order online if I'm too lazy to drive. They don't sharpen skates, but the rink I play at does but the quality varies depending on who is doing the sharpening. 

[chippa13 1844]

I only trust my sharpenings to one LHS that I've frequented since my earliest days. It will be a sad day when they finally succomb to the new world.

[ginjaninja 19]

We have one rink for 200K people and no local hockey store.  The rink carries things like tape, wax, and youth equipment.  Have to drive to Portland and all they have are two very small stores.  Online and within the community are our only options.  I wish there was a good local store to keep going.

[penalty box hero 4]

2 hours ago, Davideo said:

In addition to maintenance, sharpening, etc., I see at least two areas where LHS are still important. Skates, where fit is critical and manufacturers often change the fit or change the lines. And new/novice players who don't know exactly what gear they need, what size, etc., and need a little more hand holding.

I think there's a lot of truth to this... so building on this in response to the OP question, I would say, the best bet for survival of the LHS might be found in growing the game, especially with kids.  Partner with local rinks and hockey clubs to help provide opportunities for kids to get into the game, even if only at break-even point providing gear for learn-to-play programs and such - not only does it help grow the consumer base, but kids grow fast and need new gear relatively often, and as parents, we're not putting our kids out there in skates that don't fit right, or looking to save money on helmets... 

No reason they can't do the same with local leagues that offer D-level adult beginner leagues, although adult players might be quicker to stray to online retailers to save a few bucks, and with the higher prices and larger selection of senior size gear out there, I suppose inventory management might be more challenging than with kids' gear - but a limited selection of the most common and mid-priced gear could probably help with that, especially for guys who are just getting into the game or want to upgrade shortly thereafter - who you would be targeting as customers, if you're helping them get into the game.

Also on adult gear, maybe avoid stocking up on top of the line sticks in every model by every manufacturer?  That top dollar stuff is where we're going online to buy because even if we're only avoiding local sales taxes, that's $20-$30 worth saving for most of us.  Then factor in the leverage that the big-box guys have - how do you compete with that?  You don't..  so, choose your battles wisely.

TL/DR: focus more on outfitting new players, and less on trying to be the equipment provider for the local pros.

[marka 518]

Howdy,

I wonder if the future of the LHS is as a customer service arm of the online retailer.  I.e. have stuff to try on / touch & feel, but except for very high demand stuff, don't stock it.  Order it and get it in a couple days.  Then carry emergency / consumables like tape, wax, laces, and some limited steel.  Plus the skate fixing / fitting / sharpening stuff.

Speaking of, the other day when I got my foot scanned at the "local" Pure Hockey, it said 7EE Supreme.  I was mostly just interested in the scanning, so it didn't matter to me, but I looked and as near as I could tell, they didn't have a single 7EE skate in stock.  That makes it awfully hard to sell me that skate, if I can't try it on...

Mark

[Playmakersedge 58]

9 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

Disclaimer: I'm primarily a goalie at this point who wears almost nothing that can be purchased at retail, so that skews my opinions a bit. 

A few things cover my general feelings:

1. Give me a reason to not shop online. Whatever that entails. Whether that's customer service, or actually carrying what I'm looking for (which I know is a significant battle for the stores - they can't keep unlimited stock of everything, it's just not feasible). I truly do not have a problem paying a bit more locally for some things as long as it's a reasonable amount. I look at that like... I'm paying an extra 5-10% to get it in my hands right this second, which is fair to me.
2. Provide good pro shop services. This means you need to do a good job sharpening, you need to be quick within reason (I'm not dropping my skates off and coming back later), and you need to actually have stable sharpening hours. 
3. Be local. This one is out of their control but the farther away your store is, the less likely I am to shop there. 

Unfortunately all three of these things is an issue where I live. The only store within an hour is Tron (less than 10 minutes) but I will not shop there. The couple of pro shops around here all produce crap sharpening or have wonky hours. The big box stores are nice to check new gear out but I rarely buy from them. I always go up with a plan of what I want to try on, and then decide what I like and take that information home and do more research, look at reviews, etc. Then I usually buy online.

Monkey makes the same whether I buy in store or online so I don't really feel all that bad about it. I feel its important to do my research before buying and I don't see myself driving over an hour to go back to the store to make the purchase just for warm fuzzies. If there was an IW locally I'd likely buy everything in person, but they aren't. Their free overnight shipping and the customer service from @IW Team - Chase is the reason I keep going back to them.

In summary, for me personally, I couldn't care less if the LHS becomes a thing of the past. I have a Sparx because the LHS was unable to provide that service, and I have IW (and Monkey, and Pure, in that order) to get my stuff from online. Being able to try stuff on in the store is nice but its super inconvenient for me. Now to be clear, if there was a LHS locally my tune might be different, but as it is I don't really need them.

 

You have good points. Distance, quality, knowledge.. .. see when I refer to a local lhs I mean good  sharpening, knowledge, and regular hours ... My question is did the good lhs get trounced by the box store and now there is the want to be lhs an hour away.  As I said  growing up we had 3 small cities each with a youth hockey program 30 minutes appart.  And the area supported two lhs .  Now the suburbs have programs and rinks  ,4 times the hockey played and no lhs .  They both dig acceptable to good sharpening and if they didn't have it it got ordered.   They were doing well now they don't exist.  In theory they should have had to expand to accommodate the growth of the sport in the area. Instead the opposite.    I have to think it was the box store.     

[IPv6Freely 2082]

1 minute ago, Playmakersedge said:

You have good points. Distance, quality, knowledge.. .. see when I refer to a local lhs I mean good  sharpening, knowledge, and regular hours ... My question is did the good lhs get trounced by the box store and now there is the want to be lhs an hour away.  As I said  growing up we had 3 small cities each with a youth hockey program 30 minutes appart.  And the area supported two lhs .  Now the suburbs have programs and rinks  ,4 times the hockey played and no lhs .  They both dig acceptable to good sharpening and if they didn't have it it got ordered.   They were doing well now they don't exist.  In theory they should have had to expand to accommodate the growth of the sport in the area. Instead the opposite.    I have to think it was the box store.     

There has never been a small local shop here.

[Playmakersedge 58]

5 hours ago, bondoao1 said:

My nearest LHS is 1 hour drive north. Luckily they are Ice Warehouse, so I can either make the drive if i'm getting skates or something like that or order online if I'm too lazy to drive. They don't sharpen skates, but the rink I play at does but the quality varies depending on who is doing the sharpening. 

It has always been pretty much a given that a rink sharpening is gonna suck, and goofy hours . The only rink I have been too that can sharpen is South Windsor arena and the rink is the lhs .And they are excellent.  

As general rule rink will ruin your blades. 

[Playmakersedge 58]

5 minutes ago, IPv6Freely said:

There has never been a small local shop here.

Wow ,that's just amazing to me . 

[Playmakersedge 58]

1 hour ago, marka said:

Howdy,

I wonder if the future of the LHS is as a customer service arm of the online retailer.  I.e. have stuff to try on / touch & feel, but except for very high demand stuff, don't stock it.  Order it and get it in a couple days.  Then carry emergency / consumables like tape, wax, laces, and some limited steel.  Plus the skate fixing / fitting / sharpening stuff.

Speaking of, the other day when I got my foot scanned at the "local" Pure Hockey, it said 7EE Supreme.  I was mostly just interested in the scanning, so it didn't matter to me, but I looked and as near as I could tell, they didn't have a single 7EE skate in stock.  That makes it awfully hard to sell me that skate, if I can't try it on...

Mark

Mark , the lhs used to have all the common size of everything.  And if you were not in the common , you spoke to the owner and talk about what you want to try on . For me they would order from there supplier a bunch of skates . I tried everything on walk in them .some were discarded right away.  The possible candidates would get sharpened I walked out with a few pair and went to the next public skate session and tried them . Picked what worked best and returned the others.  There supplier took them back. After my feet were done growing I ordered a second pair  if I really liked them  .   In two days 3 days max .    It was about a 25 minute ride to either shop 

[stick9 881]

14 minutes ago, Playmakersedge said:

Mark , the lhs used to have all the common size of everything.  And if you were not in the common , you spoke to the owner and talk about what you want to try on . For me they would order from there supplier a bunch of skates . I tried everything on walk in them .some were discarded right away.  The possible candidates would get sharpened I walked out with a few pair and went to the next public skate session and tried them . Picked what worked best and returned the others.  There supplier took them back. After my feet were done growing I ordered a second pair  if I really liked them  .   In two days 3 days max .    It was about a 25 minute ride to either shop 

How many years ago was this? Leaving with a pile of skates to try only to return what doesn’t work sounds awfully 1980’s. 

Mark, the scanner shouldnt take store inventory into account. That would delegitimize the usefulness of the tool. After all, it’s a fitting tool, not a skate selling tool.

 

[Playmakersedge 58]

13 hours ago, 215BroadStBullies610 said:

Near impossible to do with deals out there between big box stores having huger e-commerce presences and third party sites (eBay, Sideline Swap, our very own MSH Gear Exchange, etc.). Topple that off with the pro stock market, no way LHSs can keep up with all that. What they need to focus on is customer services and provide top-notch maintenance for hockey equipment.  

Your point are valid.  Hear me out , doing only skate servicing and selling tape and laces ,etc . There is not enough to survive on . They need the sale of skates, shoulder pads ,elbow pads,helmets, cages etc .  This is what I'm trying to say . To save a couple bucks hear and their people are going to on line or big box store to get the best  deal.   Doing this is going to create a situation in the the person you need to service your equipment won't be there. So there won't be good sharpening service or blade change service.    Gotta let them eat . You will get other benefits from it  . Like my self walking out of the shop with 4 -6 pair of skates on trust .

[Playmakersedge 58]

54 minutes ago, stick9 said:

How many years ago was this? Leaving with a pile of skates to try only to return what doesn’t work sounds awfully 1980’s. 

Mark, the scanner shouldnt take store inventory into account. That would delegitimize the usefulness of the tool. After all, it’s a fitting tool, not a skate selling tool.

 

80's to early 90's   the guy got all my business minus sharpening. And when I ask questions about a band he thought I would destroy, he would say you don't want those you will destroy them .  I was a kid . He treated me like a pear .  

[Playmakersedge 58]

Me building my own sharpener was more about building it then needing it . The machine aspect of it fastenated me . 

[Playmakersedge 58]

My dream is to have a warehouse building.  That has a pro shop as you come in  ,then 4 nets shooting tile lanes ,a strength, balance and agility area , an artificial ice surface  probably about the amount of space that' between the blue lines . ,on the back wall  ,spinning bikes, my skating machine  ,slide boards, all movements video for adjustment.  . I want to have some stations to work reflexes either with strobe lights or laser pointers. Radar gun for shooting.   Create a hockey factory. 

At pro shop people can test sticks and skates.   

I can get this kind of square footage for around 2.50 square foot  

[Playmakersedge 58]

1 hour ago, stick9 said:

How many years ago was this? Leaving with a pile of skates to try only to return what doesn’t work sounds awfully 1980’s. 

Mark, the scanner shouldnt take store inventory into account. That would delegitimize the usefulness of the tool. After all, it’s a fitting tool, not a skate selling tool.

 

There supplier was primarily great skate.  Great skate had deliveries there a couple times a week.  So the skates I didn't want got returned .