"Malleable" composite skates - Video or photo examples?

[dante_p 1]

Hello. I'm a long-time lurker, so I don't think this question has been answered. I apologize if it has. I doubly apologize if it's an unanswerable question. I had a hard time even articulating it.

Would it be possible for any of the experienced skate fitters / tinkerers to post some video or pictorial examples of what a top of the line, current retail skate looks or feels like when the composite material has been heated to the point of maximum "malleability" or "softness"? I know that's a difficult thing to capture on film, so even a really clear, explicit verbal description of how to judge the limits of a particular skate (e.g., AS1, 2017 1X, 70K, etc.) would be incredibly appreciated. Some of the True videos (not directly comparable to CCM and Bauer) show quick squeezes, etc. of the boot. Especially the eyelet adjustment vids. I haven't been able to find anything like that for other current skates.

I've skated in both Mako IIs and Trues, which are obviously VERY malleable. I don't expect that from CCM and Bauer, but I've seen comments that describe a level of malleability in their top skates that I have not yet experienced. When someone describes heat-gunning under the ankle and having someone stand on the side of the boot while you wear it to reduce negative space, my heart tells me to leave work immediately and dig out my heat gun. My head, however, tells me that I have never felt my AS1s or 1Xs soft enough to mold under any pressure, let alone my tiny wife's body weight. Bummer!

I've certainly felt the interior foam mold, but I've yet to feel the shape of the boot ever do much. When someone says that the AS1 boot is startlingly soft when hot - to the point of leaving dimples when pressed firmly - it makes me wonder if my LHS is being too conservative with the bake. I've cooked the sh-- out of my Mako IIs in my home oven and repeatedly heat-gunned my Trues, but those companies actively encourage that. CCM and Bauer, however, write the instructions in such a way that makes it sound like the skates will burst into flames if they're in the oven for a second longer than 2 or 3 minutes. Obviously they won't, since this forum keeps giving me tantalizing glimpses into a world of extra-long bakes and aggressive heat-gunning, but I totally understand why a less experienced LHS employee might be uncomfortable pushing the envelope. I sure as hell am! The problem for me (and possibly my LHS) is that I don't have anything to compare to. I don't have something I can look at and say, "Oh, THAT is what everyone means when they say the AS1s/1Xs/70Ks are soft when hot." Being able to see that would help a ton, especially if I am expecting too much. I don't want to try to achieve an unrealistic level of malleability and ruin the skates.

Any reference at all would be much appreciated. Thank you.

Edited November 1, 2018 by dante_p

[Vet88 673]

I have 2 pairs of one100's that I use for training. The pair that is the right size I have heated these and had my son stand on them (the others are 2 sizes to big for me and I haven't touched these but still train in them). I have pics (that I have posted somewhere here previously) that show how I took a Supreme heel and turned it into a Vapour heel. I'm talking around 1cm+ movement of the boot under the ankle area inwards. All I do is heat the area for around 3 minutes with a heat gun, always keeping the gun moving over the area. That time has come from experience, just doing dozens of boots to help others with their fit. If the material starts to bubble (for example apx2's have this issue with their shiny plasticky film outer layer) then either the boot is getting too hot or you have left the heat for too long on one spot. Will the boot feel like a sponge under your thumb, no. Will it move when sufficient pressure is applied to it, yes. Put it like this, I doubt you will ever do any damage to a boot by under heating it. if it doesn't seem to move or be as soft as you think it should be then heat it for a little bit longer the next time you try.

[dante_p 1]

That is an excellent description. Thank you for taking the time to write it up. It sounds like there's a lot of feel involved, developed from experience, but just knowing that the boot will move is very helpful. Your mention of training skates is interesting. I might go out and find a destroyed skate, somewhere, to screw around with. Thank you, again.

[Vet88 673]

17 hours ago, dante_p said:

Your mention of training skates is interesting. I might go out and find a destroyed skate, somewhere, to screw around with. Thank you, again.

This in itself I find to be a very interesting and challenging process. Proprioception, this was one of the primary reasons of why I started to train with no laces. Now I've pushed that to skating in boots that are up to 2 sizes to big for me or have been radically altered. I have an old pair of Graf Ultras, I cut off the top of the boot (down to the 4th eyelet up from the bottom) so it's now like a very low cut running shoe in shape. It is interesting to skate in to say the least but it sure as hell creates a great work out for the ankles / lower leg muscles and your balance skills.