Thinking of changing to Reebok pads blocker glove

[ultramany121 0]

So i've been using Vaughn 7500 pro series pads and glove + blocker, but the pads are worn down so I am going to buy a new goalie set. Since I play everyday I am looking for pro level pads with somewhat decent durability, my friends have recommended the Revokes or the Premier III series. What i'm wondering is can anyone do a quick review of both with a few questions in mind. I play aaa hockey so the speed of the game is high and I am interested in the specific customization options which might help me maximize my ability, does the different breaks actually differ in feeling (drastically?) and if so then how in each version, has anyone tried the 3d calf wrap, what difference does the different angles on the gloves make, also the difference between one piece cuff and the two piece, the durability on either the p3 or the revokes, I base my game around my butterfly but I do enjoy mobility, whichc pad and options would fit my style best? Thanks

[McDougalfaschnitzer 32]

I can chime in a little based off my experiences.

With Reebok pads I feel like they aren't a part of my leg, and I prefer to have some kind of leg channel in my pads. The leg pads will "last" longer because the foams don't really break down at all, especially at the boot break. The single break, double break, no break depends on how your butterfly is and what you are comfortable in. I've used no break and double break, and it didn't really change much for me since I didn't really need the double break. While playing, I didn't notice the difference of the 3d calf wrap/not having it.

The glove and blocker will wear just like any other brand, so it all comes down to what feels good for you. That also pertains to the angle of the trapper's break. I haven't had the chance to try the different angles so I can't really comment. Personally, I much prefer the two piece cuff on the glove over the one piece. While in stance, the one piece made the glove feel very front heavy to me, and since it didn't give as much as the two piece, it felt like it was a little too separated from my hand.

With that being said, did you like your Vaughn stuff, or was there something you didn't like?

[Law Goalie 147]

To reiterate what McD said (all of which is spot-on), there is a fundamental difference between the way your Vaughn pads behave on your leg, and the way Reeboks behave; there is a concomitant difference in how the pads wear with use.

Because your Velocities were stuffed with shredded low-density foam packed around a few sheets of stiff high-density foam, the core of the pad will 'break down' in two ways: the HD plates will settle lower in the pad, and the shred-pack foam will settle around them. This is why many people claim that Velocity pads 'shrink' over time, and sometimes order them 1"-2" oversized. What this relatively soft design means is that the pad will move with your leg (bending, twisting, etc.) to a large extent, and will 'break in' and conform to your leg over time. That, in a nutshell, is why the Velocity behaves the way it does.

As McD suggested, you need to think of Reeboks as being a solid immovable object from the knee down -- they are. An extremely large, powerful goalie (we're talking a 200+lbs professional) who uses his pads hard will eventually twist the boot a little, but only at some cost to his body. The Lefebvre/Reebok design doesn't break in - it breaks YOU in. The shin is constructed of several layers of very high-density foam laminated at right-angles to an EPE (expanded polyethylene) core to form a basically immovable plank. The boot, as I mentioned, is a little softer, but still three to four times stiffer than a Velocity boot. The boot-break is basically an illusion: you'll get maybe three degrees of movement, if any, based on the material tolerance, and it will never break down. So instead of pad that moves with your leg, a Reebok is a pad that is designed to float in front of your leg.

There's one other major difference that has to do with the way the pad behaves on the ice in the butterfly, and how it wears as a result. The Velocity uses a square medial (inside) gusset, so it presents a flat surface to the ice in the butterfly. Lefebvre, since well before he joined Reebok, has always preferred a round medial gusset, also known as a medial roll. You will notice that the Reebok design slides just a little faster and feels just a little more unstable in the butterfly - like it wants to tip forwards or backwards a little. The big difference, however, is in the wear pattern. Velocities always wear along the front edge where the face of the pad meets the medial gusset, and that corner will eventually wear down the Jenpro (synthetic leather) face of the pad. With Reeboks, on the other hand, the wear doesn't happen there, since the round surface doesn't have a corner. Reeboks wear *severely* on the medial binding of the boot, where all pads rub on the ice both in the stance, in the butterfly, and in transitioning between them. If you look at used Reeboks, they often look like some kind of small animal has torn the pads open to make a nest along the inside of the boot - it's torn to heck. This wear can, however, be easily prevented by extending the Jenpro toe-binding all the way around to up under the calf-wing: if Reebok won't do this for you, any competent repair shop can. Then, it's simply a matter of diligently replacing this Jenpro binding whenever it wears.

There are ways to make Reeboks feel a little more like a Velocity pad. I've used both the Premier series and the Revokes, and while they are basically the same pad, there are some subtly appreciable differences. The supposedly deeper leg and boot channel of the Revokes is not one of these - I didn't notice it at all, even having modified my P2's to have a perfectly flat boot - but the Revoke's elastic calf-cradle (which Reebok calls a 'wing wrap') does make the pad 'float' a little closer to the leg in the stance, making it feel a little more like a Velocity. If you liked the way your Velocities wrapped around your knees in the butterfly, I would strongly suggest a double-break (aka the 'Turco break') on your Reeboks. With a single-break or a straight-angle Reebok, you'll never get the same kind of wrap around your knees, whether you achieve that in-game with a high strap at the top of your thigh, or gradually by bending the top of the pad over time (storing them upside-down, etc.)

Whichever Reebok pad you get, *insist* on the Jenpro-covered boot-wing (aka 'boot flap') and the Jenpro patch on the bottom of the calf-wrap. These are stock on the senior-level Revoke 9000s, but need to be specifically requested on any other model (last time I checked, anyway). This will not only allow you slide more easily, it also eliminates the #2 and #3 wear-spots on the Reebok design: again, look at anyused Reebok pad and you'll see what I mean.

As for the 3D calf, there are a couple of very good reasons NOT to get it. Firstly, it's not NHL-legal (which may be an issue if you keep playing at a high level), and secondly, it absolutely plays havoc with the ability of the pads to rotate fully to 90-degrees. The 3D calf actually forces the pad to tip forward from a neutral position. If you replace that foam in the calf-wing with a flat piece, the pad sits level. (Well, it's not quite that simple, but the 3D calf is the major contributor.) When your weight is squarely on the pad in the butterfly, this usually doesn't matter, but it certainly doesn't help; in less than perfect movements, it can be a real issue.

As for the gloves (breaks, T-angle, one- or two-piece cuff), you really have to get them on your hands. Describing the feel of a glove is maybe the hardest thing to do with respect to online goalie banter. I can say that I strongly prefer the one-piece - it feels more like my beloved TPS Bionic - but I did just demo the standard Revoke two-piece cuff glove in the MSH Summer Jam, and while I wasn't in love with it, it was certainly usable.

I hope that helps!

Echoing McD, I'd be interested to hear a little more about what you liked and disliked about the Velocity set. I'm also curious to know why you're so zeroed in on Reeboks as an alternative, and as an aside, what mask you're using/planning to use.

If you had some game footage, a training session, or a recruitment reel (or whatever) you could post, or one that's already online, that would also help us to get a better sense of what your style is.

[ultramany121 0]

Yea thanks a lot I will try to personally try out the reeboks, I actually play in Europe and the league I play in virtually translates to the america aaa (I'm pretty sure), but my vaughns have lost their stiffness and I really feel that I "sink" too much into my butterfly, the wear isn't the main issue, it's more of the fact that i'm 5'11 74kg and the vaughns are 33+1, the glove I was just interested in because i've noticed the different aspects reebok seems to emphasize, but i've also heard multiple complaints about the products. I would buy vaughns, but honestly I just like the look of the revokes and p3s because when I began playing I used 6ks when I was really young and those were the pads that helped me enjoy goaltending. Ill try to get someone to video tape my next private session and post, thanks alot, but just one more thing, how do you think the different material on the palm blocker rank on the durability?

[Law Goalie 147]

Neat -- whereabouts in Europe?

That feeling of 'sinking' in the butterfly is classic Velocity. The other issue I forgot to mention is that Vaughn's knee-stacks are relatively soft and flimsy, whereas Reebok uses a solid one-piece knee-block, and a much stiffer high-density knee-wing. You'll find that Reeboks offer just the bare minimum of cushioning and a maximum of support. In fact, Bryzgalov, Price, and tons of other guys have had Vaughn make them one-piece knee-blocks, exactly like Reebok's.

There was a well-documented problem with the plastic in Reebok's one-piece gloves cracking, but they've fixed it by going to a higher-density polyethylene.

If you have that feeling of comfort in Reeboks, I'd definitely give them another shot. A 'Pro Zone' Revoke or Premier pad will be like a perfect version of your old 6Ks.

As for the blocker palms, Reebok offers two, both synthetic. The first is Nash, which is sort of an ivory or light tan; the second is made of a product called Ultima Dry, which is grey in colour and somewhat thinner and lighter than Nash. Ultima is, however, much, much less durable, and its antimicrobial coating wears off really, really fast in blocker palms because of the amount of abrasion and sweat involved.

Personally, I love goatskin palms like on the old CCM Gatekeeper and Sherwood C10 blockers, but they're really hard to find, and you have to take very, very good care of them or they'll rot and fall apart in weeks. The best synthetic material is BS2100 Clarino, but it's hard to find, and even harder to find as pre-made palms. Eagle also used to make a Mustang blocker palm, as well as a few other exotic ones, but I think that stopped when Vaughn bought them. My advice would be to go with the Reebok Nash palm, and then maybe consider getting it repalmed down the road, since it's a hell of a lot cheaper than having two sets of gloves.

Definitely post that video if and when you have it; should be interesting.

[ultramany121 0]

Sorry I haven't posted in a while, i play in Swiss, but couldn't get a video taken in last session sorry. for now i'll post a picture here but I don't know how to... could someone tell me how to post pics

[Gwyren 0]

As for the 3D calf, there are a couple of very good reasons NOT to get it. Firstly, it's not NHL-legal (which may be an issue if you keep playing at a high level), and secondly, it absolutely plays havoc with the ability of the pads to rotate fully to 90-degrees. The 3D calf actually forces the pad to tip forward from a neutral position. If you replace that foam in the calf-wing with a flat piece, the pad sits level. (Well, it's not quite that simple, but the 3D calf is the major contributor.) When your weight is squarely on the pad in the butterfly, this usually doesn't matter, but it certainly doesn't help; in less than perfect movements, it can be a real issue.

Amen to all of that. I started playing with a pair of PS2s. It has taken a while but I feel I can ~finally~ play decently in them.

[SEagle30 0]

I have been using the RBK P2 for the last two seasons and I would have to say that I would not recommend any RBK product. The durability of the "pro series" equipment is BRUTAL! I've had to repair my glove, blocker, and knee cradles in the pads numerous times. Go with a Canadian or an American company like Smith or Brians. I personally went with Smith. I stopped by the shop, located in upstate NY, and I personally met with Pete Smith. Everything there is made by hand and he is very meticulous with what he does.

[ultramany121 0]

I have been using the RBK P2 for the last two seasons and I would have to say that I would not recommend any RBK product. The durability of the "pro series" equipment is BRUTAL! I've had to repair my glove, blocker, and knee cradles in the pads numerous times. Go with a Canadian or an American company like Smith or Brians. I personally went with Smith. I stopped by the shop, located in upstate NY, and I personally met with Pete Smith. Everything there is made by hand and he is very meticulous with what he does.

I just bought a pair of revokes, but ill still be using my Vaughn glove and blocker. Hopefully they hold up ok, but I can definitely get them repaired if anything goes wrong

[jimmy 194]

I'm sorry. What a bunch of BS. The RBK's don't "feel" any different than any other brand. It's all personal preference. Their durability is EXACTLY the same as all other brands. Pro gear is made of same materials. When will you goalies realize that regardless of the brand there is going to be some issues for some goalies. I had V1's. Their durability sucked compared to other gear I have owned. Does that mean Vaughn sucks. Nope. I used P1 gear for 3 years with no problems. Does that mean RBK is better. Nope. Stop micro-evaluating gear and just play goal. What a bunch of p----ies. It's sad what goaltending has evolved too.

[ultramany121 0]

I'm sorry. What a bunch of BS. The RBK's don't "feel" any different than any other brand. It's all personal preference. Their durability is EXACTLY the same as all other brands. Pro gear is made of same materials. When will you goalies realize that regardless of the brand there is going to be some issues for some goalies. I had V1's. Their durability sucked compared to other gear I have owned. Does that mean Vaughn sucks. Nope. I used P1 gear for 3 years with no problems. Does that mean RBK is better. Nope. Stop micro-evaluating gear and just play goal. What a bunch of p----ies. It's sad what goaltending has evolved too.

Yea i see what you are saying, i won't go that severe, but i just wanted some knowledge of experience because when i buy pads they are expensive so I want to make sure I get good pads with not too many problems, but I chose the revokes because I like the way they look anyway.

[Law Goalie 147]

I have been using the RBK P2 for the last two seasons and I would have to say that I would not recommend any RBK product. The durability of the "pro series" equipment is BRUTAL! I've had to repair my glove, blocker, and knee cradles in the pads numerous times. Go with a Canadian or an American company like Smith or Brians. I personally went with Smith. I stopped by the shop, located in upstate NY, and I personally met with Pete Smith. Everything there is made by hand and he is very meticulous with what he does.

It's great to hear that you had the chance to meet up with Pete (he's a terrific guy, and a true genius in the industry), but I don't think he'd run down Michel Lefebvre's Reebok products. True, Reebok has had the Revoke 'Pro' made offshore, but the 'Pro Zone' or PZ gear and all the pro equipment is being made in Lachenaie by the Lefebvre family shop, and the new Larceny line (formerly known as Kinetic Fit) is being made at Brian Heaton's old St.-Jean-sur-Richelieu plant. It would be a mistake to blow off Reebok's entire operation simply because they made some pads offshore - and made them extremely well, I might add, because of Lefebvre's personal oversight of the offshore operations.

I'm sorry. What a bunch of BS. The RBK's don't "feel" any different than any other brand. It's all personal preference. Their durability is EXACTLY the same as all other brands. Pro gear is made of same materials. When will you goalies realize that regardless of the brand there is going to be some issues for some goalies. I had V1's. Their durability sucked compared to other gear I have owned. Does that mean Vaughn sucks. Nope. I used P1 gear for 3 years with no problems. Does that mean RBK is better. Nope. Stop micro-evaluating gear and just play goal. What a bunch of p----ies. It's sad what goaltending has evolved too.

I was with you, mate, right up until "stop micro-evaluating." Seriously, take that away, and I'm a organ-grinder. :( Just wait until you read my 15 page Warrior review! Ahahahha....

[planegoalie 0]

Hi,

This is my first post on here as my regular goalie forum is pooched latley.

I was/am in a similar boat. I got a great deal on a RBK xpulse Pro spec set about 6 months ago. Being out of hockey for 8 years, I needed new gear quick and $500 for $1600 pads seemed great.

At the time I was my old style, what they call hybrid. As the months went on I have pretty much lost the hybrid and now I'm full butterfly.

My Xpulses are amazingly built, very similar to a Velo pad. But, they are soft and don't slide well or seal up a fivehole.

I played with a set of Pro Revokes and liked them but the build quality of the 9000s are weak and flimsy when compared.

I have decided to go with the Bauer one 80s. After looking and the quality and the function, I love these pads. They fit a little tighter than the Revokes, but still loose, are super light, and the internal breaks close the five hole great.

Check them out.

Cheers

[Harv 86]

I only own 1 piece of RBK equipment. Skate soakers.

And those are a total piece of s***.

[Law Goalie 147]

The soakers may suck, Harv, but a Reebok-branded Protechsport mask is the next best thing to an Armadilla.

plane, I'll second you on the One80s - they're an unbelievable pad for the money. The only thing I'd suggest is that there's very little difference in actual weight between pads these days. The Brian's Zero-G's are by far the lightest on the market, and they've only got about half a pound per pad on most. The real issue is, as with most gear, balance and personal preference. Reebok/Lefebvre pads are, when measured, a good bit heavier than almost everything else on the market, but they are extremely well-balanced. Most of the weight sits in the shin, poised just over the ankle-break. By contrast, a lot of pads are significantly boot-heavy: even though they're lighter overall, they feel heavier after an hour or so on the ice.

If you want an insanely light pad, have a set of Zero-G's made with a Cordura face, vertical roll and later gusset, an all-nylon leg-channel, a bare minimum of nylon quick-release straps (probably 3 per pad), no boot-strap, and no toe-bridge (ie. with the lace threaded directly through the toe of the pad). You could probably get under 3lbs per pad with that.

[planegoalie 0]

The soakers may suck, Harv, but a Reebok-branded Protechsport mask is the next best thing to an Armadilla.

plane, I'll second you on the One80s - they're an unbelievable pad for the money. The only thing I'd suggest is that there's very little difference in actual weight between pads these days. The Brian's Zero-G's are by far the lightest on the market, and they've only got about half a pound per pad on most. The real issue is, as with most gear, balance and personal preference. Reebok/Lefebvre pads are, when measured, a good bit heavier than almost everything else on the market, but they are extremely well-balanced. Most of the weight sits in the shin, poised just over the ankle-break. By contrast, a lot of pads are significantly boot-heavy: even though they're lighter overall, they feel heavier after an hour or so on the ice.

If you want an insanely light pad, have a set of Zero-G's made with a Cordura face, vertical roll and later gusset, an all-nylon leg-channel, a bare minimum of nylon quick-release straps (probably 3 per pad), no boot-strap, and no toe-bridge (ie. with the lace threaded directly through the toe of the pad). You could probably get under 3lbs per pad with that.

Law Goalie, I'd love a set of Zero G's, but they are 1500, the one 80s are $700. I'd like the one 100's but agian 1500. I want 2-3 years out of a pad. i figure the one 80s will do fine and have everything i want. Also they felt perfect on me.

[Law Goalie 147]

Believe me, I was not suggesting you should blow the doors off your budget. I'm glad to hear that the One80 works well for you and didn't break the bank. As I said, they're great pads - hell, it's a great set and a terrific retail deal. My personal preference would be to buy used pro-level equipment rather than even the best senior price-point gear, but that requires a great deal of effort and inconvenience to arrange.

I only meant to say that there's very little difference in weight between current pads, so your claim that the One80s are "super light" is somewhat misleading. They are very light relative to, say, pads from ten years ago, but not substantially lighter than anything else on the market. Almost every pad on the market for the last five or six years falls between 5 and 6lbs per pad for a 36" pad - the odd few might be down around 4.5lbs.

Instead, I suggest that what you may be perceiving as 'lightness' and 'perfection' is in fact balance - that is, that the balance of the One80 pads is very agreeable to you. Again, that's all to the good: finding a pad that's well-balanced for your stance and movement is tricky, and well worth the effort. I've recently discovered that Reebok/Lefebvre pads have great balance for me, and it was a real revelation.

The sole reason I mentioned the ZG pads was by way of illustrating one way you could - irrespective of cost - go about having a truly "super light" pad (ie. below 3lbs per pad at 36") from current current designs and current materials and with current construction methods. The main reason for this is that Brian's is using proprietary moulded foams and welding methods to eliminate all glues and excess stuffing from the body of the pad, and simultaneously eliminating many of the internal pockets that hold layers of foam on other pads. By making the modifications I suggest, you could get the weight even lower.

[planegoalie 0]

Intresting stuff.

Well my current pads are RBK Xpulse Pro Specs, the good ones made in Canada. Same design as what Ryan Miller is still using, 2 bootstapes, flat shin though. Anyway, they are indeed light, compared to 10 years ago, they are a 2008 pad. That said, i had them in my hands with the One 80's, One100s, and they were very noticably lighter. There is just less to them.

The lightest pad I have seen is Lundqvists 100s. My goalie shop has a pair of his pads (his spec, not a stock 100 at all), they are hard as a rock, non flexible, and have pretty much everything ripped out of them. Just pad, and a couple straps. That said, i cant see how anyone but Lundy could use those things.

The reason I want to go for top semi pro pad is two fold. One, knowing me, I will want something different after 3 years. So 750 vs 1500 is easier to swallow. Two, Jocks and Masks are where i spend the bigg$$. A $700 pad will not hurt anymore than a 1500 one. I took a look at the well made offshore pads after a couple years of play and they held up just fine for a guy who plays 3-6 tmes a week. If your playing Pro, Junior, or going to camps every week stopping 400 shots fine, but a Rec league / shinny skate guy faces 25-30 shots?

My pads were $1600 at the time. I got them new for $499. Thats a GREAT deal, and for a Hybrid pad, I cant think of a better option. The Import models of these pads SUCKED. Mine will last 10 years, the are tanks. But...The are not working for me. It does sting a little going one step down in quality, but I can live with it. Buy for 80% of use rent 20%.

[Law Goalie 147]

You need to bear in mind that the X-Pulse Pro-Spec was basically a Heaton 10, which, while a beautiful design, is decidedly toe-heavy because of the way it's constructed. An open-toe design not only necessitates adding a heavy plastic toe-cap and a much bigger and heavier toe-bridge than a One80 uses; the open-toe also adds a not insignificant amount of synthetic leather (eg. Jenpro) to the process. Add in the two relatively heavy-grade boot-straps, which double the strap-weight from the One80 and then some, and the fact that it has a longer boot than the One80s, it's pretty significant. An H10 is probably 1/2 to 3/4lbs per pad heavier on a scale than a One80, but because so much of that weight is in the toe, it will feel significantly heavier if you pick it up in your hands - unless, of course, you pick it up by the toe, in which case the One80 might feel a little 'heavier' because of how the knee is built.

Lundqvist's pads are a great demonstration of how much of the weight of a pad is in peripherals: straps, wraps, etc. They're actually (just for reference) a copy of a design he's been using since the TPS Exceeds. He got many of the ideas from Roloson's pads, apparently.

I completely agree with your prioritisation of mask and jock. As I alluded to previously, I'm expecting my new custom mask any day now from Michel Doganieri. I'd also add in C/A and neck-guard at the top of the list, since about the only ways you're going to suffer life-threatening injuries on the ice (provided you aren't wearing a salad bowl on your head) are by having your heart stopped by a shot (or a lung caved in), or having your throat crushed by a shot or slit by a skate.

I also agree that the quality of offshore gear is way, way better these days. As I said, I tried the Revoke Pros (not the Pro Zone), and they gave up very little in quality. I haven't used the One80s, only the One100s, but I have looked at the senior pads closely, and as I said, they look terrific for the money.

Having said that, my personal belief is that, generally speaking, the sweet-spot in the market for that kind of pad (crucial qualifier) is Pete Smith's $995 SP6000s. For that you get a custom pad built by the same guy who designed it, and which is a significant advance in the basic construction of pads.

Again, I'm not knocking retail. There is a huge benefit to being able to try things in a store and carry them home, rather than researching, maybe using a demo set for a couple of weeks in the middle of the season, and then putting your name on a waiting list.

I'm more or less stuck buying used, since nobody can make what I want anyway. Either way, I'd have to tear it down to foam, shell, and parts and build it up all over again. That's not to say, 'look at me, I'm so special', but only that I've found things that work for me that don't happen to be doable by any one company.

[McDougalfaschnitzer 32]

Lundqvist's pads are a great demonstration of how much of the weight of a pad is in peripherals: straps, wraps, etc. They're actually (just for reference) a copy of a design he's been using since the TPS Exceeds. He got many of the ideas from Roloson's pads, apparently.

I've found Lundqvist's Bauer stuff to be quite different than his TPS pads of the past. I've worn (Thanks to my brother) every generation of Lundqvist's spec TPS stuff, and when you look at how his Bauer pads are, it seems like weight elimination was a key for his Bauer pads.

The TPS pads had a lot of leg channel, with big nash pillows in the center to keep the pads close to your legs, and then the Y strap and leg wrap speak for themselves as been pretty different (and something Bauer probably couldn't legally do). If the Bauer pads took anything from the TPS pads, it would just be the front foam and shape, because there is barely a leg channel and no knee channel, which was probably taken out to make way for larger knee pads.

[Law Goalie 147]

Interesting-- I knew his glove had changed significantly (actually having a break with Bauer), but for some reason, I thought the pads were a clone. I think maybe what threw me was the shape of the calf-wing.

I also didn't know that's where your brother was getting his pads: neat idea. Was he picking up them up from team sales, or just ordering the pads from TPS to match Lundqvist's specs?

I believe TPS had a patent on the 'Arch' calf-wrap but not the Y-strap, since the buckle itself wasn't proprietary (just somewhat uncommon in its primary backpack industry). I've got them on my Reeboks now, with one prong as the boot-strap and one as the lower calf-strap.

[McDougalfaschnitzer 32]

The first set he got was a return set of the White X-Ceeds like he wore in the later half of his rookie year. The next set was the R8s which was pretty much the same xceed pad with the r8 knee block in the front (those were a custom order with different colors but the same spec as before). The R10s were a bit different in design, as it wasn't just the xceed pad. This was after boot risers were illegal, and I'm pretty sure that's why Lundqvist started lacing his boot strap around the back of his skates so that the pads would sit higher on his skates.

Anywho, here you can see the leg channel on Lundqvists TPS spec style:

And here is the Bauer Lundqvist spec: