Vaughn vm9500 or Bauer NME-7 ?

[ikolbyi 0]

I currently own a Vaughn vm7500 for 10 months and the first 6 months the mask was fine, but the last 4 months, the following started to happening:

* Paint chipping away upon puck impacts

* All impacts felt like someone slapped me across the face with their bare hand (slap shots from the point started to be felt more and more.)

The final straw was when I was diagnosed with a post-concussion from a shot to the head. I play in a 'beer league' once a week but 1/3 of the players are either D1 college or former/retired semi-pro players.

It's obvious I need a new goalie mask, the question is with a budget of $500, what would be my best option?

Vaughn vm9500 costs $500 and Bauer NME 7 costs $350. Both masks appear to have similar construction, is the cost delta worth it?

[Law Goalie 147]

You're asking two different questions.

Between those two masks, pick the one with the best fit. They're pretty comparable, respectable mid-range masks. You could also check out Sportmask and Eddy masks in that range, and Bauer and Reebok offer different fits too. The Hackva is definitely the best-made mask in that range - it's identical to an Itech/Bauer 960/961 in terms of construction.

However, for $500, you can do a lot better. There are several custom mask-makers, including one who makes masks for a good number of current NHL goalies, who produce a perfectly-fitted mask from better materials for that, or less.

My personal recommendation is always to Michel Doganieri at Protechsport, in part because of that body of professional work (he makes the vast majority of Reebok-branded NHL masks, except those few done by Promasque in Sweden, eg. Gustavsson) but also because of his long track-record of keeping we mere beer-swilling mortals safe. For $300 Canadian, he can make you a custom-fitted fibreglass mask: same one Jose Theodore is using right now. For $450, he can build in some Kevlar in the chin and forehead, and for $600, he can do genuine full Kevlar mask (not 'full kevlar' as in one full sheet plus lots of glass, but *all* Kevlar except for the finishing layers. I have the Kevlar, and I like how light it is and the tiny reduction in post-impact ringing, but it's almost universally agreed that the fibreglass mask is the best value anywhere in a mask. I'd pick between those two: the $450 is an option he kept getting asked for, but in his view, it's little better than the basic glass mask.

I also really like the word of Andre Rioux (dremask) and Shawn Schroeder (Custom Made Masks, who's notorious for his brilliant composite upgrades of the SK2000 shell), among the small custom builders. Those three are really the only ones left who can get you a custom mask for under a grand, let alone $500.

My advice is to put in an order with Michel, rest up for a few weeks (I think he's around a 4-6 week wait-time at the moment), make sure you're symptom free, and then never have to worry about it again. That $300 glass mask will last you the rest of your life with moderate care and a couple of padding refurbishments (which Michel also does), and maybe a couple of cage-changes.

Please note: I'm not slamming retail masks. They fill a vital portion of the market. Mass-produced masks are the only way to make certification worthwhile, and anyone playing minor hockey needs a certified mask (even though certification has absolutely nothing to do with the mask's protection against puck impacts, which is a problem with CSA/HECC, not the manufacturers), in addition to those who can't wait for the custom mask to be made. However, the converse is also true: because of certification and mass production/distribution, a custom mask at the same price-point can be vastly superior in materials and construction, and no mass-produced mask can possibly be as protective as a custom mask, unless you happen to fit perfectly in the retail mask.

[ikolbyi 0]

Thank you for the feedback. Given I don't really have a helmet at the moment, I might have to settle for an off the shelf product. I'm assuming you are referring to the Hackva 2608 Texalium as the best of the 3 choices: Vaughn vm9500, Bauer NME-7, and the Hackva 2608.

My current Vaughn vm7500 fits nice, but the price for the vm9500 compared to the Bauer NME-7 makes me wonder if the steep price for the Vaughn provides that much more added protection over the Bauer? I noticed the Bauer has more layers of foam over the Vaughn as well. I have no personal experience with the Hackva and no local store carries them....therefore I need to order it online sight unseen.

More feedback the better. I want this next purchase to be the correct one as best as possible and open to trying the Hackva. A negative with them (but not a deal breaker) is I can only find them with straight bar cages - I prefer certified cat-eye.

[Law Goalie 147]

Fair enough: custom does demand a certain luxury of time. If you find yourself stuck with more of a post-concussion layoff, it might be worthwhile.

Hackva only has one shell: texallium is just a cosmetic layer. It's definitely superior to the other two in terms of construction -- but fit is of paramount importance. It might be worth ordering one and potentially eating the return shipping fee as a 'fitting fee.' Definitely check out Sportmask and Eddy as well: they both have solid masks in that price range.

The amount of foam layers and the thickness of the foam have no bearing on protection. Most full custom masks have about 1/4". The foam is just there to mediate between the rigid shell and your skull to ensure a snug fit: the shell is what protects you. No amount of resilient foam is going to protect you from a puck impact; a collapsable foam like EPP can, but you'd have to get a new mask every time you got hit. (Once aspect of the total idiocy of the Itech 1200/1400/2500.)

I don't mean to second-guess, but some of the problems you described with your old mask might be symptomatic of a less than optimal fit. Proper fitting in a mask is not necessarily intuitive: there are a lot of former CHL goalies who are convinced that an Itech 960 fits them perfectly, simply because that's what their first EQM put them into. Take a look at the back of Price's mask: his head is way, way too long for that shell, but he won't switch. Shopping around is definitely a good idea.

I'm not sure whether Hackva ever offered certified cat-eyes (they're becoming less and less common) but if you contact Gabe, I'm sure he'd be able to send you one or figure something out. Customer service is a big plus with them. Having said that, I think you'll find your sightlines much improved with the Hackva straight-bar over any cert. cat-eye.

[lukejameslarson 5]

Unfortunately, I don't believe that Hackva has a certified cat-eye cage available, just the standard square certified, and then single and double bar cat-eye cages.

EDIT: Whoops... beaten to the punch, there.

[Thepandamancan 0]

If the NME7 fits you, it's a great mask. The foams are extremely comfortable and provide an amazing fit. Aside from a few slight rings here and there, it's a solid mask. However, I play in a beginner to intermediate roller league and I feel barely protected wearing it. It wasn't until I took a fluke, hard wrister that made me realize I could have done better. When I make the move to ice, I'll use it at first...but I'm gonna consider at least a hackva or spend a bit more for some of the other suggestions some had made. Bottom line, I think the NME7 is the baseline for what a protective mask should be...with your budget, you can do a lot better.

[Axxion89 32]

If you choose Hackva, don't waste your money on the Texallium finish, it chips off very easy, I know from experience. Also, it is on the heavy side the mask but its a tank, I have a review on it if you want more info.

[Law Goalie 147]

It's basically impossible to make a fibreglass mask light -- it's just woven glass, and glass weighs a lot. And a good quality steel cage isn't going to be light either.

If, like Hackva, you use good quality fibreglass, with single layers of carbon for stiffness and Kevlar (or Twaron, or any other aramid fibre) for strength, and a decent quality resin properly applied, the mask is going to weigh something. The only way to reduce the weight is to either spend considerably more on materials - replacing all but the top and botton layers of fibreglass with Kevlar - or to start compromising protection by reducing the number of glass layers or by replacing glass with something less protective like plastic, or just lower-quality glass -- or cheap out on the cage.

The *only* way to get around this is to use the methods that REY and NXI did, and that's very tricky to pull off.

I'm not convinced a light goalie mask is necessarily a good thing. The heavier the mask, the less a puck impact is going to move it: not by much, but where the brain is concerned, it can make a difference. One of the curious things is that Jose Theodore insists on having Protechsport make him masks of nothing but fibreglass, when, as a pro, cost is no object. When I was picking my mask I really dithered about this; I ended up going with an all-Kevlar mask simply because I wanted it to last the rest of my playing days, which it will.

I also completely forgot to mention Promasque. They aren't widely available at retail, but Matt makes a great shell, his airbag fitting system is very effective, and I've never heard anything but rave reviews of his work and service. Roloson will only wear his masks.

The other thing about Hackva and Protechsport (and many of the small builders) is that they either offer unconditional lifetime warranties on the shell, or simply stand behind what they make in a more general sense.

[ikolbyi 0]

Thank you for the feedback.

I kept going back and fort between the Vaughn vm9500 and Hackva (ruling out Bauer NME-7 since it was not a full Kevlar reinforced mask), I ended up buying the Hackva simply because I saved $70 for what appears to be equal protection and more people I talked to (including this post) voiced support for Hackva.

It's been 3 days and I'm still in recovery mode, hopefully I'll be ready to play when the mask arrives by UPS. Wish I knew this before I bought my "High impact shell is constructed in special high strength Lexan material that is custom engineered for greater impact resistance" vm7500 mask http://www.vaughnhockey.com/page.asp?id=131 Thanks Vaughn!

[Law Goalie 147]

Good decision. Let us know what the fit is like relative to the Vaughn; comparative fittings are always informative.

If for some reason the Hackva doesn't fit as well as you'd like, but you're totally sold on it otherwise and limited in what you can try and buy, you can trying call Gabe or Cindy (I believe that's her name) at Hackva and asking him for a few strips of foam to glue into the mask where it's loose. This would void the certification (though how the hell *adding* foam to a mask should be able to void the cert, I couldn't tell you) but it might not otherwise be a problem.