marketing hype or real

[habitants99 0]

i 'm really starting to beleive that the straight 80 set up is all hype. i feel if your center of gravity is raised you will lose stability. i see guys skating styles suffer when switching most guys i see on straight 80's seem a little off. i believe a skate that gets your center of gravity lower to floor will make you a better skater. if you want speed go to longer frame. if i could design a chassis i go with 76-72 hi low in customized size per boot size. ie a size 6 through 12 chassis instead of s, m. large size. any feedback?

[cj190 0]

I am not sure about the all 80m because I havent tried it, but I agree that frames cutomized to boot size would be very cool. Might be very expensive to manufacure though. Do you know if companies like mission do that?

[tryandstopme 35]

i'm all for a lower center of gravity. i love the Kuzak Split frame that uses a 76/68mm setup and wished they had slammed the frame even more to make it lower profile. a totally slammed Kuzak Split designed in concert with like the Low-Boy (dremelled boot outsole) technology would be one of teh best setups EV-AR!

[habitants99 0]

no i don't. i just bought red star e frame size large for a size 8 ccm vector boot. i just switched from a med. kuzak frame i found i prefer the longer chassis. the red star large is made for size 10 thru 12. that extra half inch in length has given me more leverage and control. customizing is the way to do if you ask me. i dont like any of the inline sktes that have been selling for past couple of years. ive been on ice hockey boots for last 5 years. last inline skate i bought were wicked light with vibe chassis. the chassis in my opinion suck and boot was comfortable and in my opion was the last decent boot made for inline.

i totally agree with you tryandstopme. i bet you thats the next big technology in inline saktes. i been on 76-68mm set up for last couple of weeks and have been loving it. i can turn, pivot, take off and stop a lot better.

[Jim A 4]

there is not a big difference size wise in the 80mm Labeda chassis when compared to older 76mm flat frames...they have made revisions to the boot, keeping that to a min..

nice to have different technologies on the market (flat old school, Labeda 80mm, Vanguard Hi-LO, previous Hi-Lo, Sprung, Rocker, etc)

most frames that used smaller wheels had a ton of room from the boot to top of the wheel..they were making them smaller to increase quickness and aid acceleration but at the expense of top end speed...

[G60 0]

i 'm really starting to beleive that the straight 80 set up is all hype. i feel if your center of gravity is raised you will lose stability. i believe a skate that gets your center of gravity lower to floor will make you a better skater.

sadly, your whole theory is for naught. the straight 80 labeda chassis is designed to use the 'DPS' cutout in the outsole to lower the center of gravity. nowhere in any of Tour's website or marketing product does it ever say anything about a higher center of gravity being better. heck, even one of tour's main points of purchase for the LO-Boy chassis is "Lower center of gravity = More Control, More Speed!

the DPS cutout is supposed to give the advantages of a straight 80 setup without the disadvantage of having to raise the center of gravity without it.

if you're going to try to design a new product to market, it would behoove you to actually know how the other products work before calling them 'hype'

[Rick 0]

I have wondered the same thing about the 80mm flat frame. I always preferred my Sure-Grip flat frame with 72mm wheels over the same frame with 76mm wheels or a Labeda Hi/Lo frame with 80mm in the back two positions and 72mm wheels in the front two positions. A flat frame with all 76mm wheels and my Labeda HI/LO frame just seemed to set me to high off of the surface.

When I tried the Red Star E-Frame I was shocked at how low to the ground I felt and how much more control and balance I seemed to have. I love the low profile of the E-Frame and I feel that I skate much better with it.

Rick Henry

[G60 0]

also keep in mind you can't have the boot *too* low to the ground or else it will be too easy for the boot to make contact with the ground and lose your edge.

[DamnLocust 0]

The reason a lot of guys lose their stride when making the switch to the hum'er chassis is pitch of the chassis. Mission and most hi-lo setups have a forward lean on their skates (on your toes), while the hum'er is more neutral (more on your heels).

The first few skates were awkward, as I felt I was on my heels coming from missions. even if i were to use all 72s on the frame, I'd wind up with that "on my heels" stance. Once you adjust to that feel, it's all gravy, and the tours are more stable and faster, and allow for more grip than anything else I've ever used.

If you want a Hum'er on your toes, get a heel lift installed. the height of the ball of your foot (where you want most of your weight to be ventered on anyway) will be changed such a small amount that you won't even notice it, but you'll gain that aggressive forward motion stance found on most hi-los.

[ATLstealth09 0]

You really must think a little more when you go off and accuse a form of chassis of throwing people off their game. the millimeter or two that the Labeda Hum'er frame adds to the toe does not throw off center of balance, but it changes the pitch a small amount. The difference it makes is between the type of skater/player you are. If you like to be on your toes for a little quicker turning, the Hi-Lo is for you.

I, like many bigger guys that use the Hum'er will agree that it is the best thing that it is one of the many great innovations in roller hockey. With bigger wheels in front, there is no longer toe slip when starting up. I feel that there is more room to dig in, and I won't need to be too cautious about leaning forward. With the greater leverage on the wheels and the greater contact patch, harder wheels can be used, even increasing the longevity and life of wheels. I'm a 5'9" 195 pound high school and tournament team player, and I used a set of Rink Rat Hot Shots in 80A for about four months, playing at least an hour every day.

The frame may throw off beginners or guys who have no power in the stride, but with a little bit of persistence, the chassis helps the game. I felt an noticeable increase in speed after a few sessions with my newly converted skates over the summer.

and to tryandstopme: any lower on that chassis, and you will be pushing off with the edges of your boot. Low is good, but not to the point that it looks like you're on Heely's playing hockey.

[tryandstopme 35]

and to tryandstopme: any lower on that chassis, and you will be pushing off with the edges of your boot. Low is good, but not to the point that it looks like you're on Heely's playing hockey.

heh! we'll have to agree to disagree on that. i think you can drop that setup a bit and not have any dragging. even on really hard power stops/starts i think you'd still have some room to spare before the boot hits.

the hummer is a phenomenal frame. trust me, if i didn't have ridiculously small feet i'd jump on a hummer frame and never look back.

[MDE3 0]

If someone wants to help me post a pic. I will show you a skate with a Hummer chassis and spacers added to keep the boot pitch the same as it was on the previous chassis(actually a Nexed 2 degree HiLo..also an excellent chassis).

Actually it was mounted on a Nike skate back in the spring of 2004 when the Hummers had just come out, and just before Tour released them to the public on their skates.

Because it was in mid season, I did not want to change the feel of the skate too much for my son, so I modified the mounting using both a heel spacer and a tapered front platform spacer.

As such the ball of the feet remained at exactly the same height and with the same upward pitch of the boot toe, as did the heel height above the floor. Thus the skate pitch remained identical, as well as the height...I ground out clearance for the front 80 mm wheels so the height of the balls of the feet off the floor did not change.

By using the spacers I was also able to move the chassis a bit farther forward, because the smaller chassis tended to only fit the boot if mounted farther back..so the rear wheel was significantly farther outside the boot than the front, if I had not use the spacers

[CSW1618 5]

heres my situation.. i got my wicked 3s a month before torhs thinking if i skated 3 times a week they should be broken in before torhs wintercup. Well that didnt happen.. loved the skates but i played both midgets and juniors and i knew my feet couldnt take that beating.. so i took my brothers tour e-2s for the tournament. Instead i threw on some 76mms in the front to have the forward lean. Now you might think thats a dumb idea but like DamnLocust said on the hummer you are pretty much on your heels. It took me about 2 games to get used to piviting and a few other minor things. Now when i throw on the 80s in front im completely used to them.

[DamnLocust 0]

tryandstopme - smaller size hum'ers run 76mm wheels, i believe it's 7 and below. a friend has code-1s with 76s.

MDE3- it's pretty easy to host your pics at imageshack.com, and then when you want to post them here, use the "add reply" button instead of the fast reply, and there's a button to use for links and for images.

[tryandstopme 35]

tryandstopme - smaller size hum'ers run 76mm wheels, i believe it's 7 and below. a friend has code-1s with 76s.

locust,

i wear a size 7.5 in tour skates so that puts me at the absolute smallest size that the all 80mm frames will work with. do the smaller size Hummers have a shorter wheelbase or did they just move the sole plates closer together? regardless, the gimmick of the Hummers is the all 80's so if i was going to run a 76mm straight frame i would pick the final force frames that you can get for like 10 bucks these days over the Hummer 76mm straight frame (especially if the wheelbase stays static between the small and large Hummer frames).

[DamnLocust 0]

I never really looked close enough to tell, but I'd think the humm'er would still bring you lower to the ground than a final force or other 76 straight setup due to the DPS channel. then again, it's seriously about two millimeters, and doesn't make much of a difference. I know on his red maxes he had 80s and his code 1s in the same size are 76, so they may have changed the size for the cutoff.

[MDE3 0]

heres my situation.. i got my wicked 3s a month before torhs thinking if i skated 3 times a week they should be broken in before torhs wintercup. Well that didnt happen.. loved the skates but i played both midgets and juniors and i knew my feet couldnt take that beating.. so i took my brothers tour e-2s for the tournament. Instead i threw on some 76mms in the front to have the forward lean. Now you might think thats a dumb idea but like DamnLocust said on the hummer you are pretty much on your heels. It took me about 2 games to get used to piviting and a few other minor things. Now when i throw on the 80s in front im completely used to them.

Just a thought....changing the two front wheels from 80 mm to 76 mm will make you skate on two wheels instead of four..is that a benefit where grip is important? Changing a single front wheel will not change the pitch feel unless you are always skating on just the front two wheels.

[tryandstopme 35]

I never really looked close enough to tell, but I'd think the humm'er would still bring you lower to the ground than a final force or other 76 straight setup due to the DPS channel. then again, it's seriously about two millimeters, and doesn't make much of a difference. I know on his red maxes he had 80s and his code 1s in the same size are 76, so they may have changed the size for the cutoff.

you're probably right, the Hummer would most likely be lower. unless the wheelbase changes considerably from the large to the small Hummer, the wheelbase on the Final Force would be WAY shorter tho. the 3 most important factors (for me at least) are low center of gravity, stability, and a nice short wheelbase.

[Dante2004 0]

If you get TOO low, your boots will hit the floor in your turns. I used to have a pair of CCM Tachs (970?) with the eXtra Hi-Lo chassis. 68-68-72-72 wheels. If you turned too sharp your boots would actually rub on the floor. Loved the skates otherwise though...

[ExitTwoEighty 7]

so it would be possible to buy a pair of tours, add some spaces and get the same feeling as the regular mission hi-los? how much more height would I have to add? I'm seriously considering this because I need new skates and I'm interested in the tour chassis without the "heel" feel. Any info would be appreciated, thanks.