Corey Hirsch in Ottawa Sun

[Jim A 4]

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/2004/10/30/693811.html

[JR Boucicaut 3760]

Well said.

[MDE3 0]

Great "reality check" piece..so many fans and young players do not understand what a nomadic life a non NHL player or fringe player leads..surviving just to keep playing...and keeping their dreams going....and just when they find a nitch which can allow them to keep going...the organization which has toyed with them for years, comes along and tosses them onto the scrap heap one more time..all the while claiming it is a fight over "principles".

Of course the same thing is true over here for the minor league players as well.

[2048 0]

Damn, that was good. What sucks is that most of the NHLers won't give half a shit.

[QandA 0]

I really agree wiht what Corey has to say here. He didn't get a career in the NHL so he tried his luck in Europe where he got more ice time and gave him a bit more pride. However, the NHL players will make up some excuse and make Corey look like an idiot.

[Chadd 916]

He should be upset that the teams are offering the NHL guys contracts.

[Chadd 916]

Exactly Theo, he had no problems taking a job from a Euro player or another North American player when he went over.

[Jim A 4]

well..we don't mince words, outside of Don Cherry, when someone comes to the NHL from Europe to play..

the big difference, to me at least, is that when Hirsch made the jump, he did so for the length of his contract..not for 10/20/30 games...many of the NHL'ers who are overseas are there with the mindset they will be gone in Jan when the season will supposedly be saved when they all come to their senses..

what will the fans reaction in europe be when all of a sudden in January, they have 235 people leave in midseason and they have to replace them..with players who now haven't played competitively in a number of months....how would you feel if your team finishes 4 points out of the playoffs and it was a handful of NHL'ers who caused the difference...and you are missing out on playoff cash?? this will be the last time the euro leagues allow this..

of course..since they are making beer money, for them at least, what's the big deal if there is a season for the 235+ who are there now??

[MDE3 0]

The other thing to consider is when he went to Europe..he did so on a competitive basis...he still had to compete for his job. In the current situation I am sure the NHL players were signed as much for their name value as their ability, with the Euro owners understanding it might just be a short term boost in ticket sales. Plus as has been stated..for many of the NHLers now in Europe it's more a temorary training convenience than a necessity..you cannot really compare the two situations.

[JR Boucicaut 3760]

Wait, then what about the European players who play in minor leagues over here? How about Peter Sidorkiewicz, who went to Albany after they promoted Brodeur and decided to stay there for years?

Hirsch is too old to be in any NHL team's plans. Plus the A has a salary cap, and the E has younger players. He is the type of player who would have fit in the IHL - veterans still playing without any NHL association. Now Europe has been a destination for those type of players.

[MDE3 0]

The guy is Canadian himself...I am sure he could have competed for an AHL job or something. But he took a Euro's job and is now complaining about players doing the same thing.

You are assuming he could go wherever he wanted...at this age and talent level, he was probably just going wherever he had an opportunity to compete...at the highest level he could play....just as do the Euro players when they come over here....But a group of players who are promoting "solidarity" in "the brotherhood of hockey" and in support of each other versus their league....are judged a bit differently than individuals who are just looking to survive and play the sport wherever they can catch on. Particularily when they may be jumping back across the pond as soon as there's NHL hockey to play....I would feel differently if the NHL suddenly went defunct. Then it would be "Katy bar the door and let the devil take the hindmost".

[Dave 1]

Let me add my Euro-view of things:

I think Hirsch makes some very good points and I do not think one should call him a hypocrite.

European leagues, especially the German DEL, cannot maintain their high level of play without non-Euro players. We need a good amount of Canadiens and US-Americans to have a good level of play. Same goes for the NHL (the other way around) who has had a great benefit from the Euro players joining the NHL and minors over the last 10-15 years. That being said, it is obvious that there is a constant flow of players from North America to Europe and from Europe to North America. Hirsch was only part of that "natural flow". And it was a honest thing, because he decided to make a career in Europe. So it is highly unlikelay that he "took away someones job", more likely he has just replaced a retireing goalie.

What happens now during the lockout is completely different. In many leagues, you see 2 to 3 NHLers popping up on EACH team. That disturbs the natural flow mentioned above and kicks some players out of their slots... players who maybe make 150 to 250 grand per year (minus a typical European high-income-tax of roundabout 50%). So the kicked-out guys really need the money to pay their bills. The NHLers who come over have made at least 10 times the money the scratched guys used to make. So they don't come over for bucks. It has been reported that the NHLers have put "sightseeing" as a top priority on their schedule (some really funny stories about that). Do they come over to stay fit? Maybe, but what I've seen so far (as a season ticket holder), the NHLers do not play at 100%, at 70% at best (with the exception of Marco Sturm and Jochen Hecht who are Germans and play for their old hometown teams). So far I've seen no NHLer who really made a major difference for his team, none who did stand out, who made the big points.

So they come here to have some sort of easy training camp, they try not to get injured, don't play 100%, don't make much of a difference but still take away the job of another player. And once the lockout ends, they'll pack their bags in no-time and take the next flight.

I guess some of the Euro teams might meanwhile regret that they've signed NHLers, because the fan-attraction-factor is over after 10 games so you don't see fans coming to games just to see the big names anymore.

On the other hand, for my local pro franchise, I guess we're in urgent need of an NHLer, because we lost our best D-Man (Brad Schlegel, former Team Canada player) for several months and need a solid replacement to remain n° 1 in the league.

[Jim A 4]

I think what Hirsch is mad about is he didn't lose his job likely for the season,

Instead, a bunch of talented players, have come to europe "on holiday" and to get some skating in before the lockout ends, if it does, in January...

once that happens..they'll go back to work..and essentially making a mockery of the leagues out there having affected them dramatically for half the season before packing up and leaving...then Hirsch will get his job back..because the rich kids left the vacation continent..

Hirsch has earned himself a job over there...he moved over there with his family...it wasn't a way to "stay in shape" for the NHL...etc..it was a way to prolong a career...leagues don't have boundries...if that was the case..then the 6 Canadian NHL teams would have all CDN players and the 24 US ones would be filled with Americans....and that wouldn't work..well TO would probably win a cup again though..

it has an impact here in the US as well...as NHL'ers Brad Lukowhich and Brendan Morrow are in the CHL for Ft. Worth and OKC respectively...c'mon now..making 750 a week including housing allowance..do these guys need to take some 24 year old kids job that is trying to make it?? Hell, Luko is an offense force in that league!!

surely they could have a better skate in the DFW area with Hull, Modo, Zubov and the like ...keep the AA league they play in over the summer going...etc..

[MDE3 0]

well put both from Jim A and Shark (sorry Theo lol)...the point is that the "name" players are not really "putting out" like Shark said, and treating this as some sort of paid vacation it sounds like..so this is not really analagous to the normal "ebb and flow" of cross continent players competing for jobs....

The results for the (hopefully temporarily) displaced players are far more dramatic..they are losing their life support (yes and they should have something else) to players who neither really need the money, nor care much about the teams or fans they play for. Their actions is NOT equivalent to competing head to head for a spot where you will become part of a team in a normal rotation and make a commitment to bring it every day for the full season.

I find Shark's comment interesting about the "names" only holding the fans attention and providing a "boost" for maybe only 10 games or so. This jives with what I feel happens too often under the current NHL CBA, where a "name player" in the NHL negotiates his salary based on his "draw" value, not necessarily his performance. The fallacy that a "name" will continue to draw fans when he is not performing, is one of the greatest contributors to the current NHL problems we see today. This type of behaviour is what insults the intelligence of the fans of the game, and is really what should be addressed in any new agreement for it to really help the game grow.

[Dave 1]

Hirsch just found a new job: Today he signed with the German DEL team Kassel Huskies who are currently the worst team in the league (in overall points).

Maybe the Kassel GM has read Hirsch's interview and jumped at the occasion.

[Dave 1]

Salaries are not published in German hockey but considering it's a low-budget team he signed with I'd say he makes around 125 K USD after taxes (so around 250 K before taxes with a high-income-tax of around 50%).