Cost of manufacturing skates

[djinferno 2]

Based on pictures, video, and discussion on here, MANY members are in fact beginners. I won't mention names, but one member who happens to own about 7 pro-stock XXX-Lites was asking how to take a slap shot a few weeks ago on the general discussion board. Do you honestly think any of those sticks will do him any more good than a 45 minute lesson with a shooting coach? Also, if you think Marbury is wearing a 15 dollar pair of shoes you're out of your mind. They simply LOOK like what he's wearing, much akin to the relationship between a Vapor XXV and XXXX.

You're blowing the importance of equipment way out of proportion. One of my skating coaches, a semi-pro russian, was able to fly for fun with his skates UNTIED! Do you honestly think your friend, who could do nothing at the beginning of the year, progressed because of the skates, or the fact that he was continually on the ice for the entire season? Feeling better about himself? A ferrari would make me feel better about myself, but I don't have the means. Should I go cry to have the price lowered to that of my Audi so I can drive what my favorite F1 driver drives? I think not. Welcome to the capitalist 21st century "my friend."

Edit: Grafs "flex" like nobodies business, yet many elite level skaters have no problem with them. You're confusing a stiffness for support, and prefer to have "novice" (is that better?) use an ultra-stiff skate as opposed to developing strong ankles and "skating-muscles" that cannot be simulated via any other avenue/workout routine.

I agree with your point but it's not exactly the same, your Audi can do certain things better then a Ferrari, like sit four and cary luggage...

Not to mention your gas mileage...

We will agree to disagree, i have prouven time and time before that better support helps any skater...

[sabre09923 0]

Well, then your old skates didn't fit. Most lines (most is important here) have a consistent fit for a particular foot shape throughout the entire line, low-end and high-end. One90s will also be, 90 of the time, too stiff for beginning skaters. It would be like wearing a cast with a tuuk attached to it.

You're also making he mistake that, again, everyone absolutely needs a Stealth or a pair of One90s. They do not. People can do just fine without them. You say, "You and I know that a Stealth stick does not make you better because we are fortunate enough to be able to try one at one part of are life, not everyone is so lucky..." So what are you suggesting here? That some below average, low-middle class player walks into the store, thinking that since the Stealth is $100 more than his One50 stick, it will make him a better player; and buys it, only to find that it makes a marginal difference in his game? That would be doing a disservice to him.

In your perfect world, where there are only Stealths and One90s, Vapor XXXXs and V10.0s, you end up alienating a lot of people, the people who just flat-out can't afford them.

[djinferno 2]

No its not, because you can make more REVENUE by charging a greater margin to a lower quantity of consumers than producing in DJ Inferno's socialist factory for the entire world in order to incur massive additional supply costs with a much lower margin of return per unit.

well with that mind set of profit and F the world, your pool will be zero and your business will eventually shut down

Well, then your old skates didn't fit. Most lines (most is important here) have a consistent fit for a particular foot shape throughout the entire line, low-end and high-end. One90s will also be, 90 of the time, too stiff for beginning skaters. It would be like wearing a cast with a tuuk attached to it.

You're also making he mistake that, again, everyone absolutely needs a Stealth or a pair of One90s. They do not. People can do just fine without them. You say, "You and I know that a Stealth stick does not make you better because we are fortunate enough to be able to try one at one part of are life, not everyone is so lucky..." So what are you suggesting here? That some below average, low-middle class player walks into the store, thinking that since the Stealth is $100 more than his One50 stick, it will make him a better player; and buys it, only to find that it makes a marginal difference in his game? That would be doing a disservice to him.

In your perfect world, where there are only Stealths and One90s, Vapor XXXXs and V10.0s, you end up alienating a lot of people, the people who just flat-out can't afford them.

not at better prices...

Like I said give a steath a price on 150$, a SL 110$, ST 85$ and wood 50$ for example

Some people will never try the stealth because it's 329.99

It seems like the fact that I come from a scocialist contry and that hockey is number one here, my view on this might be a little off, i can admit that but I'm a firm beleiver that if you want to attract more people to hockey, you need better priced stuff of at the very least skates and sticks...

I can't really complain about the rest of the stuff, the prices are pretty good, i must admit...

Hockey is alienating it's self, even if I don't need a pair of 9K's because i'm a beginner and I can't benefit from em, truth be told, the NHL players wear it so perception is, I can perform well if he does... thats why Gatorade pays atheletes to show face on TV wearing there product, it's perception, now if that gatorade bottle is 20$ instead of 2$, I'm not buying it, all i'm asking fore is balance...

[sabre09923 0]

WTF? Self contradiction anyone? Again, you were saying that there shouldn't be any low end! What's an ST and a woodie doing in your price range, if they shouldn't exist considering they're bad, according to you. And, I'm sure that no wood stick costs more than $40CDN.

[djinferno 2]

WTF? Self contradiction anyone? Again, you were saying that there shouldn't be any low end! What's an ST and a woodie doing in your price range, if they shouldn't exist considering they're bad, according to you. And, I'm sure that no wood stick costs more than $40CDN.

Dude ST's are not low end... there more then 200$ hopefully I'm not paying that much for my low end ST, please?? and yes Easton wood sticks cost 69.99$ at my LHS...

Easton 350, 300, 200 sticks are low end, Wood is wood...

Trust be buddy, I put allot of tought into this, I would not chalenge guys inteligence on this board, I would get eaten up alive...

this exact stick at my LHS is 299.99 http://www.hockeymonkey.com/easton-stealthgrip04.html and this is a OOOOOOOOOOOOLD stick

[Cavs019 702]

With your mindset, the firm will be operating at an extremely inefficient scale of plant, experience decreasing returns to scale, and then shut down. My mindset is what is followed by nearly every profit-making production firm in the world. Don't argue with an econ major about economics. Again, stiffness does not equal support, to say a 5k has in adequate support because you can flex it with your hands is completely and utterly wrong.

[djinferno 2]

With your mindset, the firm will be operating at an extremely inefficient scale of plant, experience decreasing returns to scale, and then shut down. My mindset is what is followed by nearly every profit-making production firm in the world. Don't argue with an econ major about economics. Again, stiffness does not equal support, to say a 5k has in adequate support because you can flex it with your hands is completely and utterly wrong.

Not with my hand, I skated in them, the sole flexes under me and the boot too

By the way, I said it before, i'm not saying I'm right, I say I wish something could be done because "I" think it's killing the sport...

It's my opinion and i seem to be the only one to feel this way...

Eventually i will just stop playing the sport and yes I know you don't care...

[sabre09923 0]

You are basically calling for the eradication of lower end things, and only have the high end skates (One90) and any skate below that is crap (say Vapor XXV). ST is mid-high end, so since, with your logic, it doesn't perform as well as a Stealth so it must be a piece of shit.

Maybe the problem isn't the manufacturers and you just have a a LHS that overprices their stuff by a wide margin.

[Jarick 5]

So get rid of the bull and drop prices on the real and you will make a bigger profit, trust me, take a look at this vid and tell me it does not matter http://www.gametrailers.com/player/22425.html

If dropping prices leads to more profits, why aren't prices zero?

You really have no concept of economics, so I'm not even going to bother. I was going to talk about competition leading to product innovation, new technologies trickling down to lower price models, but you for some odd reason seem to think in an economic void.

thats the most stupid coment i've ever heard, ZERO? as in free? wtf are you talking about? nobody said to give stuff out here...

Volume of sale is key my friend, i will take less profit per for double volume anyday... thats why theres microsofts getting paid and others giging out software for free... :lol:

Grow the amount of people that can wear your product and you make more money, that is economics 101...

why aren't prices zero :lol: good one

Go back and read what you wrote. You said dropping prices leads to more profit.

I highly doubt you've mastered economics 101, but if you want to actually relate your comment to economics 301, you would have said that you have reason to believe there is negative marginal consumer surplus, meaning that the prices are set above consumer surplus maximization.

In other words, equilibrium prices have been determined but manufacturers are supplying a greater amount at a price above equilibrium and quantity demanded at that price is lower than quantity supplied.

How would we test this? Any good economist would tell you that prices above equilibrium would lead to surpluses. Does anyone here work for a LHS? If so, are One90 and XXXX skates gathering dust in the back of your store? Have you canceled orders for more product due to sluggish sales?

EDIT: How would eliminating entry-level equipment help bring MORE players into the game? Wow.

[djinferno 2]

You are basically calling for the eradication of lower end things, and only have the high end skates (One90) and any skate below that is crap (say Vapor XXV). ST is mid-high end, so since, with your logic, it doesn't perform as well as a Stealth so it must be a piece of shit.

Maybe the problem isn't the manufacturers and you just have a a LHS that overprices their stuff by a wide margin.

No like I said in post 84, in canadian figures...

XXXX 399$

XXV 299$

one90 449$

one70 349$

Vector 10.0 399$

Vector 8.0 299$

RBK 9K 429$

RBK 7K 349$

S15 449$

S11 349$

I said keep mid and high end and drop the low, drop the prices and we all live hapelly ever after...

Trust me, From here to montreal to toronto, so about 150 stores, it's all the same game, prices don't change...

[Cavs019 702]

You attack trivial points and have no comment toward the points that actually destroy your argument. I'm done here.

[djinferno 2]

So get rid of the bull and drop prices on the real and you will make a bigger profit, trust me, take a look at this vid and tell me it does not matter http://www.gametrailers.com/player/22425.html

If dropping prices leads to more profits, why aren't prices zero?

You really have no concept of economics, so I'm not even going to bother. I was going to talk about competition leading to product innovation, new technologies trickling down to lower price models, but you for some odd reason seem to think in an economic void.

thats the most stupid coment i've ever heard, ZERO? as in free? wtf are you talking about? nobody said to give stuff out here...

Volume of sale is key my friend, i will take less profit per for double volume anyday... thats why theres microsofts getting paid and others giging out software for free... :lol:

Grow the amount of people that can wear your product and you make more money, that is economics 101...

why aren't prices zero :lol: good one

Go back and read what you wrote. You said dropping prices leads to more profit.

I highly doubt you've mastered economics 101, but if you want to actually relate your comment to economics 301, you would have said that you have reason to believe there is negative marginal consumer surplus, meaning that the prices are set above consumer surplus maximization.

In other words, equilibrium prices have been determined but manufacturers are supplying a greater amount at a price above equilibrium and quantity demanded at that price is lower than quantity supplied.

How would we test this? Any good economist would tell you that prices above equilibrium would lead to surpluses. Does anyone here work for a LHS? If so, are One90 and XXXX skates gathering dust in the back of your store? Have you canceled orders for more product due to sluggish sales?

EDIT: How would eliminating entry-level equipment help bring MORE players into the game? Wow.

I said sell more at lesser prices and make more profit... Make less profit on one but sell more and make the profit on more unit...

Example: The cost is 4$ you sell at 12$ my cost is the same but I sell for 10$...

Who will sel more?

me!

now if you sold 10 you made 80$

for me to make 80$ I got to sell 13...

whos better off?

me because my product is out there to a bigger pool...

So instead of RBK, they chose NBH...

More exposure, more profit etc...

You attack trivial points and have no comment toward the points that actually destroy your argument. I'm done here.

What?

[sabre09923 0]

The 7K has been out of production for more than a year. The 5K is RBK's new mid-end skate.

You're also discounting that the store has to sell and make money; the skate manufacturer makes most of their money buy selling them to the STORE, not selling them to you! It's not like Easton is directly selling the S15's to you, the customer, it has to go through the vendor first, otherwise, you'd end up paying a WHOLESALE price. The vendor also has to get the profit, so it has to sell ABOVE what they paid for the skate, in order to make money and stay in business.

[JR Boucicaut 3768]

This thread is getting ridiculous. I'm going to do us ALL a favor and shut it down.