Something to backup my point about Hockey equipment prices

[djinferno 2]

Couple of months back, I was trying to make the point that Hockey equipment prices where killing the sport and i was called cheap amongst other things...

So here is someone who owns a business and actual companies enforcing my point...

I quote:

Firenzo Arcadi, who owns Toronto sporting goods store Toronto Hockey Repair Ltd., has another theory about why the hockey business has swooned.

"It's the $900 skate," Arcadi said, referring to NikeBauer's latest offering, a sleek silver, black and blue skate called the Supreme one90 that retails at some stores for $899.

"These companies like Nike are pricing themselves right out of the market," said Arcadi, whose store sells about $2.5 million worth of equipment each year, down from $3 million just four years ago.

"It's at a point where families are having to decide whether they want to pay a $1,100 mortgage or buy skates," he said.

http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/264767

[DarkStar50 679]

When you go out to eat, no one says you have to buy the filet mignon. Everybody wants filet mignon but sometimes they should have the chicken or the pasta instead.

The latest generation of parents has also never figured out there is a word known as "No." I heard it all the time when I was a kid. Today's parents never use it and have no one but themselves to blame for it.

[Rustpot 1]

You can still buy $50 skates. All of the money I have spent on hockey in 2 years (complete equipment, setup, shipping, buying extra junk) doesn't even total a pair of One90 skates.

NikeBauer and RBK put out $900 skates because people buy them. Look at how many members here have XXX, XXXX, One90, 9k, S15, 1500c etc. How many of them own 3 pairs?

Plenty of NHL players use old, cheap or low-end equipment. A bunch still use $20 blades or even $30 woodies.

My biggest expense? Ice time. I probably spent $300 on ice time last year for drop-ins and student ice.

[djinferno 2]

The biggest interest as a kid following a sport is mimiking your heros, if your hero wears 9K's and they are available in stores, guess what interests you?

It's mind over matter my friend...

[Ogie Oglethorpe 14]

When you go out to eat, no one says you have to buy the filet mignon. Everybody wants filet mignon but sometimes they should have the chicken or the pasta instead.

The latest generation of parents has also never figured out there is a word known as "No." I heard it all the time when I was a kid. Today's parents never use it and have no one but themselves to blame for it.

Exactly. More expensive does not automatically mean better. At the amateur level, is there a noticeable performance advantage to the $800 One90 over the $150 8090 from two years ago offered on close out? Or the One50?

Likely not. However, parents want their kids to have the best, and the kids want it to show off to their friends and have the unique expensive product that not everyone on the ice can afford to sport around in.

[djinferno 2]

You can still buy $50 skates. All of the money I have spent on hockey in 2 years (complete equipment, setup, shipping, buying extra junk) doesn't even total a pair of One90 skates.

NikeBauer and RBK put out $900 skates because people buy them. Look at how many members here have XXX, XXXX, One90, 9k, S15, 1500c etc. How many of them own 3 pairs?

Plenty of NHL players use old, cheap or low-end equipment. A bunch still use $20 blades or even $30 woodies.

My biggest expense? Ice time. I probably spent $300 on ice time last year for drop-ins and student ice.

50$ skates do not perform for any kind of elite level player...

Name me one NHL player who wears cheap skates? They might wear older versions but they where to of the line wen they got em...

Yeah some you cheap sticks, they also have 50 of em...

When you go out to eat, no one says you have to buy the filet mignon. Everybody wants filet mignon but sometimes they should have the chicken or the pasta instead.

The latest generation of parents has also never figured out there is a word known as "No." I heard it all the time when I was a kid. Today's parents never use it and have no one but themselves to blame for it.

Exactly. More expensive does not automatically mean better. At the amateur level, is there a noticeable performance advantage to the $800 One90 over the $150 8090 from two years ago offered on close out? Or the One50?

Likely not. However, parents want their kids to have the best, and the kids want it to show off to their friends and have the unique expensive product that not everyone on the ice can afford to sport around in.

Agreed but for the record 8090's are still 399$ around here and are not necesarrely available in every size...

Most parents see it like this, why pay 499$ for XXV when the top of the line XXXX is 649$ after all its a better skate...

[killthepoodle 0]

A player at my level (beer league and happy) will not necessarily notice a huge performance difference between a one50 and one90- but if you factor in the fact that I weigh 230lbs then it becomes in issue. I'll break a lower end skate down in no time- the extra stiffness of the elite level skates works well for me.

When I was 185lbs I found that the top end skates took too long for me to break in-almost a full season for them to feel right. At my current weight they soften up nicely.

So, uh, yeah, thats my justification for running out and buying some XXXX's ;)

[Rustpot 1]

If parents see the price difference and think spending $150 more is a good deal then they need to look at how much it costs them in the long run.

NHL players get paid to play, their skate choice is not based on cost. I have $1500 to my name, why would I spend half of that on a pair of skates when my $140 vectors are doing the job fine?

If Johnny Nobody's mommy wants to get him top of the line stuff and can't afford it, then Johnny needs to settle for less or get a boot in the face.

If you play at an elite level, chances are you're going to get some help in paying for skates. If you're a kids playing house or high school hockey, you probably don't need more than $300 worth of equipment until something wears out or is outgrown.

[Jarick 5]

I agree, Canada should increase income taxes and give away free hockey equipment every year for every Canadian. Because it's obvious that kids will never be happy and never reach their potential without top end equipment. And most importantly, they won't have any fun or get any exercise.

[oggy_3 0]

The biggest interest as a kid following a sport is mimiking your heros, if your hero wears 9K's and they are available in stores, guess what interests you?

It's mind over matter my friend...

Thats why the make skates look the same. When you see the NHL players wearing certian gear its froma distance unless your on this website. Can you tell the difference between the 4k and 8k from 100 feet away, i think not same as the 9k and talon. Vapor XXXX and the XXV. They are all duplicates of each other with adjustments to the inside

[delpiero27 0]

i've read the article... at fist time, i thought that Fiorenzo Arcadi is right. But i was even thinking that: hockey has never been a "cheap" sport,

and the top-of-the-line is always not cheap, in every field. you can talk about cars, skates or travels. it's the same. Quality has to be paid.

But on the other hand, you don't need a top-of-the-line stuff to play better. it's not having a vap xxxx skate that makes you a better player.

But if you need a stiff skate, you have no choice. If you need some protection, you cannot but a low-end protection or pants.

That's the problem. You think you can have a choice, but actually you haven't.

I haven't seen any $800 one90's on any LHS. But here in italy, if you don't go web shopping around the world, vapor XXXX are Euro 849 and One90 Euro 899.

consider actual rate between Euro and USD...

[Oberon 0]

The biggest interest as a kid following a sport is mimiking your heros, if your hero wears 9K's and they are available in stores, guess what interests you?

It's mind over matter my friend...

When I was a kid, I didn't care what kind of skates Bobby Orr or Larry Robinson wore - I just wanted to be able to play like them. Their equipment was irrelevant. I would concede that people are more brand conscious now, but if the deciding factor of whether or not you're going to play hockey is the price of Sidney Crosby's skates, then I would suggest you're more interested in looking like a hockey player than being one.

I agree with what Rustpot and others have said, that the cost of ice time is the most prohibitive factor in the affordability of hockey. If you look hard enough, you can find deals on used or older stock equipment that will allow you to perform up to your abilities.

[Jarick 5]

Bobby Orr didn't get a "new" pair of skates until he was a teenager...didn't seem to hurt him at all.

[djinferno 2]

The biggest interest as a kid following a sport is mimiking your heros, if your hero wears 9K's and they are available in stores, guess what interests you?

It's mind over matter my friend...

When I was a kid, I didn't care what kind of skates Bobby Orr or Larry Robinson wore - I just wanted to be able to play like them. Their equipment was irrelevant. I would concede that people are more brand conscious now, but if the deciding factor of whether or not you're going to play hockey is the price of Sidney Crosby's skates, then I would suggest you're more interested in looking like a hockey player than being one.

Let me remind you that when you that in your era, there was no advertising on boards so lets not even go there...

Bobby Orr didn't get a "new" pair of skates until he was a teenager...didn't seem to hurt him at all.

Bobby Orr played in an era where some players where cones and goalies had beer bellies, get real, some guys in my beer league could of played in yesterdays NHL, I know the goalies could...

i've read the article... at fist time, i thought that Fiorenzo Arcadi is right. But i was even thinking that: hockey has never been a "cheap" sport,

and the top-of-the-line is always not cheap, in every field. you can talk about cars, skates or travels. it's the same. Quality has to be paid.

But on the other hand, you don't need a top-of-the-line stuff to play better. it's not having a vap xxxx skate that makes you a better player.

But if you need a stiff skate, you have no choice. If you need some protection, you cannot but a low-end protection or pants.

That's the problem. You think you can have a choice, but actually you haven't.

I haven't seen any $800 one90's on any LHS. But here in italy, if you don't go web shopping around the world, vapor XXXX are Euro 849 and One90 Euro 899.

consider actual rate between Euro and USD...

Exactly my point, it seems like you have a choice but you actually dont, it you need stiff performance or protection, you dont...

The biggest interest as a kid following a sport is mimiking your heros, if your hero wears 9K's and they are available in stores, guess what interests you?

It's mind over matter my friend...

Thats why the make skates look the same. When you see the NHL players wearing certian gear its froma distance unless your on this website. Can you tell the difference between the 4k and 8k from 100 feet away, i think not same as the 9k and talon. Vapor XXXX and the XXV. They are all duplicates of each other with adjustments to the inside

Dude I can spot a XXXX from a XXV from the nose bleeds, same for 9K's etc...

They are quite distinct...

It's like saying you could not tell the difference between a 325, a 330 or a M3 BMW, maybe you can't but I can...

[Jarick 5]

Sorry, you're right. Orr would have gotten whupped by modern players and their superior gear.

And to further your point, when my parents made me play hockey growing up, I got second hand gear that was uncomfortable and I didn't like playing at all. When I started watching and playing hockey as an adult and bought my own new gear, I played really well and had more fun. It was a direct result of having fancy new gear.

Although technically I skated on Vapor VI's for a few months before getting my Vapor XIX's, so I wasn't having fun yet, at least not as much.

[djinferno 2]

Sorry, you're right. Orr would have gotten whupped by modern players and their superior gear.

And to further your point, when my parents made me play hockey growing up, I got second hand gear that was uncomfortable and I didn't like playing at all. When I started watching and playing hockey as an adult and bought my own new gear, I played really well and had more fun. It was a direct result of having fancy new gear.

Although technically I skated on Vapor VI's for a few months before getting my Vapor XIX's, so I wasn't having fun yet, at least not as much.

Your sarcasm, deviates from the point, performance gear cost to much, who ever said hockey was not fun???

Numbers dont lie...

And yes in todays NHL Orr would not be as dominant, Todays players backcheck, play defence and block shots... Yeah I said it...

[Rustpot 1]

Bobby Orr played in an era where some players where cones and goalies ad beer bellies, get real...

That doesn't mean he needed carbon and the latest things to make him great.

God knows I want a Stealth, One90 skates, top-end Jofa protective, an 8500 bucket and nice new $200 gloves. I don't have any of those things. Why? I know how to not put myself in debt and still enjoy the game I love.

If someone can afford all the nice stuff, then get it if they want it.

I remember wanting an aluminum shaft just like Sergei Fedorov when I was in grade school (I'm 20 now). I asked for it for Christmas and I got a $15 Powertek aluminum shaft with an ABS blade. I was happier than a pig in shit, even though it was nowhere near what the pros had.

RBK makes the 4K skate loot like the 9K for a reason. If a kid wants a 9K skate because Crosby has them and mommy gets him 4Ks, he'll be disappointed for a bit but he sure as hell will get over it.

I want a Porsche, but my parents have the sense to tell me no and slap me in the back of the head for trying to put them in debt to get a sports car. I still got a car and I make it work.

[delpiero27 0]

i've read the article... at fist time, i thought that Fiorenzo Arcadi is right. But i was even thinking that: hockey has never been a "cheap" sport,

and the top-of-the-line is always not cheap, in every field. you can talk about cars, skates or travels. it's the same. Quality has to be paid.

But on the other hand, you don't need a top-of-the-line stuff to play better. it's not having a vap xxxx skate that makes you a better player.

But if you need a stiff skate, you have no choice. If you need some protection, you cannot but a low-end protection or pants.

That's the problem. You think you can have a choice, but actually you haven't.

I haven't seen any $800 one90's on any LHS. But here in italy, if you don't go web shopping around the world, vapor XXXX are Euro 849 and One90 Euro 899.

consider actual rate between Euro and USD...

Exactly my point, it seems like you have a choice but you actually dont, it you need stiff performance or protection, you dont...

I have to admit: probably if i had the chance my choice would have been one90 instead of my supreme70, but in any case i couldn't go lower. too tall and too heavy. so where's my actual choice? 450 instead of 500? considered all, there's no enough technology to justify the price.

[Jarick 5]

We already played this game and it got old fast.

[djinferno 2]

i've read the article... at fist time, i thought that Fiorenzo Arcadi is right. But i was even thinking that: hockey has never been a "cheap" sport,

and the top-of-the-line is always not cheap, in every field. you can talk about cars, skates or travels. it's the same. Quality has to be paid.

But on the other hand, you don't need a top-of-the-line stuff to play better. it's not having a vap xxxx skate that makes you a better player.

But if you need a stiff skate, you have no choice. If you need some protection, you cannot but a low-end protection or pants.

That's the problem. You think you can have a choice, but actually you haven't.

I haven't seen any $800 one90's on any LHS. But here in italy, if you don't go web shopping around the world, vapor XXXX are Euro 849 and One90 Euro 899.

consider actual rate between Euro and USD...

Exactly my point, it seems like you have a choice but you actually dont, it you need stiff performance or protection, you dont...

I have to admit: probably if i had the chance my choice would have been one90 instead of my supreme70, but in any case i couldn't go lower. too tall and too heavy. so where's my actual choice? 450 instead of 500? considered all, there's no enough technology to justify the price.

Amen, thats exactly my point...

By the way, I don't think you would be that much hapier with One90's, i tried both and the 70 is solid...

We already played this game and it got old fast.

Yeah because someone decided that my opinion was not valid...

Strangely enought NIKE and Store owners feel like jumping ship so i'm not as crazy as you make me out to be...

If it's old to you, leave it alone and let others voice there opinion...

[Law Goalie 147]

The real problem is that the cheap, poorly-made low end market has completely destroyed the used skate reserve. The best condition used skates I see now were all made before the early 90s. Hell, there are pairs of Cooper skates in Toronto that are in better shape than one-year old Nikes.

[djinferno 2]

The real problem is that the cheap, poorly-made low end market has completely destroyed the used skate reserve. The best condition used skates I see now were all made before the early 90s. Hell, there are pairs of Cooper skates in Toronto that are in better shape than one-year old Nikes.

i noticed that too...

[Jarick 5]

Maybe in a town with a poor economy...I've seen three of those Nike ID stations within 10 minutes from my house. That's up to the owner, not you.

The funny part about my sarcastic post is that, yes, my equipment fits a TON better than it did and I don't have a narrow Bauer helmet squeezing my head, too-big CCM skates that pinch my toes, shin pads that slide and fall all over, and shoulder pads that require 10 minutes to adjust all the slides and buttons and snaps anymore, and I only spent about $350 total on all my gear brand new. A kid can get away with $250 a year on brand new equipment.

[oggy_3 0]

Why do you alwasy attack NBH??

[delpiero27 0]

i've read the old 3ad, but the problem i think remains.

what's the real reason of having supreme30, 50, 70, one90? different stiffness? ok. I need stiffer skates. i have to pay more. why? i have to ask God why i'm 1.92m and not 1.75m like my dad? Can i ask him to pay the difference? NO? so, finally, who can give me an aswer for that?

I think there's no actual need of low end stuff, despite what manifacturers are saying. And the actual stuff price has to be so high because commercials are not cheap...