DIY punching out skates

[caseyjones 26]

53 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

M5 pro is very similar ya. I tried the hyperlite 2 today. Pretty comfy. 7 fit 2 felt good in left but right felt a touch too big since my right is 1/4 size smaller and is also a bit smaller with wise.  They didn't have 7 fit 1 in the hyperlites so I tried the 7 fit 1 in x5 and the fit was noticeably diff since it has less padding. The x5 fit 1 felt pretty similar to the hyperlite fit 2. I expected the forefoot to be noticeably narrower in the fit 1 but it wasn't. I have a feeling most of the volume difference is just how far the eyelet facing extends. 

I also tried a 6.5 fit 2 and it pinched my forefoot and crushed my toes. They didn't have a fit 3 in 6.5 for me to try. Made me realize how shitty retail is for me bc of my size diff in feet. 

Just for kicks I put my feet on the brannock and surprisingly it had me at a e width which I never thought I was. Always considered myself a d. Brannock said my left was 7.5 and right was just under 7.5. Wonder if the brannock sizing is based on the 1.5 size smaller than shoe size. Brannock was a Bauer one too. 

Guess there's no point steering away from my true cat pros as nothing retail fits remotely as good. 

Honestly sounds like we have somewhat similar feet. Maybe I’ll try on some vapors tomorrow too while im at it.  Would you say the vapor toe box is wider than Mach or the same?  Mako toe box was the only toe box that was perfect for me.  Even after Bauer said they made theirs even wider on the machs, it’s still not as wide as the mako was.  Crazy with all these different fits, it’s still hard to find the perfect sweet spot for some.  I wanted to try on trues but pure said they only do custom 

[beedee 224]

I went from a 7, Fit 2 Vapor 3x (wore for a year) to a 6.5, Fit 3 Supreme Mach (wore for about 6 months) and am now in a 7, Fit 2 Vapor 3x Pro. (all skates share the same size footbeds, runner and holder lengths)

The Supreme Machs felt amazing right out of the box due to the padding, and I did like how the lace facing wraps more over the top of your feet compared to the Vapors. However, once the padding settled in, I found I had too much slop in the ankle area and heel lock was lacking. I used Elite Waxed laces on them (and my other skates). Before someone asks, yes I did try on the Fit 2 Supreme, it was too tight in the forefoot area. Beyond what a breaking in would fix. I went back to my local shop and tried on the Vapor 3x Pro, and it just "felt right". I really wanted another line of skates to work (tried on Trues, yes they were baked), tried and used the CCM warranty on JetSpeeds, RibCores and Tacks (a few games and pick-ups in each) but in the end, the Vapors just work best for me.

Hope you figure it out soon, the journey was frustrating but kind of fun. 

[Sniper9 518]

5 hours ago, caseyjones said:

Honestly sounds like we have somewhat similar feet. Maybe I’ll try on some vapors tomorrow too while im at it.  Would you say the vapor toe box is wider than Mach or the same?  Mako toe box was the only toe box that was perfect for me.  Even after Bauer said they made theirs even wider on the machs, it’s still not as wide as the mako was.  Crazy with all these different fits, it’s still hard to find the perfect sweet spot for some.  I wanted to try on trues but pure said they only do custom 

Hmmm. Vapor seemed narrower in the forefoot and toe box in the fit 2 vs the Mach not not by that much. That's probably also why I was able to fit in the fit 1 in the Mach as well. Weird that pure doesn't carry the retail true skates

Edited December 9, 2023 by Sniper9

[Sniper9 518]

4 hours ago, beedee said:

I went from a 7, Fit 2 Vapor 3x (wore for a year) to a 6.5, Fit 3 Supreme Mach (wore for about 6 months) and am now in a 7, Fit 2 Vapor 3x Pro. (all skates share the same size footbeds, runner and holder lengths)

The Supreme Machs felt amazing right out of the box due to the padding, and I did like how the lace facing wraps more over the top of your feet compared to the Vapors. However, once the padding settled in, I found I had too much slop in the ankle area and heel lock was lacking. I used Elite Waxed laces on them (and my other skates). Before someone asks, yes I did try on the Fit 2 Supreme, it was too tight in the forefoot area. Beyond what a breaking in would fix. I went back to my local shop and tried on the Vapor 3x Pro, and it just "felt right". I really wanted another line of skates to work (tried on Trues, yes they were baked), tried and used the CCM warranty on JetSpeeds, RibCores and Tacks (a few games and pick-ups in each) but in the end, the Vapors just work best for me.

Hope you figure it out soon, the journey was frustrating but kind of fun. 

Did you Rebake the machs second time after they felt a bit sloppy?  If not that could've retightened things. 

Now I wanna go somewhere to try a fit 3 in a 6.5 hyperlite 2. Especially since they have the same 263 holder.  I definitely wouldn't have been able to fit a fit 3 mach since the fit 1 size 7 was perfect length and slightly on the tight side in the forefoot. Not I guess you never know until you try it

Edited December 9, 2023 by Sniper9

[caseyjones 26]

On 12/9/2023 at 12:11 AM, Sniper9 said:

Hmmm. Vapor seemed narrower in the forefoot and toe box in the fit 2 vs the Mach not not by that much. That's probably also why I was able to fit in the fit 1 in the Mach as well. Weird that pure doesn't carry the retail true skates

I went back to pure yesterday.  Tried on vapor 6.5 fit 1 and it felt pretty comfortable, but I worry about something feeling too comfortable the first time you put your foot into it without baking and I weirdly didn’t have as good of a heel lock as I do with the machs.  I think the “anatomical fit” of the ankle on the Machs suits me although the guy at ourehockey suggested otherwise.  I think ultimately, my best best might be a 6.5 fit 1 opposed to my 6 fit 2, but of course there are no pure hockeys who carry this size.  I tried it on in the M5.  I had a 6.5 fit 1 M5 on my left foot (this slightly longer foot) and a 6 fit 2 Mach on my right and they felt pretty much the same.  So I wound up leaving with the skates I already had (the Mach size 6 fit 2).  I was also trying these skates on with basically no socks on.  It seems like that’s the difference I’m looking at here.  Without socks they feel pretty good, with socks they’re pretty tight.  I think I’m going to order a pair of thinnies and see what that does for me.  But otherwise it’s baking, punching and stretching and breaking in and hoping that sweet spot eventually comes 

Edited December 10, 2023 by caseyjones

[Sniper9 518]

3 hours ago, caseyjones said:

I went back to pure yesterday.  Tried on vapor 6.5 fit 1 and it felt pretty comfortable, but I worry about something feeling too comfortable the first time you put your foot into it without baking and I weirdly didn’t have as good of a heel lock as I do with the machs.  I think the “anatomical fit” of the ankle on the Machs suits me although the guy at ourehockey suggested otherwise.  I think ultimately, my best best might be a 6.5 fit 1 opposed to my 6 fit 2, but of course there are no pure hockeys who carry this size.  I tried it on in the M5.  I had a 6.5 fit 1 M5 on my left foot (this slightly longer foot) and a 6 fit 2 Mach on my right and they felt pretty much the same.  So I wound up leaving with the skates I already had (the Mach size 6 fit 2).  I was also trying these skates on with basically no socks on.  It seems like that’s the difference I’m looking at here.  Without socks they feel pretty good, with socks they’re pretty tight.  I think I’m going to order a pair of thinnies and see what that does for me.  But otherwise it’s baking, punching and stretching and breaking in and hoping that sweet spot eventually comes 

Thinnies or the fact that when bakes it'll open up a touch as well with regular socks on. Personally I think the smaller size in wider fit is the way to go if it feels good on the larger foot. I wouldn't over think about it too much. The reality is that if you really wanted to dial in the heel lock you should bake and use the stretch wrap technique like they use with true skates. This really locks in the heel. I know this bc I've had true skates that felt absolutely slop prebake... Even after a traditional bake but when rebaked with stretch wrap it was night and day. Mind you Bauer skates may not mold as well as true skates but I've read people having good success using the stretch wrap technique on ccm and Bauer skates. Just need to make sure you bake one skate at a time so you have time and the other skate doesn't cool off while you're trying to get the other one on etc.  

The thing about vapor and the injected eyelets is that it really provides very little wrap. Eventually they do break in a bit but man they are stiff as hell and almost pointless trying them on in store without a bake to get a feel of how well they will fit. 

 

Edited December 10, 2023 by Sniper9

[caseyjones 26]

53 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

Thinnies or the fact that when bakes it'll open up a touch as well with regular socks on. Personally I think the smaller size in wider fit is the way to go if it feels good on the larger foot. I wouldn't over think about it too much. The reality is that if you really wanted to dial in the heel lock you should bake and use the stretch wrap technique like they use with true skates. This really locks in the heel. I know this bc I've had true skates that felt absolutely slop prebake... Even after a traditional bake but when rebaked with stretch wrap it was night and day. Mind you Bauer skates may not mold as well as true skates but I've read people having good success using the stretch wrap technique on ccm and Bauer skates. Just need to make sure you bake one skate at a time so you have time and the other skate doesn't cool off while you're trying to get the other one on etc.  

The thing about vapor and the injected eyelets is that it really provides very little wrap. Eventually they do break in a bit but man they are stiff as hell and almost pointless trying them on in store without a bake to get a feel of how well they will fit. 

 

I wound up baking them last night and I used the shrink wrap technique.  I baked them longer and at a higher temperature than recommended.  I kept a close eye on them.  The recommended times and temperature I saw was like 175 for 3 minutes or something like that.  The whole skates weren’t even warm with that.  But the bake worked out perfectly.  I put the skates on this morning and immediately called another pure hockey to see if they had a different size in stock.  But once the skates warm up from my foot being in them, they start to fit.  My right skate now feels perfect even with a sock on.  Just working on the forefoot now a little on the left skate and we’ll see what happens in terms of length.  Kinda hard for me to do that on my own. I’m skating tonight though so we’ll see how it goes.  

[caseyjones 26]

Skated last night and the overall fit felt really good.  Toes def hit the toe cap when my legs are straight and I’m gliding but it wasn’t painful or anyThing so it wasn’t really something that bothered me at all. 

The skates themselves were interesting.  This is the only skate I’ve laced up tightly all the way to the top and has zero restriction in forward flex.  I had a little trouble finding my edges on crossovers.  The steel was interesting too.  The sound it made was different and it seemed to cut through the ice like butter.  Idk if I like it or not though.  Felt more agile in the Mach’s but more powerful and energy transfer from the Jetspeeds.  I’m not really sure if that’s a product of the skate or the steel and holder.  CCMs had step steel with more bulk in the toe plus the steel was the taller steel.  I also liked the ccm tongue better than the traditional felt on the Mach’s.  

[Sniper9 518]

14 hours ago, caseyjones said:

Skated last night and the overall fit felt really good.  Toes def hit the toe cap when my legs are straight and I’m gliding but it wasn’t painful or anyThing so it wasn’t really something that bothered me at all. 

The skates themselves were interesting.  This is the only skate I’ve laced up tightly all the way to the top and has zero restriction in forward flex.  I had a little trouble finding my edges on crossovers.  The steel was interesting too.  The sound it made was different and it seemed to cut through the ice like butter.  Idk if I like it or not though.  Felt more agile in the Mach’s but more powerful and energy transfer from the Jetspeeds.  I’m not really sure if that’s a product of the skate or the steel and holder.  CCMs had step steel with more bulk in the toe plus the steel was the taller steel.  I also liked the ccm tongue better than the traditional felt on the Mach’s.  

You just need to get used to them. All new skates will feel weird. The most important thing is the comfort and overall fit. You're not going to find the "perfect" fit at the retail level if you don't have identical left and right feet. That's just reality. So imo, you're chasing something that isn't there.

Also I'm confused now. Was this last trial the hyperlites or machs. 

Edited December 12, 2023 by Sniper9

[caseyjones 26]

11 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

You just need to get used to them. All new skates will feel weird. The most important thing is the comfort and overall fit. You're not going to find the "perfect" fit at the retail level if you don't have identical left and right feet. That's just reality. So imo, you're chasing something that isn't there.

Also I'm confused now. Was this last trial the hyperlites or machs. 

This skate was my first skate on the Mach’s.  Only tried hyperlites on in the store, but I own the Mach’s.  The fit is pretty great.  Like you said, it’s just getting used to them now and getting some things dialed in.  I started playing with tongues out and quickly switched to tongues under shins.  I also ordered step steel so I’ll probably skate on that next time opposed to the fly steel and compare there.  I’m fairly happy though and I’m not sure I could’ve gotten a better fit.  I feel more comfortable with them being slightly too small if anything opposed to slightly too big and I’m sure I can add a tiny extra space to that left skate if eventually needed.  Thanks for all your feedback during this process.  It’s been quite the journey but I’m not really 2nd guessing anything at this point in time.  

[Sniper9 518]

1 hour ago, caseyjones said:

This skate was my first skate on the Mach’s.  Only tried hyperlites on in the store, but I own the Mach’s.  The fit is pretty great.  Like you said, it’s just getting used to them now and getting some things dialed in.  I started playing with tongues out and quickly switched to tongues under shins.  I also ordered step steel so I’ll probably skate on that next time opposed to the fly steel and compare there.  I’m fairly happy though and I’m not sure I could’ve gotten a better fit.  I feel more comfortable with them being slightly too small if anything opposed to slightly too big and I’m sure I can add a tiny extra space to that left skate if eventually needed.  Thanks for all your feedback during this process.  It’s been quite the journey but I’m not really 2nd guessing anything at this point in time.  

Np. I've been in your shoes. It's annoying trying to find the right fit which is why I ultimately went with true customs. And the fact true skates mold very well I am able to adjust for any minor fit issues during the bake process as long as length is right. 

[beedee 224]

On 12/8/2023 at 9:14 PM, Sniper9 said:

Did you Rebake the machs second time after they felt a bit sloppy?  If not that could've retightened things. 

Now I wanna go somewhere to try a fit 3 in a 6.5 hyperlite 2. Especially since they have the same 263 holder.  I definitely wouldn't have been able to fit a fit 3 mach since the fit 1 size 7 was perfect length and slightly on the tight side in the forefoot. Not I guess you never know until you try it

I didn't rebake them. In hindsight, I probably should have given that a shot, oh well. I was able to sell them for what I paid, so not a huge deal.

On 12/10/2023 at 10:45 AM, Sniper9 said:

.........The thing about vapor and the injected eyelets is that it really provides very little wrap. Eventually they do break in a bit but man they are stiff as hell and almost pointless trying them on in store without a bake to get a feel of how well they will fit. 

 

This is a great point, and probably why the Hyperlites in the same size and fit as the 3x I tried on when shopping for skates last year felt so big/hollow on my feet when trying them on in the store. My current 3x Pro's have been baked once, skated on in one game since the bake, and one game and one public skate before the bake. I also added Elite Wax Laces after the bake and they have helped achieve some sort of wrap over the top of my feet without the laces slipping and loosening the wrap. They didn't feel quite as "hollow" as the Hyperlites though when trying them on in the store, I'm sure the Hyperlite tongue contributed to some of that feeling.

[Sniper9 518]

23 hours ago, beedee said:

I didn't rebake them. In hindsight, I probably should have given that a shot, oh well. I was able to sell them for what I paid, so not a huge deal.

This is a great point, and probably why the Hyperlites in the same size and fit as the 3x I tried on when shopping for skates last year felt so big/hollow on my feet when trying them on in the store. My current 3x Pro's have been baked once, skated on in one game since the bake, and one game and one public skate before the bake. I also added Elite Wax Laces after the bake and they have helped achieve some sort of wrap over the top of my feet without the laces slipping and loosening the wrap. They didn't feel quite as "hollow" as the Hyperlites though when trying them on in the store, I'm sure the Hyperlite tongue contributed to some of that feeling.

I noticed the "hollow" feeling as well. The hyperlite 2s added padding eliminated this feeling for the most part but the hyperlites still felt a bit longer than the machs. 

[caseyjones 26]

2nd skate didn’t go so great.  I don’t know if going to a size 6 vs a 6.5 changes anything with the boot or if this is just something Mach specific but the forward flex has been an adjustment.  I’ve never ever been able to crank laces all the way up to the top and not have any restriction at all in forward flex.  I’m tripping over my toes on occasion and I feel much less power in my stride compared to the CCMs.  These fit great but performance wise so far, the CCMs felt like I was getting more benefits from a much stiffer and more responsive skate than I am used to.  The Mach’s almost feel like my Makos did if I skipped the top eyelet.  

[Sniper9 518]

1 hour ago, caseyjones said:

2nd skate didn’t go so great.  I don’t know if going to a size 6 vs a 6.5 changes anything with the boot or if this is just something Mach specific but the forward flex has been an adjustment.  I’ve never ever been able to crank laces all the way up to the top and not have any restriction at all in forward flex.  I’m tripping over my toes on occasion and I feel much less power in my stride compared to the CCMs.  These fit great but performance wise so far, the CCMs felt like I was getting more benefits from a much stiffer and more responsive skate than I am used to.  The Mach’s almost feel like my Makos did if I skipped the top eyelet.  

Take a video of yourself skating. Maybe you're too used to skating with less than ideal ankle flexion and knee bend. I always skip the top eyelets with true skates bc of how stoff they are due to the wrap.  The last ccm skates I wore were the as1s and although I didn't have to skip the top eyelet I did have it looser. For tht machs, the minimal time I had them, I noticed they did have good ankle flexion and definitely wouldn't have been able to drop the top eyelet. I liked the forward flex. You might also need to just get the steel profiled. 

[caseyjones 26]

1 hour ago, Sniper9 said:

Take a video of yourself skating. Maybe you're too used to skating with less than ideal ankle flexion and knee bend. I always skip the top eyelets with true skates bc of how stoff they are due to the wrap.  The last ccm skates I wore were the as1s and although I didn't have to skip the top eyelet I did have it looser. For tht machs, the minimal time I had them, I noticed they did have good ankle flexion and definitely wouldn't have been able to drop the top eyelet. I liked the forward flex. You might also need to just get the steel profiled. 

I don’t think I’d be able to take a video.  I’m pretty used to forward flex.  On the CCMs I was skipping the 2nd to top eyelet, going through the top and then coming back to the 2nd from the top.  I would do that on my makos as well.  Idk if the boot is cut a little lower since I dropped down another half size.  It’s kind of hard to tell when comparing with my other skates.  Just feeling where the tension is from the top lace, it does feel lower than my other skates.  I think the steel has the same 10’ profile.  And I just got step steel and matched it with my fly steel and it’s identical.  Unless the ccm step had an 11’ profile which could be the case. 

Edited December 16, 2023 by caseyjones

[Giltis 116]

You're not wrapping the laces around your ankle are you? 

Either way, just start from scratch as they are new skates with new geometry. Just lace them up normal, and then experiment with one thing at a time. I would try normal, then skipping the top eyelet. Although I am having trouble what you are wanting. Do you want more forward flex or less? Also if you want more flexion, your skate tongue might need breaking in too which will come with time.

[caseyjones 26]

3 hours ago, Giltis said:

You're not wrapping the laces around your ankle are you? 

Either way, just start from scratch as they are new skates with new geometry. Just lace them up normal, and then experiment with one thing at a time. I would try normal, then skipping the top eyelet. Although I am having trouble what you are wanting. Do you want more forward flex or less? Also if you want more flexion, your skate tongue might need breaking in too which will come with time.

No I just lace the Mach‘s normal.  I compared the Mach’s to my 707’s and the top lace on the Bauer’s actually sits higher than on my Grafs but I used to tape my ankles a little bit on the Grafs.  I’m going to assume the cut of the boot was a tad higher on the CCMs.  Skating again tonight with step steel although, I don’t think that’s going to change anything since the profile was identical.  I like to feel resistance in my forward stride but not a limitation.  Idk if that’s confusing but idk how else to describe it.  I think it’s a combination of forward flex and perhaps less steel at the toe which is throwing me off.  But I probably just have to get used to it

[Sniper9 518]

6 hours ago, caseyjones said:

No I just lace the Mach‘s normal.  I compared the Mach’s to my 707’s and the top lace on the Bauer’s actually sits higher than on my Grafs but I used to tape my ankles a little bit on the Grafs.  I’m going to assume the cut of the boot was a tad higher on the CCMs.  Skating again tonight with step steel although, I don’t think that’s going to change anything since the profile was identical.  I like to feel resistance in my forward stride but not a limitation.  Idk if that’s confusing but idk how else to describe it.  I think it’s a combination of forward flex and perhaps less steel at the toe which is throwing me off.  But I probably just have to get used to it

Maybe try tying the machs with the runners loop. Google it if you don't know. I think that might solve some of your issues since it will restrict some flexion at some point in your range of motion since it essentially acts like a lace lock. 

[caseyjones 26]

10 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

Maybe try tying the machs with the runners loop. Google it if you don't know. I think that might solve some of your issues since it will restrict some flexion at some point in your range of motion since it essentially acts like a lace lock. 

Yea I’m familiar with it.  Skated today and mostly felt pretty good.  Definitely like the step steel better than the fly steel. Still tripped a few times, but I think it’s from the profile/runners.  The runners on the ccm felt and looked “chunkier”.  I was surprised I didn’t feel much difference on the ccms from dropping down a runner size, but on the Mach’s I feel it.  I guess I’ll just have to get used to it.  I’m fine when I’m thinking about it, but sometimes when I react on the ice is when I get a little too far on my toes.  Only 3 skates in on these so, I’ll probably need another 3-5 and assuming I’ll adjust.  If not, then maybe an 11ft profile or what I didn’t want to have to do which would be to put a larger holder on, but we’ll see

[caseyjones 26]

Couple quick questions regarding the holder and steel lengths.  I’ve been reading through some old threads about dropping down a holder size and stuff.  But seeing the picture above of my Mach’s, the holder pretty much fills the entire bottom of the skate.  I’m sure I could fit a 263, but the 254 seems to fit that boot well.  It mostly feels fine but like I said, I’ve been stumbling at times when I get a little eager to pounce on pucks or trying to get up to top speed quickly.  So….

1.  Would they have to shave a lot of steel for me to go to an 11’ profile?  I’m assuming I’m skating on a 10’ right now.  Just to try to get a little more steel on the ice towards the toe.  Maybe even a combo radius.

2.  Would keeping the current holders help improve my mechanics?  I never stumble on a 263, but being that the 254 fit these boots properly, could that be a sign that my mechanics need improvement?