Hockey tour through New Zealand

[RadioGaGa 162]

I know guys who have gone on Moose trips before. I've actually played with the Aussies and Scots who have come back this way on a hockey trip. My information is all third party, but everyone says the trips are a blast. Mark Sadgrove (who runs the Canadian Moose) is a great hockey player too.

I think he's also planning something to Iceland later this year.

[knp1288 0]

Sounds good..

Let me know if it comes to Australia next year, I run one of the leagues on the East coast

[bostonjuniorblackhawks 1]

I spoke with Kerry this afternoon and learned that the adult portion of the tour has been cancelled, so what remains will be three games played between former NHL players and current minor leaguers in a US versus Canada format. Apparently, even though this had been advertised for a couple of years, only six players had paid for the tour at this point. Consequently, the group that is staging the games began to worry about hosting games where there might be only seven or eight players on the bench, so they came to the agreement that it would be best to part ways, at least for this year.

Kerry also said everyone wants to bring the tour to Australia next year, as long as it's enough of a success in N.Z. this year.

Are you still going?

[Chadd 916]

I spoke with Kerry this afternoon and learned that the adult portion of the tour has been cancelled, so what remains will be three games played between former NHL players and current minor leaguers in a US versus Canada format. Apparently, even though this had been advertised for a couple of years, only six players had paid for the tour at this point. Consequently, the group that is staging the games began to worry about hosting games where there might be only seven or eight players on the bench, so they came to the agreement that it would be best to part ways, at least for this year.

That's a shame. I had not seen him post anything about the adult teams needing people or I would have signed up. I figured it was booked solid because everything he posted was about the pro side.

[wrangler 157]

That's a shame. I had not seen him post anything about the adult teams needing people or I would have signed up. I figured it was booked solid because everything he posted was about the pro side.

That's a good thing for him to know; maybe he'll talk it up a bit more next year.

[Jason Harris 31]

I'm trying to piece this together based on my conversation with Kerry yesterday, but he became a middle man between the Canadian Moose and DW Webber, the promoter in New Zealand. Somehow, the Canadian Moose and DW Webber became partners in this tour -- maybe because the Moose were trying to schedule an adult tour and came to the attention of DW Webber -- but they had different goals. The Moose wanted to stage a goodwill tour for adults, while DW Webber was looking to make money by promoting a tour with a higher level of hockey. Since Kerry's the type of guy who knows everybody, someone from the Canadian Moose told DW Webber to call him. While Kerry's function was to try to help both groups, the truth is he has far more contacts in the pro world that he does in the beer league world.

I'm just guessing here, Chadd, but I think the reason we saw far more posts from Kerry about the pro side is he knew the adult side was beginning to look questionable before he went to NZ. Actually, the more I think about, he hinted to me that the whole tour was beginning to look questionable, which is why he made an unscheduled trip to NZ to help market it. By that time, however, the Auckland date started to sell well, leading DW Webber to realize they would likely make more money in ticket sales if they ponied up more money to pay for all the pros' expenses. However, they began to worry about the low sales of the adult tour; I think it's possible that some of the adult games against local players were actually going to be paid events, so maybe DW Webber was worried it would reflect poorly on them.

What Kerry feels terrible about is he knows a few guys with the Canadian Moose, since they were the ones that introduced him to DW Webber, but the relationship between the Moose and DW began to fracture. I had said earlier that the two sides agreed to part ways at this time, but I'm positive that those six who had paid were rather irritated to have a dream vacation cancelled.

BJBH, to answer your question of whether I'm still going? Maybe. I'm a partner with Kerry, but a small partner. And while there are things I could do to help on this tour, including meeting with the folks from DW Webber and giving feedback for the potential Australian tour, it's obviously a lot more expensive for me to join him in NZ than it is in Las Vegas. However, it may be that if I can get myself there, Kerry can cover the expenses of the tour itself, so it's my rather cool wife telling me I should use frequent flyer miles and not pass up such a great opportunity, even though I'd be the only one going.

So, we'll see, but if it ends up being too much money out of pocket for me, it wouldn't be fair to my family to spend that money....especially since my wife actually makes way more bacon than me!

[bostonjuniorblackhawks 1]

That's too bad. I'd be interested in going to Australia next year if it ends up happening. I would have signed up for this tour when you started this thread, but I am already going to NZ and Australia in July

[Jason Harris 31]

An indication of how much fun it is to work with Kerry, who's one of my good friends.

He sends me an email ten days ago, asking me to call him to on Sunday to talk about the tour. I call and leave a message. Again on Wednesday, as well as today. Now, I've worked with him long enough to know that he gets incredibly busy, just as I know that budgets are tight, which is one reason I haven't cancelled my tickets to join the family in SD, since they'll be there when the tour's going on. I start to think that maybe we could go to Disneyland for a couple of days, when the phone rings.

"Hey, can you ref???"

[Jason Harris 31]

I just learned that I am officially one of the refs. Here's the story.

Apparently, the New Zealand Hockey Federation didn't like that the promotors were A) doing this for profit; and B) didn't come to the NZHF first. Consequently, they had a stare down in which the NZHF refused to sanction anything; there were plans to have little kids skate between periods, as well as the pros holding clinics to teach the NZ youth the finer points of hockey, but none of that will happen now. As I understand, the NZHF even went so far as calling the NHLPA to let them know that current NHL players would be involved in an exhibition game with hitting.

That led to me being one of the refs, which I have done in the past, although with tortoises on the ice, not hares. Also, I don't have ref pants, leading to my question whether anyone has any old pants I could buy, rent or borrow for the two weeks? Thanks in advance if anyone does!

[wrangler 157]

Maybe I missed something earlier, but why do you need the NZHF? Contacts/infrastructure?

It's a shame they don't seem to be particularly concerned about promoting the sport.

[Jason Harris 31]

I guess the answer is they don't need the NZHF to have a hockey tour through New Zealand, but having the NZHF's blessing allows them to have a better tour....for the New Zealanders.

It's not as though this was a Canadian promotor who wanted to make money by bringing a tour into NZ. These were New Zealand promotors who hoped to make money by selling a product that they thought people would be interested in seeing. It's no different than if they brought in a Russian ballet or Chinese acrobats or BMX riders or whatever. They put up their own money in the hopes of making more money. Indeed, they originally only budgeted a small amount to bring pros over, then came to the belief that they could make more revenue (and profit) if they paid for all the pros, even though it meant a quarter million more in outlays. If they were wrong in that prediction, it meant they'd lose money.

To increase the reach of their marketing, they tried to schedule events with the youth leagues throughout the country; from what I understand, that is what rubbed the NZHF the wrong way -- the fact that they came to the NZHF after the fact. The way the NZHF reacted, it's almost as though they wanted to bully the promotors. But, besides the few Canadian adults who had paid to go on an NZ hockey tour, only to see it cancelled, the only people who lost during this whole affair were the youth hockey players of New Zealand, because even for a few days they had the opportunity to learn from players who are all pros in North America.

Of course, now the get to see me ref, which would be a little akin to seeing the clowns at the rodeo!

[wrangler 157]

Sounds like an ego problem. It would be nice if the word got out to NZ kids and parents, so they know who to thank.

[Chadd 916]

I wish this article had come out a few months back, I probably would have gone along.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10737380

[Drewhunz 3]

Maybe I missed something earlier, but why do you need the NZHF? Contacts/infrastructure?

It's a shame they don't seem to be particularly concerned about promoting the sport.

Hmm. They must be getting advice from USA Hockey.

[Vet88 674]

NZIHA didn't sanction the event because it was not organised thru them. Basically it's egos and politics that got in the way and once their nose was out of joint they weren't going to do anything to help it.

Initially they were going to come out against the event (as it promoted "hitting" was their reason) but after feedback from their members they just adopted a neutral stance, neither for or against.

It is a shame that the camps didn't happen, I thought it was a great idea and not just for the coaching. There are a few kids in New Zealand who are exceptionally talented and are good enough to be looked at for trials, camps, scholarships etc and these camps would have been the perfect place to possibly make some introductions.

[Vet88 674]

I spoke with Kerry this afternoon and learned that the adult portion of the tour has been cancelled, so what remains will be three games played between former NHL players and current minor leaguers in a US versus Canada format. Apparently, even though this had been advertised for a couple of years, only six players had paid for the tour at this point. Consequently, the group that is staging the games began to worry about hosting games where there might be only seven or eight players on the bench, so they came to the agreement that it would be best to part ways, at least for this year.

Kerry also said everyone wants to bring the tour to Australia next year, as long as it's enough of a success in N.Z. this year.

It's a shame this didn't happen and that some of us here in NZ didn't know about what was going on. If you only had 7 or 8 players on the bench I know of a few senior players here in NZ who would have given their right arm to fill a few spots, and we are not talking just beer league skaters but NZ reps from a host of ages from U16's right through to open grades.

Still, really looking forward to seeing the games here in NZ, even with the players that are coming down they will be a few levels above what we see here on a weekly basis.....

[Jason Harris 31]

I wish this article had come out a few months back, I probably would have gone along.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10737380

I wish that article had come out 16 years, 272 days, 1 hour, 6 minutes and 3 seconds ago. But that's just a guess. You know, off the top of my head....

I continue to be amused by the number of people in Denver who know about this tour. My daughters had a hockey practice yesterday and I was helping coach on the ice, so the Big D and some other parents were talking with the guy who's trying to establish the girls' program. She obviously told him about the trip, because he said, "Reffing in New Zealand, that's pretty cool! You know Cully's going on the trip?"

"Who's Cully?"

"Brent Cullaton? Coach of the Jr. Bisons? He's daughter Peyton played with us?"

I recognized his daughter's name, although I think she had only played one game during a tournament, but I was trying to figure out how this guy had heard of the tour. I figured it had to be through Kyle Quincey and Derek Armstrong, and, sure enough, when I did a little research I discovered he was "proud to be invited onto the Canadian team by Kerry Goulet," who learned about him from Quincey and Army. I know that Aaron Miller had played with the Avs, as well as Army had asked Ken Klee, because I also asked him since I know him slightly through coaching baseball together, so it wouldn't surprise me if there are more players with Denver ties.

I also discovered the rosters while I was researching. One interesting name is Bates Battaglia, whom I suspect Joe Casasanta with Oggie Grips must know, because I believe Bates has been using the Ergo grips for a couple of seasons.

USA

03 D - Aaron Miller (Captain)

Born 11/03/71 Baffalo, NY

677 NHL Games

55 D - Ryan Turek

Born 22/09/87 Southfield, MI

2008 - 11 ECHL

02 D - Cody Lampl

Born 19/06/86 Ketchum, ID

ECHL & AHL

13 F - Bates Battaglia

Born 13/12/75 Chicago, IL

80 NHL Goals

27 F - Ryan Weston

Born 09/01/84 Henniker, NH

ECHL & AHL

74 D - Nick Tuzzolino

Born 19/01/86 Buffalo, NY

ECHL & AHL

04 D - Jake Gannon

Born 25/01/87 Roselle, IL

ECHL & AHL

22 D - Jamie Fritsch

Born 25/02/85 Odenton, MD

ECHL & AHL

26 F - Anthony Battaglia

Born 15/08/79 Chicago, IL

ECHL & CHL

09 F - Blake Barkwell

Born 07/01/87 Winnipeg, MB

WHL

47 G - John Grahame (Goal)

Born 31/08/75 Denver, CO

Stanley Cup Win

CANADA

02 D - Adrian Veideman

Born 04/13/83 Sicamous, BC

AHL & DEL

36 D - Brent Cullaton

Born 12/11/74 Petawawa, ON

3 times CHL All-star

09 F - Derek Armstrong (Captain)

Born 23/04/73 Ottawa, ON

477 NHL games

03 F - Mark Hartigan

Born 15/10/77 Lethbridge, AB

AHL & NHL

84 F - Kevin Doell

Born 15/07/79 Saskatoon, SK

AHL & NHL

41 D - Aaron MacKenzie

Born 27/03/81 Terrace Bay, ON

AHL & NHL

42 D - Tommy Frew

Born 20/09/74 St Catharines, ON

COJHL

08 F - Julian Talbot

Born 24/03/85 Wahnapitae, ON

ECHL & AHL

18 F - Cam Paddock

Born 22/03/83 Vancouver, BC

AHL & NHL

11 F - Brad Smyth

Born 13/03/73 Ottawa, ON

AHL & NHL

01 G - Andrew Engelage

Born 26/10/88 Oshawa, ON

Memorial Cup Win

[Vet88 674]

Just returned from watching the 1st game in Auckland. 4 - 3 to Team Canada after a penalty time shoot out, fantastic game, some great hits, moves, skating etc.

From myself and the full house of fans that were there, many thanks to the organisers for putting this together because it sure as heck was a million times better than any other hockey we have ever seen live in this part of the world....

[Jason Harris 31]

It's not possible to fuck up as much as I did as a ref the other night, but it still turned out alright!

The Auckland game will go down as one of the highlights of my life. It started the night before, when we drove to another rink (Avondale) to practice, because Vector Arena doesn't have an ice rink, so the temporary rink they were building was still curing. It was so much fun watching those guys. Other than NHL games I've gone to, this was easily the highest level of talent I've ever seen at a rink. Maybe eight of the guys have had NHL experience, while all but one play in high minors. What I found interesting is, even though they play on different teams, they immediately fell into place in the drills, which had recognizable elements from game play. When they scrimmaged, they had me referee, since it was around five years since I last reffed.

Fuhgedaboutit!

It was absolutely impossible for me to keep up with the play as only one ref, and a few of the guys said that even NHL refs couldn't keep up, because of the stretch passes that those guys constantly try. Because of that, one of the players gave me advice for the game that sounded great, but didn't work out as well, which I'll explain shortly.

Onto game night. Vector Arena was newer and bigger (10,500) than most of of us were expecting, and it was sold out, with thousands of the fans arriving 30-60 minutes before the doors opened. To add to the showcase, they had fireworks on the ice, which had a side effect no one was expecting; it left debris, including plastic film on the ice, so the other ref and I had to spend 15 minutes scraping the ice with the grounds crew to make it safe. It was shocking how loud the crowd became, especially after the team captains (Derek Armstrong and Aaron Miller) started "fighting." The crowd went wild and, because they sold the tickets in groups, it was unexpected to start hearing "USA! USA!" from my left, quickly matched by "Canada! Canada!" on my right.

Canada went ahead 2-0 after the first, with a bit of ribbing by the players, proving to be the warm-up act for the second, when the players really gave it to us. I mentioned one of the players gave me advice; Derek Armstrong had suggested we not cover the ice as much as refs normally would -- staying goal line to first blue line -- which sounded smart, but ended up putting me out of position on US's first goal, which Canada claimed was kicked in, but the goalie himself was blocking my view, so I couldn't see anything. A possible goalie interference I let slide -- I thought the players were wrestling each other before they crashed into the net, but the truth is it happens so fast with these guys-- was followed by a goal three seconds later and the game was suddenly tied. It was at that time I heard my first, "Put on your freakin' glasses, ref!"

The US scored a goal, then Bates Battaglia had a breakaway, during which Mark Hartigan shoved him from behind into the net, which became dislodged and slammed into the back boards. I called a penalty shot, which was blocked, but it was amazing how much legitimate grief the Canadian players were giving me. Ultimately, Canada scored with maybe two minutes left in the game. The majority of the crowd was pro-Canadian, so they went nuts. We had a shoot out for OT, which was going great until I reared my ugly head.

The US team was ahead 2-1 through four pairs, leaving Derek Armstrong up for Canada. Kerry Goulet was announcing the game, and I heard him say, "It's sudden death. either Derek Armstrong scores this goal to send us to another round or the US will win the game!" Arny scored, the crowd went nuts, the US player missed a shot, then the Canadian player scored another goal. I couldn't understand why my partner didn't end the game, so finally after a long pause, I called the game by pointing to Canada. They came out to shake hands, whereupon the Americans told me, "But they shot first! We should get another shot!"

They were right. Canada had started the shoot out, but when I heard Kerry's announcement about Sudden Death, it confused me into thinking Army was the last skater. We gave the Americans another shot, they scored, then Canada scored again, before the Americans missed, and the crowd was delirious.

Rather embarrassing to lose track like that but, man, what a memory!

[Vet88 674]

Hey Jason, I saw Derek giving you plenty of grief and would have to agree with him, the first 2 USA goals were pretty suspect although I do say this with my semi rose tinted Canadian glasses on! However their 3rd goal was a real peach and you wouldn't see better anywhere else.

Was it you who got flattened a couple of times by the players, especially the one where the USA player knocked the ref over when on the boards???

And as to the mix up at the shoot out, no one I spoke to even mentioned it, all part of the spectacle and as an ex ref I know how easy it is to lose track of things sometimes. Well done and enjoy your next two games, they should be even faster now the players have acclimatised and had their first run.......

[Chadd 916]

Doing a game like that by yourself is just asking for trouble. See, you should have had me come along.

[Jason Harris 31]

No, we had the second ref for the game. He's a New Zealander who lives in Australia, and he flew in on Friday night. He's off visiting family, so I'll ref by myself if these guys have a scrimmage during practice tomorrow.

The big mistake with going "goal line to first blue line" is I found myself not going as deep toward the goal line, since I wanted to be able to get to the blue to tell if the puck went out. I know that hurt me with the first goal, because I wasn't close enough to see past the goalie to know whether it was kicked in, and my partner was done at the other blue line, so he couldn't see either. We'll play with normal two-man positioning next game. The goalie interference was tough. It happens so quickly and I still don't know whether it should have been an interference; I admit I tend to side with a player when contact between the two skaters might cause the offensive guy to lose his balance, but in retrospect I probably should have protected the goalie more.

I forgot one other screwup I made. One of the Canadians kind of tripped the American from behind, which was pretty blatant, so I called it. However, apparently I need to get glasses, because I somehow was positive it was Army who had done it and thought he was putting on a show of not going to the box. I don't know how I immediately lost track of the skater, because the whistle happened two seconds later, but I somehow managed to lose sight of the skater -- who had gone to the box.

Vet, the other ref was the one who got plowed, However, I didn't escape unscathed. I think Anthony Battaglia was coming around from his goal with speed, about twelve feet from me. Without knowing which way he wanted to go, I just stood still. He went around my right, but clipped my skate, so I went done.

Still, as I said, this has been a lot of fun!

[Chadd 916]

Doing a solo game, I would suggest trying to be somewhere around the hash marks. It gives you the best chance to see the blue line and any action around the net. You will get burned at some point where you expect the puck to clear and somehow it stays in the zone or vice versa.

[Jason Harris 31]

I was going to type a humorous story about Army and Millsy -- that's what everybody calls them -- but there may be a postscript.

I've been one of the chauffeurs, which some of the guys find humorous because I'll have just arrived and they'll say, "Hey, you're not doing anything; take us back to the hotel." The truth, however, is we're squeezing eight people into each minivan, many of them very decent sized men, so I much prefer having the space in the driver's seat.

Anyway, tonight I had Army, Millsy and a guy named Cully that it turns out I had met before because he taught my girls at Planet Hockey. It was the first chance Army and I had to talk about the game and the calls that were made. You have to understand that Army is like Jeckyl and Hyde with his on- and off-ice personas. He is all business on-ice, but he dances to his own drum off-ice, and there's no doubt he's the center of attention. Sometimes, it's charming, but he just pushes it too far most of the time. Millsy, on the other hand, is fairly calm, maybe even cerebral, yet the two of them seem like Mutt and Jeff as friends.

Anyway, somehow the topic turned to the next game, Army was getting blustery, and Millsy told him he would shut him down. For ten minutes, it was a repeat of:

"You're saying I won't score???"

"I'm saying you won't get a scoring chance!!"

"You're saying I won't be able to get off a random backhander somehow?!?"

"How are you going to get a backhander when you're not even going to get a pass???"

"You're saying you're going to be able to cover me and still cover other people at the same time???"

"No, I'm not. I might give up twenty two-on-ones, but I'm saying you won't touch the puck!!"

These guys may have been joking, but they were absolutely serious. I can't tell you how funny it was to listen to. We had been invited for a cocktail party at the home of the American Consulate General, so Cully and I told the guys from the other vans about the conversation. Army, being Army, snaps at me that he had already told me that whatever happens in Vegas stays in Vegas, then he proceeded to continue the argument at the house in front of the other guys.

After we returned to the hotel, I heard those guys stayed in for the first time, although they were supposed to be partying in Millsy's room. They've set up a room for us to use the internet, so I was about to type this when one guy stuck his head in and said to us, "Army and Millsy had a full-on tilt!"

"Wait, are you saying those guys got in a fight?!?!?"

"I'm saying that we won't be able to stay in this hotel after tonight!"

[Jason Harris 31]

Anybody know where I might be able to access a t-blade wrench or side stone in either Christchurch or Dunedin -- even if I'm just borrowing them for thirty seconds? I brought them along on the trip but they somehow fell out of my bag.