CB Raffle...what a waste.

[CAINE 0]

First, let me say that I had no comment on the CB breakup because I was in no position to present an informed commentary. I paid close attention to what was said and by whom and think I've got a fair impression, albeit as an outsider, of what was #17's undoing. That said, I gave $100 to CB for the raffle because, a ) I didn't think too many of the younger members would be able to/want to support the board and b ) I've blown more $$$ on worse things. If the timing was different by a few weeks, I would not have donated a cent. What follows is correspondence between #17 and my self today via PM. Bear in mind I emailed him twice and got no response in the past 2 weeks.

From: caine

To: #17

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2004 6:47 am

Subject: Sande 980 pants from the raffle?

I won the Sande pants in the raffle. Were the black or navy available in large? If they haven't shipped, when should I expect them?

Thanks,

Colin

From: caine

To: #17

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:15 am

Subject: Re: Sande 980 pants from the raffle?

#17 wrote:

I don't know much about them, but I know they haven't been shipped out yet.

Well that's not an informative response. Could you please look into this and get back to me with a response that's a bit more substantive?

Colin

From: #17

To: caine

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:40 am

Subject: Re: Sande 980 pants from the raffle?

There's all the info you'll need... It's a prize and you'll get your prize when it suites to Sande. Their top priority is not to give out free stuff. It's a busy time for them right now.

What a megalomaniacal dick! I couldn't give a rat's ass about the damn pants but, with responses like these it is apparent that he doesn't give a sh*t since the bills are paid. We ain't gotta be drinkin' buddies but I'd expect the a**hole to at least be civilized! I'm not done but I'll stop now!!!

If I'm out of line and the one being the knobhead I apologize for the time it took to read this.

[GekigangarIII 0]

Funny how Sande is too busy to worry about "free things", yet they're all too happy to try and 'pre-charge' on bookings and then fail to deliver them... ironic.

[Fire0nIce228 1]

I got my Carter signed M-1 last week. Ironic how I only donated 5 bucks but won something. All 17 said when I PM'ed him was "Its all taken care of".

[Dave 1]

Well, make a fuss about it on CB. I did with my custom gloves and they were available two days later. Sande hates bad news about his company. And Markku (#17) will hate a re-cooking of the raffle-issue.

Or contact Gary Sande directly. He seems to be more customer friendly than the shop.corebeam.net sales-person is.

[EricG. 0]

I'm waiting on my Carter M-1s still, but I'm patient.

[Markku 0]

First of all, other prize providers are "extremely swamped" right now, not only Sande. I don't want to do any harm to other companies by this, but I just want to point out that other prizes haven't shipped out yet also. Some have, some haven't.

Second of all, it's shameful to show personal messages in public. I take a big offence of that. You have won a prize and it will be delivered to you. That should be enough information for you. And I've been making sure that everyone is getting what they want. This is part of a email I got from a winner:

"... haven't gotten anything yet. I'll let you know when I get them. Thanks a lot for having the raffle and following up!"

Third of all, I'm too busy nowadays to answer all the email I get. If I don't have the information you need, I don't waste my time to reply a message that has no informative value.

Too bad this kind of stuff is allowed here. If you have personal issues against me, come to me. There's no point harming a company's reputation that hasn't done anything wrong in this matter. Also I think you don't have any basis of calling me to those things you called and blamed me of. I don't expect any appoligy from you, and I don't need one and your pants will be delivered to you. But I'd rather see the squad making sure there's no this kind of outbursts that will harm other people and companies.

And Dave, I have never had any problems talking about the raffle. It didn't turn out as big as everyone thought it would become and I feel truly sorry that some companies' name got bit stained in this. But I got eleven guys happy with this raffle, I managed to pay Chadd for those hats so he didn't have to get the losses and I got to pay the bills at the same time.

I truly wish that this discussion will be either deleted or removed as there's no basis of continuing this discussion without mud throwing or going off-topic.

[QandA 0]

Oh well, hopefully everyone gets their prizes and everybody turns out happy!!! ;)

[LegoDoom 0]

You have to understand something Markku... it's not like these guys just got selected for a prize. They did pay some money to help your site and now you won't respond so some emails? If there's no news, then tell them that you haven't been provided with any news. Don't act like it's a big inconvenience for you to answer to people who helped your site get the funding it needed. Not only is it not professional, but it turns people away who might be loyal to your site.

As far as deleting posts.... that's kind of the pot calling the kettle black being as you deleted a bunch of the mods posts and locked topics when YOU didn't like what was being said. If people aren't getting answers that they need in conversations with you, then there's no problem in stating concerns.

[Chadd 916]

While I can understand many of the things you posted Markku, I have to take issue with the tone of your responses to Caine. As Lego said, when you take money from people it adds certain obligations on your part. I'm sure the only reason it was posted here was so it wouldn't get deleted by you or one of the mods at CB.

[CAINE 0]

Markku I'll try to stay on topic and not sling any mud.

First:

If suppliers are swamped, an email stating this would be appropriate and appreciated.

Second:

Do not think for one second that you can use any tone you feel is appropriate in a personal message, just because it's personal. My initial contact with you was in response to you "Congratulations" email and was:

If possible, I'd like the 980s in size Large in Black. My 2nd chioce is Navy.

Please ship them to:

XXXXX XXXXXX

XXXX N. Magnolia

Chicago, IL 60614

USA

Glad I could help CoreBeam.net!

Do not attempt to imply I'm an unhappy winner, and the only unhappy, winner if you can't/won't produce a list of winners and the status of the prizes.

Third:

If you're busy, say that. If you don't know what's going on, say that or say nothing. I hate to break it to you but your "hobby" requires some "people skills." You should show decorum and display a modicum of respect to those with whom you're dealing. You're saying you don't have time to "to reply a message that has no informative value" but, that's exactly what you did.

You insert statements about "harming a company's reputation that hasn't done anything wrong in this matter" and, that I "don't have any basis of calling me to those things you called and blamed me of." No reputation was unduly harmed by my post and I didn't "blame you of anything."

The most most galling thing is you close by telling the "Mods" how to run this board.

Before you fire off any more responses that reinforce you stellar public image, please check yourself.

[GekigangarIII 0]

too busy to send a reply to an email but not busy enough to have time to track down a post on another message board, register, and make a 2 page post about it? I'm con-fu-sed...

just saying..

[JR Boucicaut 3804]

He's been lurking for weeks now.

We didn't go out of our way and ban him...I saw him register, and post. I just let it slide :)

[Kirsch 1]

I haven't commmented on anything that happened at CB simply because I have no idea what had been going on. I had only been a member of that board for a few days. I have no preconceived notions based on expieriences with any of the people involved simply because I'm new to the community.

Saying that I'm not going to comment on the "happenings" but I will say this: The way you (Markku) handled that response from a customer, and yes you are running a business because you do make money and from what I have gathered do profit from it, was absolutely attrocious. If a customer support representitive had simply said what you had said they would have been fired and that business's practices would seriously be questioned, and from the looks of it they have been.

As others have stated these people did donate money. They didn't purchase a porduct, they donated that money, and treating them with anything other than appreciation is simply wrong. This situation would never have come about if you had simply said that the companies were busy and that you will receive your prize, because granted these are prizes and companies should be more conscerned with the products making them profit, that much is understandable.

In summary this situation could have been completely defused had you simply stated even basic information in a polite tone. It is as simple as that.

[Eman24dx 0]

I'm glad you guys don't delete anything thats what makes this a great place, everything is out in the open. And thats why I VERY rarely ever visit the other site. Even though this site has less members theres much better quality Info and no post are deleted.

[JR Boucicaut 3804]

We didn't want it to get here, however, it has. We'll be monitoring the situation and if anything arises, we'll be able to handle it.

[Chadd 916]

Even though this site has less members theres much better quality Info and no post are deleted.

The number of active members is not very similar to the overall numbers and I actually delete posts. I only do it if they don't offer anything constructive, not out of censorship. That would be wrong.