Vet88

Try this - lace up and go for a skate and concentrate on what your feet are telling you. My bet is it is bugger all, you aren't getting any feedback from the blade and the way it is working under your foot. Now go for a skate with your laces undone, every little twist, edge, catch in the ice is felt. We are genetically designed to do anything as energy efficient as we possibly can BUT... the brain has to know what is going on so it can work out how to be energy efficient. Laced up and you are still skating so the brain thinks this is ok, the only thing it's got to compare with is how you walk and run, it knows no different. Unlaced and now your muscles are having to work to not only control your balance over the blade but also how you put power INTO the blade - this part is really important. Maximum transfer of energy without the crutch of the boot. Your foot can't fold, you will feel it immediately. Your alignment straightens up, it has to as your brain demands it because it now knows what it is costing you to skate unbalanced over the blade. I skate every day, 1 - 2 hours a day (and always with no laces) so it's hard for me to give a figure for someone who skates once or twice a week. But skaters I have coached show literally immediate results during a single lesson. Yes, you are skating slow but the way you start balancing over the blade is immediately noticeable. That wobble is important, your brain is now working out how to use your muscles in the most efficient manner to control the edge. Every time you skate you are improving. Video yourself, especially from front or behind so you can see how your blade starts to straighten up under your foot. For those who are fortunate to have skating dna then this will be just a tune up but for the other 95% of the population out there (that is the number who pronate / supinate / have alignment issues) then this becomes a revelation. there is always something in the way you skate that needs improving and skating with laces undone brutally exposes it. For me one of the key things about this is it isn't dependent on the skate you are in, a coach who is training you or even how long you have skated. It's all about you, your body alignment and how well you can control the skate blade. Teach yourself with built in auto correction (your brain).

When I started I was slow as hell, any attempt to stride out caused my heel to lift. I used to lace all the way up for games. Over time the way my feet worked in the boot changed and my push became much smoother, harder and flatter and my heel stopped lifting. I now prefer to skate laces untied over laced up, as others have commented it becomes about as natural as walking. Performance wise it's been bloody hard, pushing hard and feeling your ankles collapse under you is really really frustrating but over time my ankle has got stronger and my control of the blade has improved to the point I can now go flat out with no laces and no thoughts about heel lock etc The 4 eyelets lock my forefoot into place, provides a little more stability and is game compliant (once I managed to get the national head ref controller to approve it). But I do wear skate fenders, the space where the tongue lifts out of the boot and leaves the foot exposed is not something I will risk in a game..

And I had this discussion a while ago with other coaches at a seminar. It's not in US LTP programme, we have never heard about it, that's not what I was taught etc etc are the excuses. Me - Why are you telling the to tie their laces tight? Reply - Oh, because it makes them more stable. Me - Yes - but it doesn't fix the problem..... Yet ask them about a skater who drops 1 eyelet. this is perfectly acceptable. What about a skater who drops 2? Or 3? Or 4? When does this become "I've never heard of that"? Tell that to the young elite NHL skaters coming thru atm and are dropping eyelets. Bottom line is you either give it a go or not, I'm not trying to sell anyone snake oil here or ask you to sign up for a service or training programme or try to take your money. It's free advice based on hard experience and been involved in a (so far) 3 year long varsity research project looking into specifically this issue. And this is the consistent thing, the deniers are those who have NEVER tried it yet everyone who I have had try it (from beginner to experienced) has never said it didn't help..The degrees of improvement are based on your bio mechanics..

Yes, it's a training technique, not a game situation. Putting aside the safety risk, IIHF rules state you must have laces but you can tie them in any manner you want (this includes how many eyelets you may want to lace up, I only do the bottom 4 now for games). When you first start you may feel like your skates are going to come off, especially when you try to accelerate (heel is lifting out of the pocket). However over time your body learns to readjust and stop doing "walking / running" motions with the feet and do ice skating specific motions. Your skating becomes much more smoother. I often train with skates 2 sizes too big for me (no heel lock, very sloppy fit) and no laces, specifically for proprioception training, it's all in the stride.

And you touch on a valid point. Ask someone who has never had a problem in their skates about pronation or feet that don't feel right in the skates or why I can't stop on one side etc etc and 99% of the time they just look at you blankly. They can't understand why you have issues. As the saying goes, "what you don't know you don't know".It's just your skates, you need to skate more, you need a deeper hollow and so it goes Lets look at a another sport, running. There is a huge industry built around addressing your bio mechanics as you run, even for the casual runner of once or twice a week. Most decent shops that sell running shoes will offer a gait analysis process in store and suggest fixes such as orthotics or different shoes to what you were looking at / using. Ice skates are much more complex yet what does the ice hockey world do about this? Zilch. Except those who actually know it is problem (@OldTrainerGuy and the work he does to make sure the skates you have purchased will work for you). It's a general industry problem and if it doesn't get addressed when you purchase the skates you carry on blissfully unaware of the issue until it begins to bite you in the ass with lace bite, sore feet, bunions, bumps, etc and why you still suck at skating 2 years later yet the guy next to you who started at the same time is light years ahead of you.....

I'm a level 2 certified coach, been coaching ice and inline for 15 years. But I didn't invent this, other much better qualified coaches than me have done this. For example look at this . Wally Kozak is one of the most respected coaches out there.

I never said irrelevant, I said it is secondary. Bio mechanics should be the first and most important consideration because if you don't get that correct you will never be able to control the skate correctly. And laces undone is hard, I won't deny it. But getting your holder alignment correct isn't a physically hard thing to do and any age can do it, it's skate related not age. This is the problem with hockey and attitudes like this, bio mechanics don't really matter / are something I might fix later. This is just bs. Racing slicks on a prius is like your hollow on a skate, driving a prius blindfolded is more akin to not addressing your bio mechanics.

I put it like this - when are you making the most mistakes? When you are learning. Training, regardless of the frequency, is pointless if all you are doing is repeating the same mistakes over and over again. If the skater is unbalanced at the start, extra stiff skates, more training etc does not address this, at least in a quick time frame. Sure, skate for 10 years and you will slowly improve. Or you can fix your alignment issues and start to skate better from the beginning. As to figure and speed and any half decent skating teacher, they should haul your ass of the ice immediately and start fixing your alignment with holder movement / shimming if they look at you and see you aren't aligned over your skates. Both figure and speed worked this out years ago, hockey tried with MLX then it got buried. And from many other posts in this forum and others, skaters have commented about going to camps run by ex NHL players and other qualified trainers and them asking players to undo their laces. It doesn't make things worse, it just makes it harder until you learn to control your muscles. Ironically those who pronate really badly get the most benefit instantly because of the feedback they start to get from their feet with laces undone as opposed to the quasi ski boot approach and lace up as tight as you can. Been there, done that, coached and seen dozens of skaters instantly improve with it.

If you had asked me this 3 years ago I'd have said this is true. But today imho it's all opinionated bs, just like my comments following. Let me put this out there - IT'S NOT THE SKATE. It's you and your bio mechanics. It's as simple as this even though bio mechanics in skates is a complex issue. If your bio mechanics are correct you can skate in anything - even clods with a frame bolted to them. Stiffness, heel lock, volume, length, forefoot width, profile, hollow etc are all secondary, you don't need this to be anywhere near perfect to skate well. What you need is good body alignment over the skate blade. Yes, stiffer skates will generally help you to skate a little better but they will not TEACH you to skate better. If you want to skate better fix your bio mechanics first, make sure the holder is aligned central to your foot / ankle / knee / hip alignment. Then shim for ankle / knee / hip deviation. This is the quick fix but it comes with some issues, especially for beginning skaters and how their body adapts to skating over time. Or learn to skate with your laces undone, stop using the boot as a crutch / excuse and teach yourself how to balance over the blade. Even holder alignment becomes less important. Add in strength work for legs and core and then you wont care what skate you are in as long as it is comfortable on your foot. Age, sex, size, weight, skating experience and equipment are irrelevant, anyone can learn to do this. Downside is you have to put in the time and effort and it is a long term development, upside is that over time you create the base to become the best skater you can possibly be.

Eyelet extenders, these are the fix for volume issues if everything else about the boot is ok. It's not hard to make your own especially if you want single or 2 hole extenders. Otherwise there are 3 hole ones you can buy.

Have a watch of this, it's long at an hour and 22 but there are some real nuggets of knowledge in it.

+1 for this, I got exactly the same guidance at a ref course from the guy who was the head ref for the Canadian junior league. And you can practice this as you ref games. Pick any point in a game and pick a player, then at the start of the next play recall the number and colour. As you keep at it you get much better so that it starts to become second nature. Then add the supposed penalty call so you get all the elements together.

Unless you have volume issues and or lace bite. Then, outside of customs, it's one of the few things that will keep you in your skates. http://greatsaves.org/skate_lace_extenders.html

You need to talk to the LHS and work with them. Take physical measurements of your foot then compare this to the scan data AND the additional comments / info the LHS sent to True. If this all correlates then the LHS need to ask True why the boot differs from the info supplied. Work out how much longer / shorter the boot should be, where it needs to be narrower / deeper, cut differently etc etc. I have seen cases where True have misinterpreted the LHS supplied data and made the boot wrong. Mistakes happen, it's a fact of life. And I'll say it again - Both at the scan / measuring stage and at the boot fitting stage, it's really important to have a fitter who knows his stuff. This will reduce the chance of errors when they are made and to recognise that the boot isn't right at fitting time and to provide the assistance you need to get it fixed. 6 months down the track and they are still tinkering with the boot to try and get it to work, that isn't a good recommendation of the LHS imho.

There are a lot of examples where the skate has been made wrong because the scan data was either wrong or interpreted incorrectly (a lot of this does depend on the skill of the fitter, the better they are the better the chance of True getting it right). In all of the cases that I know of True have remade the skate using feedback from what is wrong with the current one to ensure the remake is correct. On the odd occasion this hasn't worked but generally the 2nd time around they get it right.

Do goalie boots come with shot blockers built in? If you added these (as you can add them to player boots I assume you could add them to goalie boots) then they would beef up the boot considerably.

Interesting as I'm one of these customers. Durability? I gather you would liberally paint it on so you get full penetration into the eyelet?

You can get those and others on android, just search in the play store. For example I've used CoachNow on a Nokia Sirrocco phone and the slow mo is good at 8:1, you can add feedback etc and then post to the space or group or player you are working with. If you want to clip the vid I use Lightworks on a pc and then can post to a lot of different media, it's free and does just about everything you would ever want to do when editing.

Creating a pocket in the heel for a bump is really hard to do unless you have the right tools or the material on the inside of the heel has enough thickness to make a pocket. If not the latter (first skates I dd this on were pro spec apx2's that had very thin inner heel material), the heel is a very reinforced, circular area and it takes a lot of pressure to make it move. Typical punches don't work because they actually push the outer area of the punch inwards in the heel whilst you get a little bit of movement in the middle of the punch ergo no result. You need a punch that is shaped liked the heel for the punch to work or you can do this: I made a frame that clamped and locked the boot into the middle of it and attached another frame that sat outside the quarter panel where I wanted the punch to occur. Then I used a c clamp to pull the heel area at that spot out with heat added. You need a lot of pressure to get the heel to move so you have to be careful here with the heat and pressure or else you can distort the shape of the heel. This worked ok but it is a slow process. I now have access to a 3D printer and I print up a punch according to the boot size, heel shape and position of the punch. Good luck with the tissue process but I wouldn't be holding my breath, heat and pressure will most likely give you the best result.

Because they make mistakes, even after repeated attempts at remakes. He has every right to be concerned. What I don't get is why the customer is not more involved in the "remake" process, surely True want to get it right next time??? How hard would it be for True to tell you "we are going to do this, this and this, do you agree?" and the customer signs off on it. I'd rather have the remake take a little bit longer because of extra communication than have it done asap. But maybe that's just me showing my age and preferring to "do it once, do it right." Instead the remake disappears into a black hole and you just hope to god it comes out the other side ok. And to give True their credit, most of the time it does as long as the information they are receiving is correct AND correctly acted upon. But when it goes amiss you end up in situation like smu is in and its still not right after 3 attempts.

Haha, I had to do a double take of that picture. At first glance I thought, jeez, someone left the nets out and it snowed really really hard overnight. And then I saw the bottom bar.... Jokes aside, that looks and sounds about as close to heaven one could get. And you can be legally happy whilst doing it, sigh. It sure as hell beats the 2 rinks we have atm, it's 35 degrees outside and the plant can't keep up, the zamboni cuts the ice and 20 minutes later there are still pools of water over half the rink. Puck work is just shite and you have to saucer every pass just to make sure it gets to the player!

2.1's are around 5mm longer.

sidelineswap, web site for selling things. I sympathise, I reckon I just looked at my 9ks and then 20ks and the eyelets started to fall out....

LS 2.1's are similar to the fusion in profile. Whilst they don't hold an edge as well as Step steel I think they are better than LS2 steel. Last year a pair of training boots I have had 2.1's and the blade cracked on me, I had some LS2 steel as spares, put them on and sharpened them and there was a noticeable difference in the time between sharpens for me.

I disagree. I have seen dozens of edge holders develop slop where the steel fits, it is the most obvious thing in the world when we put it in the jig to sharpen them and the boot flops. It may be a generation issue (around the MX3 release it is very common), a change in design / material / production plant or it could be that they just haven't had long enough yet but the problem does not seem so bad on the latest S / X / N Bauer skates (I have only seen 2 so far that went back for warranty repair). Now dozens of skates may seem insignificant until you consider we would be one of the smaller markets (around a 1k player base in the city) so the amount of failures is statistically significant and is backed up by employees in our LHS (we only have one). On the other side of the equation "one good experience <> everyone must have had a good experience". As to what causes the issue I have no idea, it seems to be a roll of the dice as I have also seen MX3's that are beaten to death and the steel still sits straight. But there is an issue there (I am not the only person who has sharpened skates who has made this observation on this forum) and you saying you haven't had one does not make it go away. Which leads to a side issue but one that players should be aware of. Sparx, Pro Sharp and other vertical sharpeners can make the problem worse. The issue isn't apparent when getting sharpened so it requires the player or sharpener to use other measures to check for the problem (and be extra vigilant with maintenance checks). Just trying to wiggle the blade in the holder is not enough.