Looking for new wheels

[Sassmasta 0]

I know i could be WAY off so please bear with me....When I was at my LHS they were explaining the difference between the TORUS and the MTECH and they said that both Ideas were very similar that it wuold be almost impossible to tell it apart. I currently use RR MB 816's as well as RR Hornets. I would like to try revision, however they dont offer anything in a mini-bearing form. (I have brand new mini bearings, and I dont want to go buy new Swiss bearings just to try the wheels) so i guess I am going to put revisions on hold until I wear my Mini Bearings out.

[sdcopp 1]

When I was at my LHS they were explaining the difference between the TORUS and the MTECH and they said that both Ideas were very similar that it wuold be almost impossible to tell it apart.

That sounds like their way of saying I don't know and I don't care so long as you are buying the 10 dollars a piece wheel from us. The physics behind the two are very different as far as how an inner pour works versus the Torus hub, they are two different technologies. I suspect and have heard that the Rink Rats are a bit more giving and springy whereas the Revision are a bit stiffer, and that's just by the different design. Both have made believers out of alot of people for the respective brands with no one really having tried both out, so it's still up in the air for now. If we could just get the Revision guys and Rink Rat guys on the boards to give an analytical point of view on these wheels in comparison, it would help alot. Like I said before, I'm in the RR users group simply because I'm impatient and can go grab RR at a few of my local shops. If the RR weren't worth it, it might be a different story, but it seems you can't go wrong either way for a good quality wheel.

[Revision Hockey 0]

Technologies are completely different.

RV - We have a harder inner structer, softer outer urethane. The inner structure, the TORUS, has 2 basic functions:

1) The Integrated Structure Ring prevents deflection on the wheel when pressure is applied to the running surface of the urethane. This means that when you are in your stride the integrity of the wheel is not being compromised. This allows for no loss in speed and a maximum amount of energy/rebound to be obtained. Our wheels get about 88-92% rebound.

2) The TORUS is hollow inside and has flexible side walls, this allows for more room for the wheel to deflect while turning. But remember, the ISR prevents deflection while skating and not while turning. So essentially you get a nice stiff wheel while in stride, and an extremely grippy wheel while turning. Best of both worlds.

The other component in our wheels is our urethane. The ingredients in the urethane allow us to reach extremely low durometer levels to obtain the grip that everyone is talking about. We do this without sacrificing durability or speed. Our Platinum wheel comes in around 72-73A. The Bronze wheel is around 75-76A. And the Gold is right in the middle of the two.

Lastly, I know how much weight can be a factor for some people. The Hub design allows us to have a very light wheel and so does the TORUS. Remember the TORUS is hollow so there is hardly any material in the middle of the wheel saving alot of weight.

Our wheels are 2 grams lighter than the Factory Z-Rated wheel was. They were known for being the lightest wheel to hit the market; and our wheels have 30% more materials. We have a larger profile (more urethane), an internal structure, more hub material than the Z-Rated did and we are still lighter.

Thats the Revision Variant wheel in a nutshell. Rink Rats have a soft material as an internal structure and harder outside urethane. I dont want to talk too much about RR so I will leave the rest for Mike to explain.

You can buy our wheels at:

epuck.com

hockeygiant.com

hockeydepot.com

Ask your local hockey shop if they are not yet carrying the Variants.

Happy to help guys. If you have any questions just post em up or email me. nabeel@revisionhockey.com

Thanks!

[Jim A 4]

I've used both, used RR's before I tried Revision and while I was waiting for my last set of Revision to show went back to RR (they were still in good shape after 6 months of use as well), to me it just feels that the Revisions are stiffer underneath (comparing a bronze to a 78A Hornet), the RR's were still better than Hyper, Labeda and others

both groups have excellent customer service though

[Bane 1]

Review of Revision Gold wheels after one game. Speed and maneuverability with these wheels is excellent. So far the best wheels I have skated on. My only regret so far is that I did not go with the silver wheels, I like lots of grip. However after I get completely used to them in a couple of games, I may not regret not getting the extra grip.

So far absolutelly the best wheels I have used. Granted, I have not used Rink Rats. the wheels I have used in the past are Factory Halo (most recent), Labeda Dynasty, gripper Lite, Hyper Trinity (not the current version).

nice to knoiw those are the best wheels you've used but that list of past wheels isn't saying much... we need more people who have used both revisions and rinkrats

Hey.. I was asked to post a review. Last I checked, the factory Z rated was considered a top of the line wheel by both factory and mission as was the Dynasty by Labeda, so I fail to see how you can say I don't have much to compare to. I have used every mainstream brand but Rink Rat, I think I have plenty to compare to.

Edit: Was teh Factory z rated I used, not the halo.

[Thockey17 1]

Friend of mine showed me some of his Revision's today, and i must say that they are sweet. Definately going to pick up a pair sometime soon...

[shute 4]

Review of Revision Gold wheels after one game. Speed and maneuverability with these wheels is excellent. So far the best wheels I have skated on. My only regret so far is that I did not go with the silver wheels, I like lots of grip. However after I get completely used to them in a couple of games, I may not regret not getting the extra grip.

So far absolutelly the best wheels I have used. Granted, I have not used Rink Rats. the wheels I have used in the past are Factory Halo (most recent), Labeda Dynasty, gripper Lite, Hyper Trinity (not the current version).

nice to knoiw those are the best wheels you've used but that list of past wheels isn't saying much... we need more people who have used both revisions and rinkrats

Hey.. I was asked to post a review. Last I checked, the factory Halo was considered a top of the line wheel by both factory and mission as was the Dynasty by Labeda, so I fail to see how you can say I don't have much to compare to. I have used every mainstream brand but Rink Rat, I think I have plenty to compare to.

i don't think anyone would consider halo a top of the line wheel at any time and anything made by factory was crap. but yes dynasty wheels are top of the line wheels... if the last time you checked was 4 YEARS ago.

[RINK RAT 15 0]

Hey Guys,

I will just give you the plain facts. The reason why Revisions are lighter is due to the fact that the wheels are canoed out in the middle and filled with air.

Also, the rebound measurements that were mentioned above are totally inacurate. To say their wheels are can get up to 92 rebound is exactly what Rink Rat has been saying for years about hard inner rings and air cores, Smoke and mirrors!!!

Lets start giving the public the right facts.

Rink Rat

Hornet soft 62A super resilient super ball material inner layer Rebound 82-83 rebound

Hotshot soft 62A super resilient super ball material inner layer Rebound 80-81 rebound

The best rebound wheels on the planet, Rink Rat

Revision

Bronze air core 77-78 rebound

Gold air core 78-79 rebound

Platinum air core 79-80 rebound

Thats the rebounds guys plain and simple.

Think about this for a minute 92% rebound, thats dropping a substance from a 100 story building and having it bounce back up 92 stories. Not happening fellas, not with wheels!

Mike

[Bane 1]

Hey Guys,

I will just give you the plain facts. The reason why Revisions are lighter is due to the fact that the wheels are canoed out in the middle and filled with air.

Also, the rebound measurements that were mentioned above are totally inacurate. To say their wheels are can get up to 92 rebound is exactly what Rink Rat has been saying for years about hard inner rings and air cores,  Smoke and mirrors!!!

Lets start giving the public the right facts.

Rink Rat

Hornet soft 62A super resilient super ball material inner layer  Rebound 82-83 rebound

Hotshot soft 62A super resilient super ball material inner layer  Rebound 80-81 rebound

The best rebound wheels on the planet, Rink Rat

Revision

Bronze    air core                    77-78 rebound

Gold        air core                  78-79 rebound

Platinum  air core                    79-80 rebound

Thats the rebounds guys plain and simple.

Think about this for a minute 92% rebound, thats dropping a substance from a 100 story building and having it bounce back up 92 stories. Not happening fellas, not with wheels!

Mike

I think you would do better to explain your technology and let the readers here decide, than to bash your competitor's product. Saying that revision's tech is "smoke and mirrors" will most likely not endear you to the readers here, in fact just the opposite you look like you are bashing another product because you cannot compete.

"Think about this for a minute 92% rebound, thats dropping a substance from a 100 story building and having it bounce back up 92 stories. Not happening fellas, not with wheels!"

If you say it is not possible to get a 92 rebound, I highly doubt it is possible to get a 80 rebound too.

It's always better to take the high road.

[RINK RAT 15 0]

Bane,

I appreciate your email but what you need to understand is what you call bashing we call the truth.

88-92 rebound is not even close to reality. Maybe we should just let everybody come on the board and say whatever they want.

I gave you the stone cold facts and accurate measurements. Somebody asked for the wheel companies to come on the boards and explain the wheels.

We did, I can't help that you don't like the answers.

Mike

[sdcopp 1]

He is not discounting the fact that the Revision wheels have a high rebound though, in fact it's very close numberwise. I finally remembered my science geek stuff when I was really into learning about the chemistries behind this stuff. By having the stiff Torus and hollowed out area, Revision is not acheiving a pure urethane rebound where RR is. Both companies are using a significantly better urethane molding process than Labeda, Hyper and Factory acheiving better wheel composition than those three. Because RR uses all urethane with the superball material, they feel very bouncy when you initially switch to them, where the Revisions feel much stiffer because the Torus is stiffer. A softer wheel will create a larger contact patch, especially when turning providing more grip. The problem occured with single pour wheels is that it would bog down in the turns and actually make you lose speed with very soft, grippy wheels, whereas a harder wheel would retain it's shape better and keep speed better. Enter Labeda Millenium Gripper, the first big dual pour wheel. By using a harder inner layer, it would help retain the shepa while gripping through turns and provide better straight away speed because the wheel was no longer so soft that it would deflect while skating hard on it. What Revision has done is take that one step further by not using a harder urethane, but the stiff Torus which likely springs back from turns and retains straight away speed better because it doesn't have the urethane flex throughout the whole wheel. RR on the other hand using the superball material is constantly returning energy through high rebound, turning the dual pour inside out with harder on the outer pour and softer on the inner. Revision with an air core will get a little bit of rebound from that, but Mike is correct in saying that air vs urethane, air itself does not have any rebound, but the structure holding that air can flex back into shape, thus the stiffness of the Torus to help provide structure and prevent that process from destroying it all together over time. Combine that with a higher quality urethane and it will provide a good rebound. Using pure urethane should provide much better rebound, so I'm surprised they test out that closely, but it probably also explains why Revision is using such a soft durometer urethane since it will rebound more than a harder urethane. Nabeel and Mike are free to correct me since it has been a while since I took chemistry classes and really looked into physics like this, but I feel that's probably the most unbiased description you will get since even though both companies are on here to discuss things, they ultimately want their brands to sell the best.

[RINK RAT 15 0]

SD,

Good analysis from my stand point.

By the way I have no other issues other then the 88-92% claim of rebound.

Mike

[Revision Hockey 0]

SD,

I agree with Mike here...good analysis and way of looking at it.

We'll let the rebound issue go...its not that big of deal where we should be on here arguing about it. Both RV and RR have the highest rebound wheels on the market. Let's leave it at that.

With that said, I don't want anyone confusing our wheel as having an "air filled" bladder...like the old Hyper Air Controls. Even though the TORUS is hollow, it is the shape of the design and the materials of the TORUS that allow for such high rebound...and the soft urethane definitely plays a major role. But the aerodynamics of the TORUS do not let the little amount of air trapped inside the TORUS play any factor in determining rebound.

[sdcopp 1]

Well, since you both have said I summed it up pretty well, then to anyone else who was looking into new wheels it seems safe to say, the Revisions will give you a stiffer ride, and the RR will feel bouncy at first, both will offer great grip and life. I don't think anyone can go wrong either way, it all comes down to personal preference since both seem pretty evenly priced, although I am surprised that Revision hasn't come to Colorado Springs shops like RR has since we have the Tour Inline Arena and host the Rocky Mountain PIHA conference there, but if I recall correctly RR has been out for a bit longer so it may just be time. I'd really like to see your two wheels across the counter from me with little to no Labeda and Hyper because they are just inferior products anymore. Out of curiosity, are either of your companies associated with Cyko wheels, if you can even tell me. I know that they are an offshoot of a chem company as well, so I wasn't sure if it was a setup like what Bravo has going on.

[teamlabeda 1]

There is no company out there with a purer urethane wheels than Labeda. When I say pure I mean the closest wheel to being completely built out of high-end urethane. So while you try and state your opinion please understand there are very few companies out there that make quality urethane wheels. I do feel RR, Revision and Labeda all make a quality wheels with different approaches and claims based on their technology. To say we make inferior product is just completely untrue! When was the last time you have tried Labeda? Have you tried the new Fuzions? Probably not, so please do not slander a companies product without being up to speed on their line, just because you have found a wheel that currently works for you. Believe it or not, more teams win gold on Labeda than any other wheel out there.

[RINK RAT 15 0]

Hey Guys,

Like I said before, use what works for you, because in the end it's only your opinion that matters to what works best for you.

Take care,

Mike

[stock07 1]

Hey Guys,

Like I said before, use what works for you, because in the end it's only your opinion that matters to what works best for you.

Take care,

Mike

Thats a good point...Its hard to say which of those 3 companies( RR, Revision, Labeda) makes the "best" wheels...Its all a matter of personal prefrence and what works best for you. I have tried all 3 companies wheels throughout the years and I know which wheel set up works best for me now..That could change next week though...Its just a matter of getting a set of wheels you think youll like, try' em out and see how they work out. I understand that each company wants to sell more product than the next, thats business. But the guys that represent those 3 companies on this board wouldnt get on here an purposelly bash each others product to sell them, well I would hope not LOL. All 3 have outstanding high end wheels if you choose any 1 of their high end wheels Im sure you'll get your money's worth out of them.

[RINK RAT 15 0]

Well put stock!

Well put!

[sdcopp 1]

There is no company out there with a purer urethane wheels than Labeda. When I say pure I mean the closest wheel to being completely built out of high-end urethane. So while you try and state your opinion please understand there are very few companies out there that make quality urethane wheels. I do feel RR, Revision and Labeda all make a quality wheels with different approaches and claims based on their technology. To say we make inferior product is just completely untrue! When was the last time you have tried Labeda? Have you tried the new Fuzions? Probably not, so please do not slander a companies product without being up to speed on their line, just because you have found a wheel that currently works for you. Believe it or not, more teams win gold on Labeda than any other wheel out there.

ok, I should say every Labeda product I have used pre Fuzion/Genesis has been inferior to what RR and Revision offer. The Milleniums were great when they debuted because they were that much better than anything else out there. When the Gripper Snappers debuted a few years before, you pulled me away from Kryptonics for good. Labeda then produced the same wheel for far too long while RR and Revision developed better wheels. The Dynasties have not had as good of results from anyone I have ever spoken to, compared against the Millenium wheel. I don't know what strides Labeda has made recently, because of going through so many of the Milleniums and finally finding a more durable wheel in RR. My wife has had bad experiences with the Millenium X-Soft retaining their grip, and she's only 125lbs. I have years of experience with Labeda, so I'm not just shooting off at the mouth here from an isolated bad experience, it's been the last ten years or so. The problem before RR and Revision came on the scene was that Labeda was the best hands down, over Hyper, Krypto, Final and Square. The products that Labeda kept producing before the Fuzion and Genesis wheels are now sub-par and not worth the same amount of money that wheels like the Hot Shot for example cost me.

To answer your question, the last time I tried Labeda was about 4 months ago. And to defend what people may view as a bash on you guys, you do make the best frames I have ever skated on. Pro-Extreme Edge was a fave, Sensor was great, love my Hummer and the speed skating inline frames were top notch when I did that. Hopefully I will get to give your Fuzion wheels a fair chance at some point in time, but right now I speak for the last ten years of using your products. As I've stated before, it feels like Labeda rode the Milleniums for far too long and are now trying to play catch up.

EDIT: I would like to see you review what I have said here not as a slander against your company, but an opportunity to improve a product that I have spents hundreds if not thousands on over the last decade. I would love to have more viable choices when going to my LHS, because competition breeds better pricing for me as the consumer, and keeps the whole market going strong. I am truly sorry if I offended you with what I posted earlier, but it is how I feel and how many others in my area feel.

[iceburg19 1]

sdcopp,what you said up there was pretty wild,what are some kind of f in genius.good job.

[teamlabeda 1]

I can appreciate and respect what you said. The problem I had when I first read the post was the labeling of inferior product. We are continually upgrading our formulas on current wheels (Dynasty, Millennium) and looking at developing new wheels (Fuzion). I have heard it all from people who prefer Labeda over RR, RR over Labeda, Krypto over Labeda and so on and so on. While I am a full believer in the use what is best for you concept I can say we believe in what we do, like I am sure Mike at RR and the boys at Revision do as well. Good luck in finding the right wheels for you!

[sdcopp 1]

sdcopp,what you said up there was pretty wild,what are some kind of f in genius.good job.

one of those areas in life that being a geek pays off.

[Bane 1]

Bane,

I appreciate your email but what you need to understand is what you call bashing we call the truth.

88-92 rebound is not even close to reality. Maybe we should just let everybody come on the board and say whatever they want.

I gave you the stone cold facts and accurate measurements. Somebody asked for the wheel companies to come on the boards and explain the wheels.

We did, I can't help that you don't like the answers.

Mike

The problem I have is that you came out in an adversarial manner. Instead of just explaining your tech, you decided to pretty much call the competition a bunch of charlatans, by saying that their tech is "smoke and mirrors." Unfortunatelly, I lost a bit of respect for Rink Rat today.

[Krog7d7 0]

With the revisions....

How the hell do you decide which (plat, gold, bronze) will work for you?

They all say "lightest wheel ever made" and the price point is identical.

The wheel matrix is nice....but is it really useful?

Anyone mixing their wheels based on that?

[Jim A 4]

I'd say give them a ring, talk to Nabeel and get some feedback ...use the Matrix as a starting point..along with some of the info others have given here...