Bad business or touchy customer?

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

Jimmy - understood, but I've been in more than a few instances where the owner doesn't care or doesn't get it.

[Chadd 916]

Jimmy - understood, but I've been in more than a few instances where the owner doesn't care or doesn't get it.

I've seen more that don't get it than ones that do.

[jrgretzky99 1]

I have a reply for this one. I've been playing this game for 29 years, since I was 6. I know equipment, all of my gear is top of the line or pro stock. It pays to buy the best and I can understand where some of you are coming from as far as the advantages. In my opinion, skates are the number 1 priority, even before the helmet. You can never go wrong buying good skates but I feel you really don't need the higher end protective until your kids get to PeeWee and there is hitting and slappers.

My main issue is when I walk into a hockey shop I always get some kid that comes over and treats me like he knows more about equipment than I do. When I walk in, I know exactly what I want and if they don't have it, which they usually don't, I'm gone. In my opinion, in the Upstate New York area there are too few hockey shops and they all push you as soon as you walk in the door. Let me walk around a little and get acclimated. If I have any questions, I'll let you know. I wish there was a way to indicate that you probably know more than they do about what they're selling.

[DarkStar50 679]

The easy way to show you know a thing or two about gear is ask the teen-age LHS employee to show you some shoulder pads with well padded epaulets. He might give you that Sarah Palin "Bush Doctrine" look in return!

I agree with Vakar. It is all about customer service in the LHS. Jeez, it is all about customer service anywhere you shop as far as I'm concerned. If you help the customer and treat him with respect he will return because he will remember it.

[jimmy 194]

Jimmy - understood, but I've been in more than a few instances where the owner doesn't care or doesn't get it.

True, applies to all businesses, your heart has to be in it.

[stick9 903]

Well at least I got a good sharpening....no wait, that sucked too!

[VakarLajos 5]

Well at least I got a good sharpening....no wait, that sucked too!

Sounds like you've found a second home, eh?

Was there anything redeeming?

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

My main issue is when I walk into a hockey shop I always get some kid that comes over and treats me like he knows more about equipment than I do. When I walk in, I know exactly what I want and if they don't have it, which they usually don't, I'm gone. In my opinion, in the Upstate New York area there are too few hockey shops and they all push you as soon as you walk in the door. Let me walk around a little and get acclimated. If I have any questions, I'll let you know. I wish there was a way to indicate that you probably know more than they do about what they're selling.

I hated your kind when I worked in retail.

And the reason why they looked down on me wasn't because I was a kid. Those customers were fun.

[AHF 1]

As an employee working with a customer it always makes me feel akward when I am put in that situation by my boss or to give an example when I measure a customer up and I'm told "Oh my child is just skating recreationally" and my boss will tell me great we have the XXXX or XXV in their size. I will either stop my boss and go they are just skating recreationally and he'll say so? they could use the support.

As a LHS employee, this sounds all too familiar.

I listen to the customer's needs, and if we don't have something that meets those needs, there's no sale. It's that simple.

There's nothing I hate more than pushing product, just in order to make a sale, and yet one of my superiors does it all the time.

On particular situation this past winter...we had a little guy with his dad looking for a pair of gloves. Since he was just starting hockey, and was quite small, he pretty much needed the smallest glove out there...

Well, we didn't have any 8" or 9" at that given time, so they walked out with a 10".

I didn't say anything, but I couldn't believe what I witnessed. Somewhere out there, there's a little guy having a hell of a time manipulating his stick... ;)

[RadioGaGa 162]

I get the idea of having to push product...and make sales numbers etc...in any retail industry...but (to use an example) If I come in to look at Camry's...don't show me a Porsche. You have to have an idea of what is appropriate to the customer/client. Even if they don't buy this time....they might next time, unless you do something to totally turn them off...then they will go somewhere else.

[Law Goalie 147]

On the other hand, wouldn't it be neat if you went to look at a Camry, and the dealer said, "I've got this 911 sitting here all lonely - want to take it for a spin just for fun?" If you've never driven a Porsche, how can you really say it's not worth the extra money? That's how a good salesman operates: he shows you what you're missing, and lets you make up your mind. The happiest people are the ones who convince themselves.

[RadioGaGa 162]

On the other hand, wouldn't it be neat if you went to look at a Camry, and the dealer said, "I've got this 911 sitting here all lonely - want to take it for a spin just for fun?" If you've never driven a Porsche, how can you really say it's not worth the extra money? That's how a good salesman operates: he shows you what you're missing, and lets you make up your mind. The happiest people are the ones who convince themselves.

I guess there are times when that approach is appropriate...but it's also about knowing WHEN you can do that...

Okay, lesser degree...I went into a store that had a sale on running shoes...the style I am currently wearing was on sale for $49.99...so I had in my head that I was going to spend that much...They didn't have my size...but I was looking around at some other shoes in a similar price range ($49-79.99). Sales guy ended up showing me $100-150 shoes after I TOLD him, I came in for the sale/deal because they were the same shoes I had and figured if I could get another pair cheap...I'd be set when these ones die. I had no intention of spending in the price range he was showing me.

That just annoyed me.

[Aussie Joe 0]

Sales is a numbers game, you have to trawl and sometimes hit everyone and try, try, try. Its no crime to ask someone. Afterall hasn't Mcdonalds made millions in up-sells via the familiar phrase of "Would you like Fries with that?"

[VakarLajos 5]

Sales is a numbers game, you have to trawl and sometimes hit everyone and try, try, try. Its no crime to ask someone. Afterall hasn't Mcdonalds made millions in up-sells via the familiar phrase of "Would you like Fries with that?"

But after you say no they don't try and sell you a LARGE fries.

It's one thing if you're out of a 1.0 D in a Vapor XXII (and Vapor XVI) to ask if they'd like to see it in a XXV, but to really push it is unprofessional IMO.

I'd rather try and get it for them from NBH (i gotta restock my inventory anyway) and make them happy than make the extra $__.__ by selling a higher model. If they walk out the door feeling like we've talked them into a sale they weren't financially prepared for I'm not so sure they're coming back and it's hello GOOGLE: HOCKEY EQUIPMENT for them. Not to mention they've told all the parents on junior's hockey team about how the store took advantage of them.

[Chadd 916]

Sales is a numbers game, you have to trawl and sometimes hit everyone and try, try, try. Its no crime to ask someone. Afterall hasn't Mcdonalds made millions in up-sells via the familiar phrase of "Would you like Fries with that?"

Not comparable.

The hockey equivalent would be "do you need tape with that blade?" In this case the McDonalds equivalent would be having someone order a cheeseburger and you try and talk them into a double quarter pounder value meal.

[Aussie Joe 0]

An upsell is basiclly an add on, or an upgrade to what the person is interested in/buying. Yes you can offer tape, but also to suggest they try on a skate model up is fine. Obviously if they say no then thats a sticking point. But as all good salesman know the word "No" isn't always a stop. Its an objection. If instead of getting pushy after the 1st "No" you justify your suggestion they will be more open to it. You have to build the value of the higher end skate up in someone's mind otherwise they won't see a reason to try on something more expensive.

There's a big difference between building value and just saying "C'mon this skate is awesome!" after they have objected once.

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

The best way to do to it is by putting them in the upgraded skate and then highlighting the differences.

At the end of the day, the customer wants to make an informed decision, however wants to feel as if they made the decision on their own. So, as a salesman in hockey, if you want to upsell, that's the way to do it, then sit back and let the customer decide.

[VakarLajos 5]

A lot of customers also think that LHS workers are on commission. I'm not and I don't know any who are. Some of them might be coming in thinking they are going to be pressured to buy something they don't want/need.

[cougarscaptain87 12]

i would try to always use the "if you have time, id like to show you how the next skate up feels" line when appropriate. Im only 19, but i worked in retail for 3 years and was consistantly in the top 3 sales men in the company, even when i was a manager of a store and sales wasnt my main goal. I found that if you present an upsell well enough, and make the buyer really feel that they are in charge and not being pushed, they will always atleast consider the upgrade. More often then not the customer would upgrade. The camry to the 911 example was a bit extreme. but lets say a vapor xxv to a vapor xxxx, there is a large price difference, but if you really explain the benefits and let the customer physically see and feel first hand expericnce as to why they are more pricey then the customer can decide for them selves wether or not the upgrade is worth it to them. As for selling someone the completly wrong product fit wise i find that completly unacceptable. BUT if a beginner player comes in looking for their first composite stick, and they want to look at the sc6 or a rbk 4k, but then they see the s17, or the 9k or whatever it may be. and we have the stick in the right specifications for the player then i see no reason to not atleast inform them without pushing them into the benefits to the higher end and that they will enjoy it more. I have fired 2 employees for selling the wrong fit becasue they just wanted to make the sale and not take time to find the right equipment for them, but i have never had a complaint that my staff or myself was too pushy with upsales. you have to be personable and genuine for the consumer to see that you are honestly trying to benefit them, not take advantage of them.

sorry for the long winded post, i found that i fit in very well at retail and had to write my opinion.

[stick9 903]

As a customer. I have no problem with a salesperson putting me in or showing me the next model up from what I am looking for and explaining the differences. It's a possible option to me. For an extra $20 I get this that and the other....hey I need at least this and that, the other is a bonus.

When I was in retail I would never show someone something that was completely out of their price range. A - you know now matter how much they like it, they aren't gonna buy it. B - it could potentially turn them off from lower end items, like say what they are actually looking for. For example, who's gonna want to buy a cheapo strat after they just got done playing a Clapton signature edition...

[stick9 903]

Received a call, apparently my shoulders came in and I can pick them up any time. I politely told the guy that after hearing "sell him something else" and "don't order items of that value". I was pretty sure they wouldn't order them so I went someplace else.

I ended up with a Vector 6. I spent a touch more then I had planned, but I really liked the fit. Had they not irritated me I would have gone back the following day and picked up that very same pad.

[jrgretzky99 1]

My main issue is when I walk into a hockey shop I always get some kid that comes over and treats me like he knows more about equipment than I do. When I walk in, I know exactly what I want and if they don't have it, which they usually don't, I'm gone. In my opinion, in the Upstate New York area there are too few hockey shops and they all push you as soon as you walk in the door. Let me walk around a little and get acclimated. If I have any questions, I'll let you know. I wish there was a way to indicate that you probably know more than they do about what they're selling.

I hated your kind when I worked in retail.

And the reason why they looked down on me wasn't because I was a kid. Those customers were fun.

That is why I buy online and only goto the local hockey shop for services and small stuff I know they've got. Remember, it's about how we're treated,the customer not the retailer. If you hated the educated customer who knew what he wanted and didn't want all of the fluff the newbies get, would you call yourself a well rounded retailer? I would think the proper response would be to adjust your styles to each and every customer.

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

I understand what you are saying, but when I get a customer who doesn't want to listen to me at all because he doesn't think black people play hockey therefore couldn't know anything about hockey equipment, then it's a problem. I'm just saying that there are people who come into stores with a notion that they cannot be helped because they know more, and those customers are difficult.

[jrgretzky99 1]

IMHO, that is the worst advice one could ever give to a parent!

In my opinion, skates are the number 1 priority, even before the helmet. You can never go wrong buying good skates but I feel you really don't need the higher end protective until your kids get to PeeWee and there is hitting and slappers.

You wanna know why I feel that way?

When I first started playing this game, I had one of the cheapest pair of skates you could buy. My ankles were the only part of the skate that was on the ice. Support, support, support, especially when the kids are young. I've coached for 10 years and I honestly don't care if the majority doesn't agree with me. You can spend $50.00 for a good helmet for your kid or overpay and spend over $100.00 for a helmet that will protect them almost exactly the same. You do that same comparison with skates and the differences are much greater. A One95 boot compared to a One35 is light years in difference.

That is the point I was trying to make. Not that a helmet isn't important. Skates are the most critical when it comes to buying quality.

That's all.

I understand what you are saying, but when I get a customer who doesn't want to listen to me at all because he doesn't think black people play hockey therefore couldn't know anything about hockey equipment, then it's a problem. I'm just saying that there are people who come into stores with a notion that they cannot be helped because they know more, and those customers are difficult.

Supression, I understand brother. Just kidding.

Please don't take that to heart.

I just mean, I do alot of research before I buy and know exactly what I'm looking for. If they don't have it then I'm simply not interested. Just last year I went into Perani's in Rochester and they had the Tackla Pants I wanted so I bought them. I do still patronize local shops, it's just that I like alot of the stuff most shops don't carry. Probably like most of us on this board. Then when you get the pushy sales kids that think because they play and have played since they were young and now they are a whole 21 years old they think that I'm a shitty washed up skater because I'm getting some grey hair.

[Chadd 916]

If you hated the educated customer who knew what he wanted and didn't want all of the fluff the newbies get, would you call yourself a well rounded retailer? I would think the proper response would be to adjust your styles to each and every customer.

Most of the "educated customers" aren't nearly as educated as they believe they are.