Blackstone Flat-Bottom V Thread

[SAK 2]

Sak,

Thanks for your input, I am a little confused when you say blade thickness, just to clarify the picture is from the same skate, the only difference between the 2 pictures is 1 picture is with the toe pointed to the camera and the other picture is with the heel pointed to camera. The gauge is on the same spot on the heel of the blade.

Cheers

J

My bad. It has to be the way the skate is going in and out of the holder or grit under the holder, should be something very simple.

[AIREAYE 248]

What's the difference b/w FBV and Blackstone's X6,X7 etc sharpenings?

[rachael7 1]

What's the difference b/w FBV and Blackstone's X6,X7 etc sharpenings?

FBV is Blackstone's Flat Bottom Vee. X6, X7 are Blademaster's alternate dressing which have more like a regular ROH but with a flat bottom.

[AIREAYE 248]

I meant like, what's the difference in perfrmance/feel between the two? I used a 100/50 (1/2" hollow) on the FBV and switched to the X6. I understand there's no clearcut 1/2" equivalent and its a split b/w the X6 and X7?

[MLSman 22]

So what it comes down to is 100/50 is no deeper than 90/50 its just a different bite angle. Your freind is going with less bite, the degree on a 90/50 is less than on a 100/50. His speed will remain the same however he will not have as much agility as if he were on the 100/50.

I see the point. It is not about depth. the 90/50 and the 100/50 are equal in terms of depth....just the length of the flat bottom is modified. In testing, you have seen no variance in the friction coefficient of having a longer blade angle vs a shorter blade angle? There has to be some, but because it is so minor it must be marginal at worst. The physics of this is the most interesting aspect to me. Keep up the good work...this is a true case of how trig and calculus is practically applied.

[lefty57 0]

So what it comes down to is 100/50 is no deeper than 90/50 its just a different bite angle. Your freind is going with less bite, the degree on a 90/50 is less than on a 100/50. His speed will remain the same however he will not have as much agility as if he were on the 100/50.

Doesn't it also depend on the skater's weight and the hardness of the ice ? Otherwise, given the choice between 90/50 & 100/50, everyone would choose 100/50 for the fastest speed and most agility.

[True North 0]

Well after a steady stream of feedback from this forum my rig is ALMOST complete. I just purchased a couple of footswitches to turn on my lights and my Vac/X02, here is a link and a pic of the footswitch;

Air Actuated Foot Switch

Here is a shot of my setup without the footswitches, I will put them on tonight.

Thanks to Nuggy for the information on the Festool.......it was expensive, but I am very happy with my CS 22 E......my lungs are probably happier as well;

Thanks to JR Boucicaut for posting a picture of his venting system.

Here are some pics of the exhaust system I built last night which are based on JR's setup. Sorry for the pic quality, they are iphone pictures

[mckjim 2]

That is one fine set up you have there.

[True North 0]

That is one fine set up you have there.

Coming from you sir, that is a compliment of the highest order. I forgot that it was also you that I borrowed the Exhaust idea from....so.....thanks for the idea

I just installed the foot switches and it works like a charm.....I'm STOKED!!! :)

[The Lord Flash 0]

I have had a Blademaster BRC 2005 for about 4 years now and think i do a pretty good job for my local club in sharpening their skates. Not such a huge sport in the UK but i am now keen to be able to offer FBV to everyone and maybe even custom radius (combinations actually- i already have a Mk V system) anyone know of the differences/preferences between the Blademaster and Blackstone systems? My existing machine doesn't have a magnetic table top so i may have to have it re-done or just buy a new one. The bigger "spinner" wheels on the Blademaster look/seem appealing but i genuinely have no knowledge or experience of either system.

As and aside i have always wondered how if yo start with a blade that has eneven edges how the touch/v-maks work? If say the lower edge is high it will contact the wheel first giving you indications that you do not have the wheel and blade centered where as you may well do it's simply the edge offset. Adjusting the blabe up or down here would encourage you to put the centre of the ROH away from the middle of the blade? A flat grind (crossgrind) with the little dot witness marks in the centre of the steel is obviously spot on but you don't want to cross grind each time. Also i have read that contouring should be done with the radius of hollow set and the blade and wheel held in the normal horizontal plane ( i believe it was on the No-icing .com site) is this really feasible? They also mention a Z grind or something which i had never heard of...

Thanks for any comments..

TLF

[jimmy 194]

Contouring does not have to be done with a horizontal wheel/hollow set in, but the benefit of this over using a crossgrinder is that less steel is taken off the runner during the process of radius and finishing. Necessary, nope, but it does save steel and some like that.

[JR Boucicaut 3802]

Received some ruby wheels for my X02 = LOVE.

Sharpened with it last night and dressed great, healthy sparks and everything.

[NuggyBuggy 0]

Coming from you sir, that is a compliment of the highest order. I forgot that it was also you that I borrowed the Exhaust idea from....so.....thanks for the idea

I just installed the foot switches and it works like a charm.....I'm STOKED!!! :)

Great setup ! What's the white pad to the left of the grinding wheel do ?

[mnpucker 33]

Great setup ! What's the white pad to the left of the grinding wheel do ?

I am guessing it is white tape. Not a bad Idea it woudl help deflect/catch finer particles but also protect against bumping the cover with the skate blade when the wheel diameter gets small.

[True North 0]

I am guessing it is white tape. Not a bad Idea it woudl help deflect/catch finer particles but also protect against bumping the cover with the skate blade when the wheel diameter gets small.

That is correct sir. It also helps with keeping that part clean because it can get pretty gummed up and you just rip off the tape and all is good. It's not necessary by any stretch.

I ordered a whole whack of Ruby wheels, they have been great grinding wheels for me.

Everything really started to come together for me this past week. I am using much lighter pressure and taking more time with each of my passes and I am getting amazing edges. I sharpen heel first and I found that one of the keys for me is to make the first contact as soft as possible. From there the rest of the pass is a breeze. I am now finishing the edges with leather strips and stroping compound and the edges feel about as perfect to the touch as I think possible. Based on my HDI measurements, I have my holder zeroed in so that my edges are in balance to within .2/1000" which is almost perfect. The HDI people told me anything better then 1/1000" was very good.

I tried using my pink wheel a little while ago and I tried using it with a 100/75 FBV spinner, I usually use the 100/50 spinner. At first I really liked the pink wheel as there was very little debris but I ran into an odd problem when using that wheel. I found after each sharpen I was getting 1" to 2" strips of edge coming off the skate blade. The strips were very thin and it was freaking me out so I stop using the pink wheel. I am not sure if it was the wheel or the spinner but I am going to try it with my Ruby wheel.

Edited July 14, 2010 by True North

[Polarlight 0]

Does anyone know anything about all of the new spinners on the Blackstone website (see "Accessories" - "Dressing Tools" - go to bottom)? I don't see any communication from Blackstone. Some of the relative bite/glide is simple to determine, others not so (i.e. 100/1).

[NuggyBuggy 0]

I thought I had a page bookmarked that related FBV to regular hollows, but couldn't find it.

Anybody know where I could find such a page, or know what a 95/50 might skate like ?

Edit: I see that jimmy's page has a table of sorts, but there's no 95/50 on it.

Edited July 20, 2010 by NuggyBuggy

[SAK 2]

I thought I had a page bookmarked that related FBV to regular hollows, but couldn't find it.

Anybody know where I could find such a page, or know what a 95/50 might skate like ?

Edit: I see that jimmy's page has a table of sorts, but there's no 95/50 on it.

We should be having something fairly soon. We are trying to make it so that everyone can understand it.

[Chadd 916]

We should be having something fairly soon. We are trying to make it so that everyone can understand it.

Steve, no matter how clear and concise you make it, there are people that will not be able to understand it.

"Every day, man is making bigger and better fool-proof things, and every day, nature is making bigger and better fools. So far, I think nature is winning." -Albert Einstein

[SAK 2]

Steve, no matter how clear and concise you make it, there are people that will not be able to understand it.

haha I am well aware of it, however I would like to come up with something that answer's more questions than makes more question's. We are still getting results in from our University study as well.

[NuggyBuggy 0]

haha I am well aware of it, however I would like to come up with something that answer's more questions than makes more question's. We are still getting results in from our University study as well.

Steve - when I ordered my X01 Gerrard was quoting off a sheet/table he said you guys use to help customers relate ROH to FBV. Couldn't you just post the contents of that sheet until you can work something up more elaborate ? I'm sure that table would be all many of us would need to see.

[SAK 2]

Steve - when I ordered my X01 Gerrard was quoting off a sheet/table he said you guys use to help customers relate ROH to FBV. Couldn't you just post the contents of that sheet until you can work something up more elaborate ? I'm sure that table would be all many of us would need to see.

We have given the same chart to equipment managers and it was a disaster.

[AfftonDad 88]

Has anyone done the math on how many clicks it takes on the X-12 (upgraded) holder to adjust for the different width of a CCM Rocket Runner? If not, does anyone know the delta per click on the knobs and how wide the plastic part of a Rocket Runnter is so that I can do the math?

Thanks.

[jimmy 194]

We have given the same chart to equipment managers and it was a disaster.

Level of bite has so many factors. How many people could never skate on a 3/8 hollow, yet same skater loves the 100/75. A guide would be nice, but honestly, trial by each skater is the best way.

[JR Boucicaut 3802]

I mark my top knob with a notch to denote thickness.

With the RR I turn the knob counterclockwise 3/4 turn, then clamp the blade. After that if I am not mistaken it is possibly 12 clicks (as it is 6 clicks to get it to move up a line)