Building an ice rink

[jjleip11 0]

I'm doing some serious research on what it takes to build an ice hockey rink. I don't mean my very own back-yard rink either. My dream would be to own and operate my own indoor rink someday. This post is research for this idea.

I know that it costs millions of dollars to construct such a facility, but there is such a wealth of hockey knowledge at this site, I thought I would just ask some questions here, with the chance that some of us hockey addicts here actually have some knowledge about the process and money involved in owning and operating a legitimate ice rink. Most rinks I've played on have been community-owned, but I've seen a few private rinks here and there.

I am totally ignorant of what it takes to operate a rink, from the bills to the managerial aspects of it. This post is another way for me to tap into a good hockey base to learn about this business.

So, just throw thoughts at me in general, from anyone in the know on this subject. I'm most interested in how I would finance such a business, whether it be getting a group of private investors together, or going through lending agencies. And, the next question, which is the most important, Is it even profitable to own/operate a rink??? Assuming I find a community with a large need for ice time, but no ice rink (and I do believe I have found that area), will I be able to make a living? I don't need big bucks here. What are the main expenses of running a rink, what are the major day to day obstacles that are run across???

The thought of doing this sounds like a job I'd love to do. I figure life is too short, why not look into this idea...I know it's an extreme long shot, but who knows, I've seen and heard of stranger things in my 34 years...if I actually pulled this off I would die a happy rink rat...

[Chadd 916]

To get the money together, either as a loan or from investors, you will need a business plan that shows how you will make a profit. You will also have to prove that the area where you want to put the rink is under-served and there is more demand than the current rinks can handle. In most cases you will lose your ass unless you have experienced rink management people as part of the ownership group and have connections within the local hockey and figure skating communities, and I don't mean knowing a bunch of players and figure skaters.

Any rink can be busy from 5-11pm for 9 months out of the year without trying very hard. It's the other 18 hours a day during those months and all day in the summer that is more difficult.

The easiest way to get a rink built is to lie to a very rich parent that wants his kid on the ice as much as possible and try not to get fired when he loses his ass. That seems to be how a lot of rinks get built around here.

[asl95 0]

Well As long as you have commited teams you should be set to go. Once you find your area talk to local organizations and ask them if more ice time is a need for them...try to get a sense of how much your rink will be used. secondly you should tour many rinks and find the best aspects of these rinks that make them successful and incorporate them into yours. You should probably work up a team of people including someone to handle the money aspects, and a engineer. I am freinds with a few different zamboni drivers and theres many aspects of a rinks upkeep that most people dont know about. Make sure you have somewhat of a financial supply but also talk to companys and banks because you will need loans. As long as you strike deals with local teams and programs, the rink will be on a good path. You will be able to make a living as long as you have people renting ice. Advertise it and make it known to the public. Also, Buy solar pannels....the goverment will give back money to you on your taxes. Rinks need huge amounts of energy and they will quickly pay for themselves.

[jds 20]

http://www.customicerinks.com/index.html

[rachael7 1]

http://www.customicerinks.com/index.html

Oh you would have to post that... I'm going to be drooling for hours now.

[raganblink 82]

To add to the end of asl..

Advertise in local schools about parties. I worked at a roller rink in a very small community (under 20k) and we had some hockey but we had parties and shit all the time. Made bank off of it.

If you can do some aspect of job like manager or something you'll save costs and have more fun.

But anyways links make money off of organizations, parties and adult hockey. It you can expand popularity it will help you tremendously over the long hall. I agree on solar panels. If you're going to build one might as well do it right. Make it pretty much perfectly insulated. The biggest cost is maintenance and power. If you can cut that by solar panels and very well insulation it will help you a lot.

[Wallzy41 9]

Question: We have a pre-existing Drainage area that serves as a Pond in Winter. Would it be profitable to buy the area from the owner(who is moving) and build boards and rent it out? We live in a community of 5k but many are interested in hockey now that I am the first HS player in school history.

[PJaeggi97 0]

Thanks for posting the link jds.

Eventually would like to build a small indoor rink after i retire.

[shotty 7]

probably 30-40 million for a decent complex. you'll probably want more than one sheet. then 15-20% per year for management and maintenance.

[biff44 0]

the absolute best way to do it is to buy one at a bankruptcy auction! Just about any other way and it is a huge investment that is hard to make a go of. If you are talking about a small rink (like a private one), there are a lot of safety issues related to the ice compressors, which will make it expensive and a building permit nightmare.

[Chadd 916]

the absolute best way to do it is to buy one at a bankruptcy auction!

It's sad how true that actually is. The fact that there are rinks going bankrupt fairly regularly should also tell you something about the profitability of an ice rink.

[shotty 7]

buying anything out of foreclosure is usually a good way to start, but it doesn't really suit the OP's idea.

true though. you better have a ton of cash and a good name if you're going to buy a rink out of foreclosure and attempt the same thing.

[Chadd 916]

true though. you better have a ton of cash and a good name if you're going to buy a rink out of foreclosure and attempt the same thing.

First thing is to find out why it went under. You may not be able to fix it no matter how popular you are.

[raganblink 82]

probably 30-40 million for a decent complex. you'll probably want more than one sheet. then 15-20% per year for management and maintenance.

holy shit that's expensive.

A one sheet rink here is no more than 7-10M (if its uber nice). You could build a somewhat okay one sheeter for about 5.

[asl95 0]

Shotty Thats rediculous. The rink I work at origianlly was built With 4 rinks for 15 mil....its no in the stages of adding 6 and a mini rink 7 but 30-40 mil would be for somthing thats like an nhl rink with all the luxuries but without the upper levels

[DarkStar50 679]

^ + 1. $30 mil? Sorry, but unless it is the Taj Mahal of ice rinks, no way do you need that much money to build even a 2 rink building with luxury add-ons. As for the OP. don't forget a pro shop, stocked + staff($$$$$$) and a snack bar, with all things necessary + experienced staff. That is 2 more departments every rink needs in addition to a hockey department, figure skating department, maintenance, and staff operations department. Don't forget shrinkage. Someone will be robbing you blind, too.

[n1kthequick 0]

I know the ice arena here in LA that they built in 2000 cost around $20 mil. IT features a NHL and Olympix Size rink, roller arena, pro shop and food place with an additional basketball court and mini-gym. Lakers and and Kings practice there so im pretty sure it's top-notch all the way around. Sounds like for $10 mil you can have a really high end arena built with no problem.

[shotty 7]

there's a new arena here in Vancouver. two rinks built from scratch along with a minor reno to a 60 year old rink. cost: $57 million.

it's nice, but not amazing.

new construction is EXPENSIVE. don't fool yourselves. to make money and attract fine organizations, you need more than a good ice surface, four walls and a roof.

[shotty 7]

^ + 1. $30 mil? Sorry, but unless it is the Taj Mahal of ice rinks, no way do you need that much money to build even a 2 rink building with luxury add-ons. As for the OP. don't forget a pro shop, stocked + staff($$$$$$) and a snack bar, with all things necessary + experienced staff. That is 2 more departments every rink needs in addition to a hockey department, figure skating department, maintenance, and staff operations department. Don't forget shrinkage. Someone will be robbing you blind, too.

the oy people you would want on payroll would be program coordinators, front office, facility management and entry level type people working concession. restaurants, pro shops, etc should all be leased out. assuming all that risk and responsibility is crazy.

[DarkStar50 679]

The amount of risk in opening a rink of any size is crazy. There are pros and cons to leasing out the pro shop and food/beverage. Therefore, sometimes the benefit to control all aspects of your building is actually less risky. It is incumbent that the rink owners get the most qualified people in the area to run each department. We have done that in our 4 rink building and it has been successful. Ultimately, your rink and each department are only as good as the people running it. Merge this thread with the "Pro Shop Wants" thread and think about how involved this business is. Ice rinks are no Field of Dreams- build it and they will come.

[Jordan 13]

Canlan corp operates several rinks and happens to be a public company. You can look up their financials and learn what a terrible business this is.

Further, they have purchased many of the rinks out of bankruptcy and they still barely make any money.

Their return on assets is around 3%, and if you include the debt (and you should) return is less than 2%.

They operate 65 icepads in the US and Canada, so they would economies of scale that are large and would be able to get relatively cheap financing as as a publicly traded corporation as compared to an individual. Circumstances may vary by location, but Canlan operates in a number of regions. They also run huge adult leagues as well as youth and adult tournaments.

Canlan 2009 annual report

[hamstercaster 2]

Prices can vary alot upon location of the rink for different reasons. Price of materials and labour varies alot from State to State and Province to Province depending on the how well each State/Province is doing economically. In the Ottawa/Gatineau region for exemple, prices would be higher than most of the Country because their is a shortage of qualified construction labour although it is stabilizing to an extent as of late. Prices of materials are also higher because of the demand so you could easily hit the 30 million dollar bar for an arena... but then again, depends on how big it is and all.

As for an exemple, the city of Val-des-Monts just outside of Gatineau built a brand new facility back in 2001. Total cost of construction was only 2.75 million dollars. That includes one ice sheet, public washrooms, a snack, a small pro shop (if we can even call that a pro shop), 6 rooms and very limited seating. It also includes state of the art refregeration system that saves the municipality a lot of money. All of the Gatineau area arenas are owned by the cities they have been built in by the way. It costs the city about $50 000 a year in electricity alone but the arena is heavily booked year round. Here's a link that may be of some interest to you as you'll be able to learn a lot about the aren's construction and what to expect.

It's an interesting read IMO: http://canmetenergy-canmetenergie.nrcan-rn...5/2004-155e.pdf

[jjleip11 0]

If all the financial information here about ice rinks is correct, then how do any of them stay open??? No business is worth going into if you aren't profitable. My guess is that a lot of the rinks are owned by local governments and therefore get the local tax dollars to pay the bills. Is that system correct or am I way off here?

Looks like I'll just have to win the lottery (and a big one at that) in order to have my own rink someday.

[iceNsteel 0]

Speaking from my experience: most of the decent, or better, rinks I've ever played at were owned by city or county governments as part of overall sports complexes. When you don't have to deal with all the taxes, can derive income for other sources in such a sports complex (softball fields don't cost a lot but can generate a lot of income), and don't really have to worry about profit it just changes the operation. Not to mention that it's much easier for a government body to organize the funding for a publicly owned rink.

[hamstercaster 2]

If all the financial information here about ice rinks is correct, then how do any of them stay open??? No business is worth going into if you aren't profitable. My guess is that a lot of the rinks are owned by local governments and therefore get the local tax dollars to pay the bills. Is that system correct or am I way off here?

Looks like I'll just have to win the lottery (and a big one at that) in order to have my own rink someday.

In Canada, or at least in the Province of Quebec, most rinks are owned by the city they are built in which we call here Municipal Government. So yes they are funded by our taxes, at least when they are built but in the case of my area, most of the rinks are self sufficient as they are more or less pretty much fully booked by leagues and such. I think it is the way to go as you help promote healthy living in your city by having the necessary infrastructures for the population to stay active. They are also in charge of building baseball diamonds, tennis courts, basketball courts, and such. It's all part of the "perks" a city needs to attract people to come and invest in a business or housing and such. So IMO it's the way to go and it's also the way to keep ice time at affordable prices too... more or less. I think that Montreal does have a few privatly own ice rinks like les 4 glaces and the Montreal Canadiens' owned practice facility.

One needs to keep in mind that there are a lot of costs associated to running a ice rink. Zambonis for exemple are not cheap to buy and upkeep. You need to change the blade on a fairly regular basis. It uses a lot of water and electricity and in many cases, propane too. You need to repaint the building on a regular basis because of the abuse it takes, specially in the change rooms and many more expenses...