Help me find my perfect sharpen

[chrisehyoung 14]

I'll be the first to admit that I don't know a whole lot about skate sharpening. I know that I drop my skates off at National Sports and their computer tells them what I had last. I've made a few adjustments over the past few months but i'm still looking for that perfect sharpen.

I know that i've been getting a flat bottom V recently. I will update this post when I get the actual numbers. Anyway, i'm 6' tall and 190 pounds or so. The ice I usually play on is on the hard side so I find I need sharper edges. I'm skating in Reebok 18Ks that I bought on Boxing Day and only have 3 real skates on them so far.

What is a good starting point? And yes I know I should pay more attention to the details.

[jonesy9020 77]

There are a lot of personal preference and playing style issues that go into sharpening preferences. I've got pretty much the same build as you, and I've had a lot of success with a conventional 5/8" setup. It's hard to give advice on this where we don't know what settings you're coming from.

Assuming you're starting at something like a 90/50 FBV, try to change it up to a 90/75 or 100/75 for more bite to see how it feels. If you've got a backup or older pair of skates, try out two different sharpenings at a public skate back-to-back to see what you like better.

Sorry to be that guy, but trial and error is the way to go. Make sure you know what they're doing with your blades too -- see if you can get a printout of what they've done in the past since they use a computer system with it.

[JR Boucicaut 3804]

Go in baby steps.

So, let's say you are at 1/2" or a FBV - knowing what you like on it, go in the direction that you want to improve. But do it slowly and over time. Once you reach the extreme (either too much bite or too much glide, scale it back down one step.

[logicsound 1]

I used 5/8 and 9/16 for 2 years (6'1 200lbs) because that's what everyone told me to use, I recently was talking to the best fastest skater on our team and he told me he uses 3/8 (5'11 190), I thought this was crazy because everything I hear is how slow that would make you....Well I went from 9/16 to 3/8 last week and let me tell you it's AWESOME! I have never had so much confidence going full speed into a corner or taking a very sharp turn, I also feel way faster since I can really dig into the ice on my take offs, yes I don't get as much glide but most of my skating is start and stops so it's perfect! I just wish I would have tried early. So don't hesitate to try a sharper hollow.

T

[chrisehyoung 14]

So right now i'm getting a 95/75 FBV which would explain why I don't feel I have a sharp enough edge. I'm thinking I should go to a 100/50 right soon. Now I just had them sharpened before last week's game. D'oh, I wish I would have researched this sooner.

[Chadd 916]

So right now i'm getting a 95/75 FBV which would explain why I don't feel I have a sharp enough edge. I'm thinking I should go to a 100/50 right soon. Now I just had them sharpened before last week's game. D'oh, I wish I would have researched this sooner.

Try 100/75. If you don't think you have enough bite with 95/75, I can't image that you would be happy with the X/50

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

Well depending on which National you go to you may want to stop over to see me I picked up a FBV from Steve a while back and it`s around a 7 16ths and everyone that has tried it just loves it!

Glad to see the National you go to uses the system

[chrisehyoung 14]

Well depending on which National you go to you may want to stop over to see me I picked up a FBV from Steve a while back and it`s around a 7 16ths and everyone that has tried it just loves it!

Glad to see the National you go to uses the system

I go to the National in London. I have only had one bad sharpen with them and that was when I bought my 18Ks. They only sharpened the right skate. Imagine my surprise when I stepped on the ice for the first time on them. LOL

They have always done a good job for me other than that.

I was thinking of going to another place to check out the Maximum Edge system that the local OHL team apparently uses. I've heard mixed reviews from fellow skaters though. Any thoughts here? And yes I read through some old threads.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

Well Chris the Knights trainers says they do a good job on the profiles. I do not know what they do on sharpening on a regular basis.

As for National thats great to hear. Glen is great during the day and the girls that work there do a fantastic job.

I will be down shortly to work with Chris and the Knights again before the Mem cup

[HkY_GuY 2]

I'm kinda in the same phase, (I'm 6"5 & 180lbs)

used to have them done standard sharpening(whatever it was) then went to a 5/8 liked at first because of more glide got used to it but I always felt like I had poor control over my edges and it impacted my game and mobility, so i went to a 1/2 and still feel that I would need more bite.

should i try next a 3/8 cut?

[chrisehyoung 14]

I'm taking my skates in to get a 100/75 put on them this week. I will let you know how it works after a skate or two. Thanks for the help guys.

On a side note, it was -18*C here yesterday at game time and the rink was -11*C on the ice surface. Probably the coldest rink i've played in. I am assuming the cold and hardness of the ice is the major issue here. A lot of the guys complain how cold the rink is. I play ball hockey there in the summer and the AC and dehumidifiers are always turned off. This place is one extreme or the other.

In those temperatures it's hard to keep blood flowing in the feet and I took a shot of the toe on my first shift. Not a good feeling.

[Chadd 916]

I'm kinda in the same phase, (I'm 6"5 & 180lbs)

used to have them done standard sharpening(whatever it was) then went to a 5/8 liked at first because of more glide got used to it but I always felt like I had poor control over my edges and it impacted my game and mobility, so i went to a 1/2 and still feel that I would need more bite.

should i try next a 3/8 cut?

I'm pretty militant about full size adults not using a hollow under 1/2" without a significant reason for it. Once you start to get that much bite out of your steel, I feel that you risk injury to knees and ankles. If you don't feel like you have enough control over your edges, I would suggest a session or two with a powerskating coach. It will pay big dividends over the long term.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

I'm kinda in the same phase, (I'm 6"5 & 180lbs)

used to have them done standard sharpening(whatever it was) then went to a 5/8 liked at first because of more glide got used to it but I always felt like I had poor control over my edges and it impacted my game and mobility, so i went to a 1/2 and still feel that I would need more bite.

should i try next a 3/8 cut?

What profile are you on? You may simply not have enough blade on the ice for the hollow you are trying. With the correct amount of blade for you at your size a 5/8ths should be plenty sharp enough.

[chrisehyoung 14]

I will be down shortly to work with Chris and the Knights again before the Mem cup

Good. When you get down here you can help me get my perfect sharpen and profile.

[HkY_GuY 2]

I'm pretty militant about full size adults not using a hollow under 1/2" without a significant reason for it. Once you start to get that much bite out of your steel, I feel that you risk injury to knees and ankles. If you don't feel like you have enough control over your edges, I would suggest a session or two with a powerskating coach. It will pay big dividends over the long term.

I don' t believe it a lack of edge control, but rather not enough bite witch make the blade slip at times and loose control.

What profile are you on? You may simply not have enough blade on the ice for the hollow you are trying. With the correct amount of blade for you at your size a 5/8ths should be plenty sharp enough.

Reebok E-pro stock witch is 10". never profiled them but I use to skate on Bauer lightspeed and I was more agile and mobile but terrible glide and sluggish.

[Chadd 916]

I don' t believe it a lack of edge control, but rather not enough bite witch make the blade slip at times and loose control.

"Not enough bite" is hard to say when you have smaller guys using shallower hollows. It's all personal preference, but I've seen a significantly higher number of ankle and knee injuries with guys using hollows with more bite than 1/2", including a couple spiral fractures to the leg. In every one of those cases, the skates dug in when the skater didn't want them to.

I do feel that it is a lack of edge control in MOST cases. The guys that I see tend to skate pretty upright and never really dig in. In most cases, they lack deep knee bend and their form is lacking. They don't get any drive into the ice, they expect the skate to dig in when they push out. I've never seen the OP skate, I'm not accusing him of this. I'm just stating what I have seen in most cases with guys using deeper hollows. Obviously, consistently harder ice conditions would skew that somewhat. Our ice tends to run around 20-22 degrees F.

[notquitedeadyet 13]

It's all personal preference, but I've seen a significantly higher number of ankle and knee injuries with guys using hollows with more bite than 1/2"

I think that includes groin injuries too. I remember hearing a while ago that there was a study of NHLers that showed there was an increased tendency toward groin strains in players skating on deeper hollows. As soon as I hear a player complaining of groin problems, I recommend a shallower hollow & it often seems to help.

[HkY_GuY 2]

I see your point and agree makes perfect sense.

to find what cut suit you most for your height/weight/ level and skating style is to go from 5/8 or 9/16 and see how you can hold your edge if you can't u go down unltil you feel what is right.

what are the options can you please make some kind of chart from more bite 3/8 to less bite more glide that would be helpfull

[boo10 323]

I think that includes groin injuries too. I remember hearing a while ago that there was a study of NHLers that showed there was an increased tendency toward groin strains in players skating on deeper hollows. As soon as I hear a player complaining of groin problems, I recommend a shallower hollow & it often seems to help.

Seems to me I recall hearing something about a correlation between the introduction of super-stiff skates and an increase in groin, hip flexor and sports hernia injuries.

[Chadd 916]

I see your point and agree makes perfect sense.

to find what cut suit you most for your height/weight/ level and skating style is to go from 5/8 or 9/16 and see how you can hold your edge if you can't u go down unltil you feel what is right.

what are the options can you please make some kind of chart from more bite 3/8 to less bite more glide that would be helpfull

It all depends on the shop. Some will only do 1/8ths, some will do 1/16ths

[milos 1]

I learned to skate on 1/2 over 10 years ago. I switched to 7/16 after 5 years of playing at the advice from a coach. I continued with that sharpening through college because I never really thought about it. I weigh 150 lbs.

As recent as a few weeks ago, I switched back to ½ (less bite). It took 3 ice sessions to feel normal mobility again, but I am glad I switched. I feel more in control when I go to a shuffle stride and push off either leg.

Don’t judge the change after 1 skate. Get out there a few times before you decide to change to either more or less bite.

[arcsinice 6]

Quote from "CHADD".............."I'm pretty militant about full size adults not using a hollow under 1/2" without a significant reason for it. Once you start to get that much bite out of your steel, I feel that you risk injury to knees and ankles. If you don't feel like you have enough control over your edges, I would suggest a session or two with a powerskating coach. It will pay big dividends over the long term."

Very accurate - intelligent remark as well his other - "Not enough bite" is hard to say when you have smaller guys using shallower hollows. It's all personal preference, but I've seen a significantly higher number of ankle and knee injuries with guys using hollows with more bite than 1/2", including a couple spiral fractures to the leg. In every one of those cases, the skates dug in when the skater didn't want them to. I do feel that it is a lack of edge control in MOST cases. The guys that I see tend to skate pretty upright and never really dig in. In most cases, they lack deep knee bend and their form is lacking. They don't get any drive into the ice, they expect the skate to dig in when they push out.........."

Very true CHADD.

I go nothing deeper than 10-11/16ths as recommendation for adult, period................... Even kids are monumentally better with a maximum 10/16ths to 12/16ths. Yes.........., 12/16ths, it develops better balance, edge control, lateral capability, a relaxed stroke and stride. Deep hollow makes for a "nervous" blade.

Myself, all 175 or pounds of moi-meme has never seen anything less than 12 -13/16ths most of my life to a preference over many, many years of 14/16ths and in either case, the full spectrum capability of the flatter blade has only proven vastly better overall. Again.............., overall. CHADD's reference of many skating upright, straight legged, effectively not rolling - really rolling in on the edge as they should and letting it do the work it is designed to do combined with proper body positioning is a common sight. There's no power there. Way too many individuals in many but not all regions of the USA today, typically as per the lack of knowledge on the part of a shop throw out 8/16ths as a standard to everyone, even 6/16ths which is simply terrifying. Once an individual gets used to a deeper hollow it's hard too break them of that and they lose so much lateral capability in their skating whether they know it or not. I'm glad for the aforementioned references regarding groin, muscle, ligament, tendon and bone/joint injuries CHADD............ So true. Once again, deep hollow (anything below 10/16ths if not11/16ths) has potentially greater chance of precipitating this versus a flatter hollow that again I resolutely "militantly" recommend.

Two other areas that are never discussed, above all one................ Today's plastic fantastic boots are overwhelmingly too stiff in most cases not allowing natural biomechanical flexation to take place without having for many a player to (have to) lace one or sometimes two eyelets short to compensate for the too stiff factor. This is not a solution, just a sad compromise. Many a skater - player would be well advised to go with a "lower/lesser" model in a given line as typically the "lower performance" model is softer in flex but otherwise retaining much of if not all the same dynamics as its "higher performance" sibling and thusly allows for that critical biomechanical flex to somewhat be realized. To think all the more to witness someone under, say 210 pounds in a given brand's "top" model makes me cringe and boy, there are tons of examples of same. No appropriate forward biomechanical flex, more like Frankenstein on skates. They acerbate this via too short a radius and too deep a hollow. In short, it's a triple threat. Also pitch point............. No best but this should be looked at by a competent/capable shop as one's balance is crucial and many are not properly balanced, as well. And the entire "lighter and stiffer" nonsense is just that.............. Amazing, people buying a set of boots/skates based on weight. Whew. I won't mention sticks...........................

If they made it in a bottle so many would swig it down.

While it's not fair to reference names because if I mention one I need to mention at least one hundred others but of a multitude of more relaxed set-up players on the ice two of my faves are/were Paul Coffey and Sergie Federov, both of which ranged from around 18-20/16ths to 13-14/16ths, respectively, on longer radius runners and, of course, softer boots. Scott Niedermayer was in the same boat. Patrick Kane has caught on over the past three to four years to a flat hollow amongst others.............. Love the way he rocks and rolls. And he does.

CHADD's power - (I'll add figure) skating instruction would give many some new found religion. Many ignoramae laugh at figure skaters. If only the ignoramae had so much as 1/16th of 1% realization as to how hard figure skaters work at their métier.

Have a relaxed on the ice day or night.

[Chadd 916]

CHADD's power - (I'll add figure) skating instruction would give many some new found religion. Many ignoramae laugh at figure skaters. If only the ignoramae had so much as 1/16th of 1% realization as to how hard figure skaters work at their métier.

Figure skating instruction would benefit a lot of people when it comes to edge work and control. Kids should always take lessons from those instructors when starting out.

[Souldriver 64]

I'm getting the "feels better after a couple skates" feeling when I hit the ice as well as some skate jumping when I make stops. I've been on a 9/16th due to really hard ice as well as a couple other factors. I had my skates sharpened to this about 3 sessions ago and each session is about 2 hours and at the end of this 3rd session my skates felt really good.

My question is as a 250lbs man skating on hard ice, starting with a 9/16th hollow where would I be after 4-6 hours of ice time on them? Is there a way to say those worn edges are now like a 5/8ths, a 3/4th or more and to try that cut on my next sharpening or do you just need to keep going up the ladder until something gives you that feeling fresh?

I'll also add since it was mentioned, a local rink here offers early morning adult hockey and skating clinics for $15. Even if it's not super advanced im thinking I'll take one of the skating sessions to see how it is, for $15 and it's adult centered it seems worth it.

[Chadd 916]

I'm getting the "feels better after a couple skates" feeling when I hit the ice as well as some skate jumping when I make stops. I've been on a 9/16th due to really hard ice as well as a couple other factors. I had my skates sharpened to this about 3 sessions ago and each session is about 2 hours and at the end of this 3rd session my skates felt really good.

My question is as a 250lbs man skating on hard ice, starting with a 9/16th hollow where would I be after 4-6 hours of ice time on them? Is there a way to say those worn edges are now like a 5/8ths, a 3/4th or more and to try that cut on my next sharpening or do you just need to keep going up the ladder until something gives you that feeling fresh?

I'll also add since it was mentioned, a local rink here offers early morning adult hockey and skating clinics for $15. Even if it's not super advanced im thinking I'll take one of the skating sessions to see how it is, for $15 and it's adult centered it seems worth it.

I would absolutely suggest trying 5/8 if you like them more after you skate on them a couple times. Anyone that likes their edges more after a couple uses is more likely to prefer a more shallow hollow.