Bauer skates baking for 3 minutes only ?

[vp1304 3]

I want to heat mold my Bauer skates (Supreme M5 Pro) The instruction says 3 mins at 79°C but that seems to me like unsufficient time to heat up all the materials properly. I always thought the process takes like 6-8 minutes at least. How did you bake your Bauer skates ? Don't wanna mess'em up but also  wanna see some effect of the heat molding. Thanks

[xstartxtodayx 343]

Sounds about right.  These new materials don't take long to heat up.  CCM instructions are similar from what I remember last time I did mine, I was really surprised how well they molded after that short amount of time in the oven.

[vp1304 3]

5 minutes ago, xstartxtodayx said:

Sounds about right.  These new materials don't take long to heat up.  CCM instructions are similar from what I remember last time I did mine, I was really surprised how well they molded after that short amount of time in the oven.

Right, the instructions should be there for a reason. Will start from there and let's see how it goes ...

[Sniper9 529]

Ccm heats up a lot faster than Bauer's 15 year old curv composite technology. I usually heat up Bauer for five mins.

[noupf 42]

I felt the same with my ccm's.  However, CCM says 2 minutes at 220 degrees and that just felt odd to me, so I did 4 minutes at 180 or so and I felt like it gave me better moldability.

[vp1304 3]

 Baked the skates yesterday. I checked it after 3 mins and it was barely warm so i flipped the skate on the baking tray and waited another 3 mins. It turned out nicely warm but not hot. Let's see how the skates gonna feel on the ice. 

[pgeorgan 77]

On 12/15/2022 at 2:52 PM, vp1304 said:

I want to heat mold my Bauer skates (Supreme M5 Pro) The instruction says 3 mins at 79°C but that seems to me like unsufficient time to heat up all the materials properly. I always thought the process takes like 6-8 minutes at least. How did you bake your Bauer skates ? Don't wanna mess'em up but also  wanna see some effect of the heat molding. Thanks

I would just follow the instructions. Bauer have really improved on their Curv technology over the years and the skates don't need much time in the oven. I think the Machs are using a 12K carbon now. 

From the horse's mouth: "3D Lasted 12K Carbon Curv composite making this skate 5% lighter than the Ultrasonic. "

CCM instructions say 2 minutes versus 3 for Bauer, but require 45 degrees higher in temp (175F vs 220F).  

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by pgeorgan

[beedee 227]

On 12/15/2022 at 3:29 PM, Sniper9 said:

Ccm heats up a lot faster than Bauer's 15 year old curv composite technology. I usually heat up Bauer for five mins.

Show me on this doll where Bauer hurt you. This must be the fifth post or so where you mention the age of Bauers Curv Composite technology. 

[Sniper9 529]

5 minutes ago, beedee said:

Show me on this doll where Bauer hurt you. This must be the fifth post or so where you mention the age of Bauers Curv Composite technology. 

I actually like Bauer quite a bit. Imo they have the best looking skates out there and the mach is one of the most comfy retail skates available.  I'm simply stating their boots lack overall moldability vs other brands out there and their quarter packsge technology has been more or less the same besides small gimmicky things like tendon guards, tongues, amplex etc. 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Sniper9

[beedee 227]

2 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

I actually like Bauer quite a bit. Imo they have the best looking skates out there and the mach is one of the most comfy retail skates available.  I'm simply stating their boots lack overall moldability vs other brands out there and their quarter packsge technology has been more or less the same besides small gimmicky things like tendon guards, tongues, amplex etc. 

Gotcha. My Machs feel way more moldable than my old Vapor x500s and my Vapor 3x. Maybe it’s because they are a top tier skate vs mid tier that my Vapors are? 

[Sniper9 529]

31 minutes ago, beedee said:

Gotcha. My Machs feel way more moldable than my old Vapor x500s and my Vapor 3x. Maybe it’s because they are a top tier skate vs mid tier that my Vapors are? 

The machs have more foams inside as well vs the ones you listed. The foams are also heat moldable so that could be it as well. The machs also use 12k carbon curv which I'll admit is a better tech. The hyperlites and even the upcoming hyperlite 2 will still only be using carbon curv. Even the m5 pro is using carbon curv at a second price point and I believe the 3x is only their regular curv. 

[pgeorgan 77]

"Curv" is just a branding used to delineate successive skate models. It does not mean that Bauer hasn't changed their proprietary tech in the last 10 or more years. 

It's no different than when CCM says "rocket frame" or when True says whatever True says. 

Folks really out themselves when they claim Bauer have been just sitting around with thumbs in butt the last decade.

Edited January 29, 2023 by pgeorgan

[Sniper9 529]

3 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

"Curv" is just a branding used to delineate successive skate models. It does not mean that Bauer hasn't changed their proprietary tech in the last 10 or more years. 

It's no different than when CCM says "rocket frame" or when True says whatever True says. 

Folks really out themselves when they claim Bauer have been just sitting around with thumbs in butt the last decade.

Curv is actually an outsourced patented material that isn't owned by Bauer. Just like d30 and sigmatex used by ccm

Edited January 29, 2023 by Sniper9

[pgeorgan 77]

6 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

Curv is actually an outsourced patented material that isn't owned by Bauer. Just like d30 and sigmatex used by ccm

Indeed. 

The two are not mutually exclusive. 

16 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

I'm simply stating their boots lack overall moldability vs other brands out there and their quarter packsge technology has been more or less the same besides small gimmicky things like tendon guards, tongues, amplex etc. 

Where is the evidence of this? I see this comment regularly on MSH but nobody offers anything beyond anecdotal observations, which no offense doesn't really hold much water. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by pgeorgan

[boo10 323]

Link below is to a pdf from the manufacturer of Curv, detailing the temperatures required in the manufacturing process. 

After reading, I don't think a skate oven gets hot enough to truly deform the material.  My unscientific opinion is that Bauer skate shells have limited thermoformability, and it's mostly the interior foams that are changed. 

Personal observation is that True and CCM shells are more pliable when they come out of a skate oven.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.pearl-hifi.com/06_Lit_Archive/15_Mfrs_Publications/Menlo_Scientific/CURV%20Thermo-forming.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi6wLK2mO38AhUKjIkEHflKCNkQFnoECA4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw0-SXtpDz1v-kHDR7OVWwDM

[pgeorgan 77]

43 minutes ago, boo10 said:

Link below is to a pdf from the manufacturer of Curv, detailing the temperatures required in the manufacturing process. 

After reading, I don't think a skate oven gets hot enough to truly deform the material.  My unscientific opinion is that Bauer skate shells have limited thermoformability, and it's mostly the interior foams that are changed. 

Personal observation is that True and CCM shells are more pliable when they come out of a skate oven.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.pearl-hifi.com/06_Lit_Archive/15_Mfrs_Publications/Menlo_Scientific/CURV%20Thermo-forming.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi6wLK2mO38AhUKjIkEHflKCNkQFnoECA4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw0-SXtpDz1v-kHDR7OVWwDM

Interesting fact sheet. Thanks for that. 

I think we are in agreement that materials that go into high-end skates aren't going to deform much in a skate oven, whether that be Bauer or CCM. That's probably by design, and not a bad thing. As far as I can tell, the only way around that is to either:

1) use thinner sheets of carbon fiber

2) use more plastic

3) significantly up the baking temp

I'm not a chemical engineer, but from my own experiences with the Ribcor and Jetspeed tier 1 skates, I didn't see a significant increase in pliability as compared to my Bauers that couldn't be attributed to the 220 degree vs 175 of the latter. 

Anecdotally, my own Ribcor's broke from an innocuous shot that wasn't hard enough to sideline me for more than a shift. 

EDIT: Wow I just went to look for the thread where I posted the broken skate, and it looks like all my posts are gone?? Including the links to the broken skate. Will post again.

Broken Ribcor 1

Broken Ribcor 2

Here's my current "all activity" page.

Here's the cached page with an additional 10 pages of content that has seemingly vanished.

Edited January 29, 2023 by pgeorgan

[boo10 323]

12 minutes ago, pgeorgan said:

Interesting fact sheet. Thanks for that. 

I think we are in agreement that materials that go into high-end skates aren't going to deform much in a skate oven, whether that be Bauer or CCM. That's probably by design, and not a bad thing. As far as I can tell, the only way around that is to either:

1) use thinner sheets of carbon fiber

2) use more plastic

3) significantly up the baking temp

I'm not a chemical engineer, but from my own experiences with the Ribcor and Jetspeed tier 1 skates, I didn't see a significant increase in pliability as compared to my Bauers that couldn't be attributed to the 220 degree vs 175 of the latter. 

Anecdotally, my own Ribcor's broke from an innocuous shot that wasn't hard enough to sideline me for more than a shift. 

I do think that True and CCM shells tend to rebound less than Bauer after heel clamping or sidewall punches, but it's not some earth shattering difference.

I like all three skate brands and think they all have pros and cons.

This forum can get a little tribal around the brands at times, but I genuinely believe the members have good intentions and are not just being fanboys/fangirls.

[Sniper9 529]

1 hour ago, pgeorgan said:

Interesting fact sheet. Thanks for that. 

I think we are in agreement that materials that go into high-end skates aren't going to deform much in a skate oven, whether that be Bauer or CCM. That's probably by design, and not a bad thing. As far as I can tell, the only way around that is to either:

1) use thinner sheets of carbon fiber

2) use more plastic

3) significantly up the baking temp

I'm not a chemical engineer, but from my own experiences with the Ribcor and Jetspeed tier 1 skates, I didn't see a significant increase in pliability as compared to my Bauers that couldn't be attributed to the 220 degree vs 175 of the latter. 

Anecdotally, my own Ribcor's broke from an innocuous shot that wasn't hard enough to sideline me for more than a shift. 

EDIT: Wow I just went to look for the thread where I posted the broken skate, and it looks like all my posts are gone?? Including the links to the broken skate. Will post again.

Broken Ribcor 1

Broken Ribcor 2

Here's my current "all activity" page.

Here's the cached page with an additional 10 pages of content that has seemingly vanished.

From my experience owning all three brands. I've said it before. True and ccm are more pliable after being in the skate oven as per their respective baking instructions. Would Bauer skates get as pliable as true skates if they were in there for 8-10 mins at 180-200? Maybe. But we're going here by their recommended bake times and temp settings. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by Sniper9

[pgeorgan 77]

5 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

From my experience owning all three brands. I've said it before. True and ccm are more pliable after being in the skate oven as per their respective baking instructions. Would Bauer skates get as pliable as true skates if they were in there for 8-10 mins at 180-200? Maybe. But we're going here by their recommended bake times and temp settings. 

You probably could, but then you'd have to use plastic wrap as you've said in the past. 

I am (unlucky?) enough to have owned all three as well, and will be trying the FT6's if the 90-day thing is still an option when they're released. 

If True had some sort of guarantee with their customs, I'd genuinely like to try them. I am already to the point I am putting lace bite gel inserts into my Fit 1 Machs due to how much they've opened up. A smaller size is not going to fit. 

 

Edited January 29, 2023 by pgeorgan