Blackstone Flat-Bottom V Thread

[furlanitalia 1]

Ive just found the my skates seem to slide out laterally far easier then ever before. For the guys in Coquitlam I have been skating at the main the past two day (about 8 hours total) and the ice hasn't been great so I'm gonna give it one last shot tomorow at a different rink. Been using fbv for well over 6 months now and just find my skates felt they had more grip. I just felt more secure. I have a feeling I'll go back and forth a couple times, but as of now I prefer the Fbv (not saying it is better or worse, just my personal opinion)

jbyun, what do your sharpen your skates at with fbv an what do you sharpen them at with bfd?

Edited December 15, 2009 by furlanitalia

[TBLfan 25]

Have you heard about any other places doing it in Van?

No but I heard of someone doing it in a parking garage! hah :lol:

[chiefs17 2]

I am strongly considering the blackstone x0-1 sharpener. I've read alot and researched this one and the wissota. SO I called Blackstone today and decided that I was going to order one if they were willing to substitute a fbv spinner. After a short conversation the salesperson said it was ok, but I would have to pay the $15 difference. (seems like pinching pennies to sell a $879 sharpener that I'm sure is half profit). Then the salesperson proceeding to try and sell me the "upgraded" skate holder for $100 extra. When I said I wasn't interested he told me that this is the one that all the NHL teams use and it was far superior to the holder that came with the X0-1. He said if I wanted it after I ordered the package it would be $250 and that they were phasing out the current holder for this new one because they had had some complaints about it. Well all of the sudden I wasn't so sure that I wanted the X0-1. I said I wanted to think it over since I was only getting it to sharpen my sons skates so it wasn't going to get alot of use and I was having a hard time justifying getting it at all, but the sharpener at the rink is horrible and they charge $8 and if I want a good edge I have to drive some distance. So then he told me the deal was only for today, and when I called back I wouldn't be able to get the upgraded holder for $100.

Well sorry for the long post but now I'm concerned since he CLEARLY indicated that he "highly highly" recommended the upgraded holder. (He really said it twice.) My son is 10 and will probably play til he's 18 and then probably play rec hockey so he can keep it (if it lasts). But I will only be using it at most once a week to sharpen his skates and maybe every two weeks to sharpen mine. I'm not sure either one of us is good enough to notice the FBV edge. Should I just get the wissota? the Blackstone? what about the upgraded holder? Thanks in advance for reading this and helping.

DPT

dpt, I recently exchanged my standard holder for the upgraded one. The cost was $100, plus I had to pay to ship my holder back to BS. The new holder is much better than the old one. I did a bunch of modifications to the old holder to make it better, but the clamping was still inconsistent compared to the new one. And to mnpuckers point, I was experiencing the same problem of the boot resting on the pitch knob if it was a men's size skate. Jr. skates were far easier to do since they weigh less. I'm very surprised they gave you an ultimatum that you had to order the upgraded holder today, maybe he meant they wouldn't be offering the upgrade to you if you didn't purchase the upgraded holder at the time of the machine? I can understand that. If you buy an X-01, get the upgraded holder for another $100, it's worth it.

All that being said, I wouldn't shy away from a Wissota either. It's a proven machine that will do what you want it to do, and last for years and years. You will save money on expendables like grinding wheels and be able to do any hollow you want without buying new spinners. If you really wanted to do FBV you could have a jig made up that holds the spinner. I even heard that Wissota has something like this already, but I haven't seen it. Don't let the masses here persuade you to purchase an X-01, aside from FBV right out of the box, there is nothing the Wissota can't do, and you will be able to do any ROH you want.

[jbyun04 7]

Ive just found the my skates seem to slide out laterally far easier then ever before. For the guys in Coquitlam I have been skating at the main the past two day (about 8 hours total) and the ice hasn't been great so I'm gonna give it one last shot tomorow at a different rink. Been using fbv for well over 6 months now and just find my skates felt they had more grip. I just felt more secure. I have a feeling I'll go back and forth a couple times, but as of now I prefer the Fbv (not saying it is better or worse, just my personal opinion)

jbyun, what do your sharpen your skates at with fbv an what do you sharpen them at with bfd?

FBV I use 90/75 and for BFD I use X7. I've tried 100/50 for FBV but didn't really like it as much.

[Ivan 1]

My fav FBV is 90/75. Tastes differ thoguh. Too many variables involved.

Just got a couple of Step steel Velocity for custom One95s. Both long and short version. WIll post when done testing. Just FBV sharpened them.90/75. Both look great. Will see..

Edited December 16, 2009 by Ivan

[coldshoulder 0]

Changed XXXX's from stock steel at 1/2" hollow to profiled Velocity's with a 100/50 FBV about three weeks ago (on ice 4-5/wk). The improvement in glide is as advertised and well worth the upgrade.

Edited December 23, 2009 by coldshoulder

[Ivan 1]

Thanks for all the comments and advice. As one poster said it's difficult when you have never sharpened skates before. I am good with my hands and have always been a do-it-myself kinda guy. Still bothers me that they would sell a product at all that they have had complaints about (salesman admitted it right up front). Makes me worry about customer service after the sale. I know there are a bunch of Blackstone employees here so you may want to consider the message the sales people give when they basically come out and say (almost exactly) you'll regret it if you don't order the upgrade. WIth the upgrade it makes it 15% more expensive than the wissota which is a direct drive motor. The wissota holder while admittedly looking a bit home-made also looks very sturdy and adjustable. My parents live in Minnesota so maybe i'll just fly up to visit and take a look in person. Thanks for all the help.

David

Nah, not a bunch of Blackstone employees here. First of all, Blackstone Sports is not a big company with lots of employees.

But you sure will find a lot of believers in Blackstone's Spinner, and especially FBV, here. That's different.

When I was buying my professional machine, they wouldn't blackmouth the competition making it clear it's not their style. I also was told they take pride in customer service. It's been almost 2 yrs. now since I bought my Black sharpener. No problems with after sale customer service at all. Just had to ask a general question to be on the safe side (needed to tighten the belt on my professional Spinner). The Blackstone person was very quick to respond and he also followed up to make sure everything was OK). I'm an ex Dell employee. Dell trains ALL their employees 2-3 times per month to make sure you know the new products and give the best possible customer service. Of course, the human factor is involved here (work ethics and stuff). Trust me, Blackstone folks do fulfill your expectations and stay up to par w/ customer service. Before or after sale. And that's when I'm sure they're EXTREMELY busy with lots of things going on like their competition trying to infringe, promo campaigning, etc.

PS: MInnesota is a great state

[hockeyfreak7 0]

anybody in the DC area know if the FBV will be hitting any shops in virginia or maryland any time soon?

[AfftonDad 88]

Anyone have any reports or experience with someone saying that 100/50 (or whatever) feels different on an X-01 than on the high end blackstone sharpeners? If so, any explanations (besides one person is doing it right and the other isn't) of why this might be the case? Incidentally, I can't feel any difference between my X-01 and the shop, but this really picky guy swears my X-01 has less bite than the LHS.

[chiefs17 2]

Anyone have any reports or experience with someone saying that 100/50 (or whatever) feels different on an X-01 than on the high end blackstone sharpeners? If so, any explanations (besides one person is doing it right and the other isn't) of why this might be the case? Incidentally, I can't feel any difference between my X-01 and the shop, but this really picky guy swears my X-01 has less bite than the LHS.

I've heard it too and I believe it could be a number of things. The tolerance of a spinner would have to be crucial when manufacturing it, it's hard to control when you're talking about 50 ten millionths of an inch (.0005") on a 100/50. Then you have the tolerance of the diamond coating. If either of these 2 tolerances are at their extremes you could easily get different results. It's commonly referred to as tolerance stackup. Another reason could be the wheel arbor on your X-01. Mine was way out causing a wheel hop that I felt was enough to really change the profile of an FBV.

I think this will be more of an issue when the FBV becomes more common. Right now how many of us are getting an FBV done by 2 or more different places? Most people who are on FBV are getting it done at one place, by a single spinner, producing repeatable results. If you tried another spinner, and even another machine, you are bound to have a different result. Especially if you are comparing an X-01 and a tabletop machine, different spinners altogether. It may or may not be noticeable.

Try this. Next time you do your buddy's skates, measure the thickness of his blades if you can. You'll have to use a micrometer or a set of dial calipers. Take measurements in a few spots too, and on both blades. Then measure the thickness of your blades the same way. The FBV profile will change slightly depending on the thickness of the blades. I'm willing to bet that you will see different thicknesses between your steel and your buddy's.

[Conrads6 0]

I just had my skates done at my LHS. I was skating on 1/2", they said the 100/75 was comparable. I skated on them yesterday and they REALLY had some bite. They felt great skating and turning...felt way to sharp while stopping. Should I try the 100/50 next?

[K9 Unit 1]

100/50's closer to 1/2"

100/75 is more 3/4"

Edited December 17, 2009 by K9 Unit

[freestyla 0]

100/50's closer to 1/2"

100/75 is more 3/4"

100/75 is more 3/8" I thought?

I just had my skates done at my LHS. I was skating on 1/2", they said the 100/75 was comparable. I skated on them yesterday and they REALLY had some bite. They felt great skating and turning...felt way to sharp while stopping. Should I try the 100/50 next?

Yeah I would say to try 100/50.

Edited December 17, 2009 by freestyla

[krwwc6 0]

100/50's closer to 1/2"

100/75 is more 3/4"

100/75 is more 3/8" I thought?

Correct. 100/75 = 3/8

100/50 = 1/2

90/50 = 3/4

[K9 Unit 1]

oh ye my bad :P was never good at fractions

[jjameson 0]

i skate on a 9/16th and think the 100/50 is the closest....

to me

100/75 was like a 1/2 and

90/75 was like 5/8

[Gummer12 134]

Skated out on FBV for the first time the other night. Coming from T'Blades the bite was tremendous. Only thing I was uncomfortable with was wearing a new set of skates. I got a new pair of the same model, just a size smaller. Once I get comfortable with the boot I'm sure I'll be even more thrilled with the FBV.

Side question..Will the X0# or any of the other units be compatible with BM's Height Comparator Gauge?

[JR Boucicaut 3801]

No

[Gummer12 134]

I Didn't think so..in that case..Anyone looking to Buy a BM Height Comparator Gauge? :P

[mnpucker 33]

Quick update on the new and improved Tri Lie Holder for the X series. I received my new holder on Friday just 5 days after ordering it from Blackstone. As previous reviews indicate, the new holder is rock solid. The new Tri lie has far greater ability to lock the blade and allows for no noticeable flex once clamped in the holder. I am not an engineer but it is obvious why this holder is better and slightly more expensive than the original X 12 holder. Thus far I have tried skates from sizes 3 jr to 11 senior and all fit in the holder without contact between the holder knobs and boot.

I am very impressed with the holder and happy to say Blackstone really went out of their way to make sure the previous holder problems I experienced were solved. If considering a Z series sharpener I highly suggest upgrading to the Tri Lie Holder.

[ejj 0]

Hey guys -

I've had my X01 up and running for a month now, and for the most part it has been trouble free. I'm using a 3/4" spinner, and the quality of the machine and holder (I upgraded to the U12 holder) have been top notch.

Now, when I sharpen, after a few passes I have no problems getting the edges on the straight run of the blade level. However, when I get this portion of the blade level, the edges on the toe and heal of the blade are way out of whack. Sometimes, the straight of the blade is square, but (for example) the top edge (in the holder) of the toe of the blade past where the blades starts to curve is way, way higher, and I don't know why. If I lower that side of the holder, it messes up the straight portion of the blade. If I get the straight portion of the blade correct, the toe is back out of whack, etc.

So, as someone who has not sharpened skates before, I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. Any pointers?

[AfftonDad 88]

For those X-01 owners out there (and possibly X-02?) that sharpen small childrens skates and want to squeeze a little more life out of your grinding wheels (you'll need to have the juevos to take a saw to your holder though)... cut off the front corners of the holder. This allows there to be less interference when going around the heel and toe of small skates. I did this with my upgraded X-01 holder but I suppose it would be applicable to the standard one as well. The tip came to me from someone else but I don't remember who so I can't credit them here.

The front corners of the base plate that is.

[JR Boucicaut 3801]

...or just grind it with the machine. LOL

[Gummer12 134]

So i'm looking at getting a portable unit, X02 preferably. My plans are to offer up my services for the local High School team, and Men's/Women's league. Basically service the folks from my rink who require a better job than what's currently being done at the rink itself. (no Pond Skates) Would the 02 suffice for said traffic? I plan on getting all of the FBV sizes, and maybe one ROH other than the 1/2", the upgraded holder and the case/kit. Anything else I might want to get right off the bat? Once I get some extra $ built up, I'll get more ROH Spinners, and upgrade the Bat Gauge to a Pro Square and more wheels. Thanks for your input.

[JR Boucicaut 3801]

If you're doing that, get the X02.