Offshore Manufacturing

[sebseb 0]

The ONE95 was the last Canadian-made retail skate. Once they did all of the skates for 2009, the line was shut down.

That's a real shame for so many reasons. There are people that believe there is a huge difference in quality betwen stuff made in Canada and stuff made in Asia, I can't say how big of a difference there is, but I tend to believe there is one. One more thing would be that there is a big possibility some people lost their jobs.

A friend told me that he would never pay 500euros for a pair of skates made in China. He has 9k and he told me this when I showed him my pair of X:60LE

[kenneth 5]

The ONE95 was the last Canadian-made retail skate. Once they did all of the skates for 2009, the line was shut down.

That's a real shame for so many reasons. There are people that believe there is a huge difference in quality betwen stuff made in Canada and stuff made in Asia, I can't say how big of a difference there is, but I tend to believe there is one. One more thing would be that there is a big possibility some people lost their jobs.

A friend told me that he would never pay 500euros for a pair of skates made in China. He has 9k and he told me this when I showed him my pair of X:60LE

Ouch i dunno if i would spend 1000 bucks for skates made in Thailand. Let alone 699 for X60s (I don't see the value in them anyways). 400 was my limit when i bought my Pureflys and S500 cause they were made in China. Even though the quality of them was great. Does this make Graf with the only retail skates made in canada?

[Wolfpack_1986 154]

lets not be ridiculous. the final quality control inspector is the consumer. and since you're loyal to your LHS, i'm sure you'll have your eyes on the actual skate you will be taking home before it is purchased. location should have zero bearing on how much you spend on a skate. it doesnt mean china gets any extra money, it means your beloved canadian company increases their profit margins. jesus.

[TBLfan 25]

lets not be ridiculous. the final quality control inspector is the consumer. and since you're loyal to your LHS, i'm sure you'll have your eyes on the actual skate you will be taking home before it is purchased. location should have zero bearing on how much you spend on a skate. it doesnt mean china gets any extra money, it means your beloved canadian company increases their profit margins. jesus.

I think that's a point lost on most people. It seems like everyone thinks that when a company outsources they automatically become owned by that country... But then again how many people refuse to buy Motorola because they would rather support an American company in these "Hard economic times?"

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

Ouch i dunno if i would spend 1000 bucks for skates made in Thailand. Let alone 699 for X60s (I don't see the value in them anyways). 400 was my limit when i bought my Pureflys and S500 cause they were made in China. Even though the quality of them was great. Does this make Graf with the only retail skates made in canada?

Yet how many Graf QC problems have we seen in past years?

[Viking 1]

lets not be ridiculous. the final quality control inspector is the consumer. and since you're loyal to your LHS, i'm sure you'll have your eyes on the actual skate you will be taking home before it is purchased. location should have zero bearing on how much you spend on a skate. it doesnt mean china gets any extra money, it means your beloved canadian company increases their profit margins. jesus.

I think that's a point lost on most people. It seems like everyone thinks that when a company outsources they automatically become owned by that country... But then again how many people refuse to buy Motorola because they would rather support an American company in these "Hard economic times?"

I don't think it's that people think the company is 'owned' by China/Thailand, etc. I'm sure they know the Canadian/American/European CEO is still lining his pockets after laying off all their domestic employees. The issue is that they want to support a company that employs people in manufacturing jobs in Canada/USA/Europe, and is allowing itself to be governed by labor laws rather than use sweatshops and child labor to maximize profits.

[AIREAYE 248]

lets not be ridiculous. the final quality control inspector is the consumer. and since you're loyal to your LHS, i'm sure you'll have your eyes on the actual skate you will be taking home before it is purchased. location should have zero bearing on how much you spend on a skate. it doesnt mean china gets any extra money, it means your beloved canadian company increases their profit margins. jesus.

I think that's a point lost on most people. It seems like everyone thinks that when a company outsources they automatically become owned by that country... But then again how many people refuse to buy Motorola because they would rather support an American company in these "Hard economic times?"

I don't think it's that people think the company is 'owned' by China/Thailand, etc. I'm sure they know the Canadian/American/European CEO is still lining his pockets after laying off all their domestic employees. The issue is that they want to support a company that employs people in manufacturing jobs in Canada/USA/Europe, and is allowing itself to be governed by labor laws rather than use sweatshops and child labor to maximize profits.

What?? So you're saying that hockey stuff made in Asia are from sweatshops and uses child labour? Come on, seriously? Do you REALLY think Bauer or Easton uses sweatshops/kids to make sticks, skates and other protective stuff?? <_<

[Wolfpack_1986 154]

ever heard of comparative advantage? look it up. it sucks people lose jobs, but it frees up labor in other market sectors via trade. (disclosure: i dont have a job right now, so i dont give a damn about being sensetive other people who dont) /discussion

sooo how bout those skates ____ was wearing last night. pretty craaaazy

[kenneth 5]

lets not be ridiculous. the final quality control inspector is the consumer. and since you're loyal to your LHS, i'm sure you'll have your eyes on the actual skate you will be taking home before it is purchased. location should have zero bearing on how much you spend on a skate. it doesnt mean china gets any extra money, it means your beloved canadian company increases their profit margins. jesus.

I think that's a point lost on most people. It seems like everyone thinks that when a company outsources they automatically become owned by that country... But then again how many people refuse to buy Motorola because they would rather support an American company in these "Hard economic times?"

I don't think it's that people think the company is 'owned' by China/Thailand, etc. I'm sure they know the Canadian/American/European CEO is still lining his pockets after laying off all their domestic employees. The issue is that they want to support a company that employs people in manufacturing jobs in Canada/USA/Europe, and is allowing itself to be governed by labor laws rather than use sweatshops and child labor to maximize profits.

bingo, although Bauer is probably using adults making their equipment (apparel maybe another story) those adults probably make as much as a teen over here. This isn't about QC as my one week old cdn made one95s have already blown some of the stiching on around the top eyelets.

We all know hockey is very traditionalist sport and bauer is 100 year old company so it's sad to see them move full (retail) production to Asia. It'd be the equivalent of GM building Corvettes in China ;) But we are getting off topic

[DarkStar50 679]

Did any of you that bash Chinese made product ever stop to consider that your beloved NHLers are wearing and have been wearing for a long time, all their PROTECTIVE gear Made In China????

[JR Boucicaut 3805]

Actually, Pete, not to be too nitpicky, most of the league is using Jofa/Reebok and that stuff is still made in Malung, Sweden. But hey, that ISN'T Canada so you're right, my bad. :)

But I guess these guys don't watch TV or anything, those aren't made here.

[VakarLajos 5]

Actually, Pete, not to be too nitpicky, most of the league is using Jofa/Reebok and that stuff is still made in Malung, Sweden. But hey, that ISN'T Canada so you're right, my bad. :)

But I guess these guys don't watch TV or anything, those aren't made here.

SWEDEN?! That Communist gulag?!?!

I don't wear or use anything not made outside the USofA. Which is why this post has been dictated to a 3rd party while naked.

[Vathsdrop 0]

SWEDEN?! That Communist gulag?!?!

Golden B)

I knew that on MSH IQ is most of the time negative but still ....

From what I saw skates made in china are sometime better crafted than those from canada ... eg : one95 which is finished with piss.

"Made in canada" is purely a marketing argument, it is alomost in the feature list.. "yee my skates are made in Canada => hourray"

Since most of the time you don't even see the difference between chine-made/canada-made except on the sticker inside... no wonder Bauer decided to do everything oversee - cheaper to produce for the same quality and in the end more inches to push through their anus's customers !

Don't know if you are aware of this but lately everything your country do is helping china to grow up ... it's like if the mother/current superpower is feeding the baby/future superpower !

Conclusion USA is gonna fall down like Rome did <_<

[TBLfan 25]

Actually, China is driving more and more businesses away as they start to ask for more money. More and more companies are going to Vietnam, Thailand and Indonesia.

[AIREAYE 248]

Well, supporting locally made products is great and all, no doubting that. But dont bash stuff made in other countries. Lets see any of you support a $700 skate made in Canada, while the exact same product can be made in China or elsewhere for only a $300 price tag....

[VakarLajos 5]

SWEDEN?! That Communist gulag?!?!

Golden B)

I knew that on MSH IQ is most of the time negative but still ....

you don't pick up on humor very well....and judging by your other posts you miss logic and common decency.....ANYways.....

[DarkStar50 679]

Vakar,

VD also lacks common sense.

[DEATHTRON 19]

Would people feel better if they were made in Mexico? I see why people are upset that gear is not made in Canada, but realistically, if youre in the US, the gear is being made in a foreign country anyways...

I dont like the quality argument either. I look at the newer Bauer produced sticks as a good example. Bauer's sticks have become a quality item, at a lower cost. I would argue that they are better in quality now than when Innovative produced them much closer to home.

Zach

[Chadd 916]

I dont like the quality argument either. I look at the newer Bauer produced sticks as a good example. Bauer's sticks have become a quality item, at a lower cost. I would argue that they are better in quality now than when Innovative produced them much closer to home.

Zach

Virtually every manufacturer is making better sticks now than they were five years ago. That's R&D more than the actual factory.

[DEATHTRON 19]

You make a valid point...but I would argue that the whole warrior/innovative line has not changed much. My point was that Bauer makes a superior stick to what they had, in China.

Zach

[Law Goalie 147]

Point of manufacture is an easy way for people who can't gauge quality well to believe they have intuited it. It's exactly like reading a silly review (eg. puckmugger) and believing quality has been assured. If the review says "Four stars!" or the label says "Canada", there's a false assurance of quality where none may exist.

There are *some* cases where a craft is so culturally-specific that it is unlikely to be quickly picked up in others. Case in point: a friend of mine works for a company that hires women from a specific region of Thailand at enormous salaries, relocates them and their families to luxurious California homes, and makes sure they want for nothing. Why? Because they have the only equipment in the world - their hands - which can sew through this company's heart-valves.

Similarly, though in a less extreme case, I'm not much thrilled with the idea of mass-produced mask-masking, wherever it may be. Part of the problem is that mask-making requires incredibly tight QC: if there's a problem at any stage, it's worthless. It's more of a process than it is a product - and unlike a composite stick, which is of somewhat similar construction, you can't just allow it to fail and send out a warranty replacement. Someone's brain is in there. Moreover, it's almost impossible for the end-user (consumer, whatever) to evaluate the quality of a mask without exposing themselves to a dangerous impact - even sawing the thing in half won't tell you everything you'd need to know. This is one case where trust between the user and the maker is really what's being sold, not the physical product in question. And yes, that's something of a catch-22 - you can't earn that trust until you've already made a few masks. That's why real crafts are usually based on a model of apprenticeship: the master confers trust on the apprentice. That scenario of two skilled workers watching one another is way, way too inefficient to translate to large-scale manufacturing.

If there's some fab in Bangkok employing absolute wizards with epoxy resin and aramid in high-impact applications, by all means, let's get them churning out masks. Send them a few moulds and have at 'em.

[DarkStar50 679]

There is an underlying statement of bias, ignorance, and stereotyping when people continue to believe that just because a product is "Made in China", it must be an inferior product to one made in North America. JMHO.

[ktang 34]

In the 70s, Japanese-made cars were considered inferior to the Amercian-made cars. Ford's catch-phrase was "Quality is Job 1".

I think that China's, Thailand's, Vietnam's etc. products have caught up in quality; it's just a matter of time before North American public perception will change and recognize this.

[AIREAYE 248]

There is an underlying statement of bias, ignorance, and stereotyping when people continue to believe that just because a product is "Made in China", it must be an inferior product to one made in North America. JMHO.

Agreed, the public perception is that they always see the cheap and/or basic stuff (dollor store merchandise, general merchandise etc.) being made in China so they figure everything made there is cheap

[ddbowdoin 0]

In the 70s, Japanese-made cars were considered inferior to the Amercian-made cars. Ford's catch-phrase was "Quality is Job 1".

I think that China's, Thailand's, Vietnam's etc. products have caught up in quality; it's just a matter of time before North American public perception will change and recognize this.

yeah, or it could be the lead in the paint graphics on our sticks... sure, Bauer thinks they are just fine but that's because big business in China is no joke and they are complete snakes. I wonder how much Bauer and other companies actually tests and looks into things like that. We would assume they would but I am skeptical.