Tuuk LS 2 holders vs. new Tuuk fusion

[DarkStar50 679]

LS2 Perf steel is history.

[k.nick91 0]

LS2 Perf steel is history.

maybe so, but some of us out there still use it. i think it was a valid question to ask, no?

[DarkStar50 679]

Oh yes, it was a good question. I just wanted to clarify that it is no longer available from Bauer before someone asks. It was your question that inspired me to take out the Fusion steel and directly compare it to LS2. So, a thank you for that, also. :)

[troy 12]

Yes I still have two sets of relatively new perf steel from some XXXs I'm using on my G35s and was wondering if it would be worthwhile to pick up a set of Fusion.

[burrn 0]

Since density of aluminum is roughly 35% of that of stainless steel, Fusion is probably noticeably lighter than the perf.

(Given that the perforated area is less than 50% of the area that is aluminum in Fusion, which is probably true)

But I'm still not totally convinced that the durability is higher than the perf...were going to have to see about that.

[furlanitalia 1]

Yah, I don't know if I'll be throwing my blade out to block shots. If the aluminum cracks but the steel doesn't that won't bode well for the blade, will it?

[jsykes 35]

But I'm still not totally convinced that the durability is higher than the perf...were going to have to see about that.

The thing I want to see is how the two materials handle the "fusion" process. Aluminum and steel are very different and they expand and contract MUCH differently when temperature ranges. While on the ice it will basically be a static temp, I want to see how it holds up in the long run as they heat up then cool when being sharpened, heat up and cool when sitting in a car during the summer months then going into a cold rink, etc.

I'm sure Bauer has done the research, but over the time, it seems that expansion and contraction at different rates could really wear at that bonding process and could eventually cause a failure. It takes some serious engineering and research when bonding dissimilar metals like this.

[jimmy 194]

How are you sure Bauer has done the research? They failed with the LS powers. So much for research. If the fusion stands up, it will be a good product. If is separates, or breaks or bends easy, then we'll have to reevaluate.

[troy 12]

I wonder if there will be any sort of warranty.

[jsykes 35]

How are you sure Bauer has done the research? They failed with the LS powers.

Well, with something like this, I am assuming since separating steel could cause serious injuries and I would think that a company the size of Bauer would at least make sure the engineering behind it should be sound.

But I dont know, which is why I posted what I did. I would HOPE they did the proper engineering research though.

[burrn 0]

The thing I want to see is how the two materials handle the "fusion" process. Aluminum and steel are very different and they expand and contract MUCH differently when temperature ranges. While on the ice it will basically be a static temp, I want to see how it holds up in the long run as they heat up then cool when being sharpened, heat up and cool when sitting in a car during the summer months then going into a cold rink, etc.

I'm sure Bauer has done the research, but over the time, it seems that expansion and contraction at different rates could really wear at that bonding process and could eventually cause a failure. It takes some serious engineering and research when bonding dissimilar metals like this.

I posted basically the same concern a while ago in some other thread.

They F'ed up with the LS perf and the LS Power, which both would have been a much more easy object to analyse and test than the Fusion.

I'm in no opposition with Bauer, and I'm not saying that I want them to fail or anything, but I'm really skeptical about this product.

Has anyone seen any NHL guys use the Fusion steel?

[furlanitalia 1]

Maybe my experiences were just really good with the products but how did they fail with the LS Power and LS Perf? The only failure I can remember them having was the notches on the lightspeed holder when it first came out. Made it so you couldn't run a stone along the blade, but that was more of an inconvenience then anything else.

[Shark#81 0]

LS Power holder failure - this just happend on Friday, must be one of the last in existence! This is my holder after two games on the thing. I was in an offensive zone cut mid ice blew a tire and went down. scrambled back to the bench and said there was something wrong with my skate. Check it out in the heat of the game it wasn't totally loose so kept playing carefully. Got back in some good light and you can see the results. This is my 3rd pair of these things.The others cracked up but took much longer. I am just 175lbs too.

http://twitpic.com/6nn4p2

So at the hockey shop today - no stock of these so i'm into new ls2 holders and new steel. Just as the dude is sharpening them I notice the fusions on the Total One skate. I said "hey wait a sec what are these" of course the guy turns green (package open, 1/2 sharpened) "umm... sorry we don't have that size in the way lighter fusions".

$150 with taxes for the lot...Add to it the bad runner installation (not properly seated in the middle) and now I'm just little annoyed

[raganblink 82]

150 for new holders and LS2, installed, is a fair price. Not cheap, but not over the top, either. You're looking at 120 for the steel and holders, so 30 for labor. That's what I would charge. Unfortunately for you they were not properly installed.

[Shark#81 0]

that was just the blades in the holders. I install the holders on the boots using screws and SS "T" nuts similar to MLX or Grafs (if they still use screws). $75 a blade is fine but I would probably had the fusions at least to try. I like light.

[SuperMan3 1]

I can honestly say the fusions don't add much, used the fusions for 6 months and swapped them back to the regular LS2 and didn't notice the difference at all, for double the price not worth it.

[DarkStar50 679]

I can honestly say the fusions don't add much, used the fusions for 6 months and swapped them back to the regular LS2 and didn't notice the difference at all, for double the price not worth it.

Next time you are in the shop, ask to hold a pair of Fusion and a pair of LS2 steel. There is a difference in the weight that you can feel when holding the same size.

[SuperMan3 1]

I know you can feel the difference, I meant on the ice from personal experience, it doesn't make much of a difference.

[Shark#81 0]

yeah it's true that a bit of training, some lost weight (like5 or 10 lbs hard to do) warm-up conditioning (re TRX device) will do oodles more for you than a some grams at the blade level.

[DarkStar50 679]

Than why does everyone go ga-ga for grams at the boot level?

[Rockingsquat 4]

I hate my fusion runners so far. Obviously it doesn't change anything compared to a LS2. You might notice the weight difference when you hold them in your hands, but installed on your skate..

They make a very weird noise like squeezing plastic/rubber when standing on the ice. Never heard something like that in 20y of hockey.

The worst is my boy can't seem to sharpen them properly.

Will give them a another chance tonight.

Otherwise will return them, maybe I got a bad set.

[MyBoxersSayJoe 133]

I haven't had a problem with them, and the weight reduction is noticeable to me. Got them back in June, maybe it's because DarkStar sharpened them when I bought them ;) but I haven't had them sharpened yet. I've been playing once a week on them. It's all relative, I guess. Frequency, size/weight of the player, ice condition, etc. No weird noises or issues yet. Just makes me want to skate even more.

[Shark#81 0]

>> Than why does everyone go ga-ga for grams at the boot level?

Because it's a number you can see read and feel. As someone said on here that number is furthest from your core and you cycle that steel x times per game. It's one of the reasons I use carbon shin pads, lightweight socks, carbon boots, super light EVA liners. Everything is lighter today and it all adds up - to more speed and less energy wasted on moving mass.

However when it comes to a skate you have to be careful. that is where you derive your power so making the boot or blade crappier in the name of lightness only, that is false progress imo.

[DarkStar50 679]

I like the Fusion steel for its reduced weight. I do not feel any sacrifice in performance from an LS2 on ice. The steel making contact with the ice is still the same. The aluminum bond shows no sign of weakness. I have been on Fusion steel since 12/1/09. JMHO.

[Rockingsquat 4]

The bond between the steel and the aluminium is precisely the area of concern. I read somewhere they are actually not fused, but rather sticked together by some kind of epoxy.

I need to get a proper sharpening on them to make a true comparison with a standard LS2