Philadelphia Flyers 2013-14

[EBondo 233]

Figured this should be opened now.

Flyers fire Peter Laviolette, will replace him with assistant coach Craig Berube

[iceman8310 105]

does anyone else think the Flyers have a Pelle Lindbergh curse? sort of like the curse of the bambino.

[Chadd 916]

does anyone else think the Flyers have a Pelle Lindbergh curse? sort of like the curse of the bambino.

No, I think they have just been cursed by bad decisions by less than ideal general managers. The pressure to win a cup from Ed Snider forces the GMs to constantly make trades with an emphasis on today and not the future. The constant turnover of the roster and the coaching staff prevents them from creating excellent long term chemistry as well.

[Cavs019 708]

Good thing Snyder isn't in the business of long term investing.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

Only saw the 3rd period tonight. It was nice to see a more defensively-minded team. It wasn't pretty, especially the 7 mins of PP time, but they were able to hold on to a lead. Something this team has struggled to do in the last couple of years.

[Chadd 916]

Only saw the 3rd period tonight. It was nice to see a more defensively-minded team. It wasn't pretty, especially the 7 mins of PP time, but they were able to hold on to a lead. Something this team has struggled to do in the last couple of years.

Only scoring one goal against a healthy goalie should still be a point of concern. Thomas came up lame trying to get back into the net on Coburn's goal and that was a freebie.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

I agree. I think the offense will come along as the season progresses. They have struggled scoring in the first 4 games. If Lavi was still here, I feel they would have lost tonight.

[Chadd 916]

I agree. I think the offense will come along as the season progresses. They have struggled scoring in the first 4 games. If Lavi was still here, I feel they would have lost tonight.

I don't think the coach had anything to do with it, or would have made a bit of difference. They caught a lucky break when Thomas got hurt and stole a win from a team that lost by 7 to St Louis on Saturday

[troy 12]

Yeah, if Markstrom started, the Flyers lose 1-0. Mason's play was the only encouraging thing I took from that game. I think Timonen has really lost it.

[Chadd 916]

The only positive that I see with the Flyer coaching change is that Paddock is involved. He is pretty well respected around the game for his knowledge and should be an asset to the organization.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

I think you guys are missing my point. Coach Lavi was all about pushing the puck forward and ignoring the backend. When he coached here, it was rare for the Flyers to give up only one goal in a given game. Yes, the injury to Thomas helped the Flyers offensively but I'm just impressed that they gave up only one goal. Florida had some quality chances and Mason played well. The D looked better yesterday compared to that bore-fest on Sunday vs. CAR. I'm not concern about W's or L's because I think all 4 franchises in Philly are closer to rebuilding than contending (whether the brasses want to admit it or not). Hopefully the Chief follows through with his philosophy of defense first. It's tough for a team to just outscore their opponents to a Stanley Cup.

[pizzakid13 5]

flyers are a mess not because of the coach but because of the GM and owner. two total morons. no vision at all.

[troy 12]

I just don't buy that argument. I think the Weber offersheet was quite the vision. Look at the defenseman they've drafted in the past three to four seasons. This a team that will always strive to make the playoffs, will never go through the full-on suck rebuild process, and will try to reconcile that however necessary in pursuit of a Cup. The Flyers are the Flyers, take it or leave it. And Ed Snider is so, so, so far from a moron.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

You don't need to, as you said, go 'full-on suck' mode to rebuild. They Flyers haven't drafted well. You can still be successful and retool the farm with NHL-bound talent. Snider's lack of patience and stubbornness has forced the Flyers to make drastic moves that haven't paid appropriate dividends. Anyone who watched the presser a couple of days ago saw Snider's mentality. The Flyers haven't won a Cup in 38 years. Snider would do himself some good and at least try to reevaluate his philosophy. As for Laviolette, he isn't at fault for who was on the roster but he has to be held accountable for the system.

[pizzakid13 5]

I just don't buy that argument. I think the Weber offersheet was quite the vision. Look at the defenseman they've drafted in the past three to four seasons. This a team that will always strive to make the playoffs, will never go through the full-on suck rebuild process, and will try to reconcile that however necessary in pursuit of a Cup. The Flyers are the Flyers, take it or leave it. And Ed Snider is so, so, so far from a moron.

You should buy it because its reality. Holmgren has no clue how to manage the cap. Signing street and vinny to long term deals was assinine. And throw 2 no-trade clauses on top of that! Absolutely brutal cap mgmt not to mention horrendous talent eval.

[troy 12]

NTCs are meaningless, I don't know why people get so worked up over them. The Flyers will always spend up to the cap, one that's going to be increasing for the foreseeable future. I'm really not concerned with cap space. And the Flyers have drafted well, the draft is entirely a crapshoot, and the Flyers have been more than fortunate. Couturier, Sbisa, JVR, Giroux, Downie, Jeff Carter, Mike Richards; those are the first round picks by the Flyers over the past decade. I think that's doing a pretty solid job drafting. The philosophy is win at all costs, we'll see if they eventually get there. I don't think this a Wirtz-type situation when a dead owner leads to success. Just a bunch of Philly fans reacting to something that has been going on since this team existed. Homegrown defensemen is something the Flyers lack, and the past few seasons they have actively tried to rectify that. This team is three or four seasons away from being championship worthy, unlike other clubs they will at least be playoff contenders during that time.

[chippa13 1844]

Too bad 5 of those 7 strong draft picks are playing elsewhere and 2 of them drank from the Cup.

[Chadd 916]

The only similarity to the Hawks is that once Snider is no longer involved, a GM might be able to do the right thing and not constantly try to win the cup every year.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

Drafting forwards has not been a problem for the Flyers as you have mentioned. I should have been more specific in saying they struggle more with defensemen and seem to not have the ability to draft goalies. You are exactly right: the draft is a crapshoot. My beef with the Flyers' brass is that they don't seem to be willing to tweak their philosophy as need be. Maybe they have but it's hard to tell with some of their actions. The 3 best d-men drafted by the Flyers in the last 15 years are all on different teams (Pitkanen, Seidenberg and Sbisa). But you are right about some of the fans here in Philly: they are passionate but not that knowledgeable about the game. We can all agree that there is never a dull moment with the Flyers.

[pizzakid13 5]

This team is three or four seasons away from being championship worthy, unlike other clubs they will at least be playoff contenders during that time.

Right, so why sign two guys who will be 38 or older, paid too much, on serious decline and untradeable? It's fans like you who have enabled this management to make blunder after blunder after blunder and get away with it. 3 years ago, the flyers actually had a nice young talented team on the upswing. They completely dismantled that but yet they still think they can compete. Pathetic.

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

Yea, but who did they have on the blueline? I didn't agree with the length of years the Flyers were dishing out but we have seen in the past that the Flyers will find ways to move players when need be.

[pizzakid13 5]

When, 3 years ago?

Pronger and kimmo obviously were not young. Who else, coburn and carle? cant remember the others.

There's no doubt that they had much more offensive talent then which helped make up for a slower defensive corps.

They had a promising young goalie so all they had to do was keep that group intact, and upgrade defense through FA and drafting. Panicking the season after their cup run was what really sunk their ship.

[troy 12]

Too bad 5 of those 7 strong draft picks are playing elsewhere and 2 of them drank from the Cup.

Eh, Richards and Carter were secondary but still critical components for the Kings. They ended up netting the Flyers Simmonds, Voracek, Couturier, Grossmann, Cousins and maybe a pick somewhere. Simmonds and Voracek are younger and have both produced at a higher rate than Richards and Carter.

So if you're talking about a team that needs a young core and to not try and win the Cup every year (very un-Flyerslike) I'd say that's a wily move. I just have faith that the Flyer method will eventually work.

Right, so why sign two guys who will be 38 or older, paid too much, on serious decline and untradeable? It's fans like you who have enabled this management to make blunder after blunder after blunder and get away with it. 3 years ago, the flyers actually had a nice young talented team on the upswing. They completely dismantled that but yet they still think they can compete. Pathetic.

The 2010 team was not on the upswing, examine that roster. Leino was a stud that year! They were lucky to ride Pronger to the Finals. I think you've got to wait more than a couple seasons post Richards and Carter trades before saying there is no managerial plan.

[chippa13 1844]

Since the trade Voracek/Simmonds has outscored Richards/Carter by a whopping 7 points in the regular season. As for being secondary in the Cup run, Carter was tied for the team lead in goals with Kopitar and Brown, led in powerplay goals, and tied for most game winners with 3. Richards was tied for second with 11 assists behind 3 guys that had 12. The Kings had it all spread around just like you are supposed to when you win the Cup.

As for managerial plan, there is none that I can see. They bring in younger thru trades one year and then get older with signings the next. They have failed to find any kind of consistent goaltending and while I was on board with signing Bryzgalov originally, that position has been a revolving door for far too long. At some point you have to groom a young goaltender. My prediction is that Holmgren will be gone before Christmas and there is the potential for a fire sale at the trade deadline.

And NTCs are by no means meaningless. They tie the hands of management and often result in teams getting a lesser return than if they were free to send the player to the highest bidder. The Flames got a Pittsburgh first rounder and 2 NCAA prospects for Iginla. The Bruins were offering a first rounder, an NHL ready defenseman, and a prospect who is a season or two away from NHL ready. Clearly, Boston made the stronger offer but the Flames were forced to take the lesser offer because of the NTC.

[troy 12]

Since the trade Voracek/Simmonds has outscored Richards/Carter by a whopping 7 points in the regular season. As for being secondary in the Cup run, Carter was tied for the team lead in goals with Kopitar and Brown, led in powerplay goals, and tied for most game winners with 3. Richards was tied for second with 11 assists behind 3 guys that had 12. The Kings had it all spread around just like you are supposed to when you win the Cup.

As for managerial plan, there is none that I can see. They bring in younger thru trades one year and then get older with signings the next. They have failed to find any kind of consistent goaltending and while I was on board with signing Bryzgalov originally, that position has been a revolving door for far too long. At some point you have to groom a young goaltender. My prediction is that Holmgren will be gone before Christmas and there is the potential for a fire sale at the trade deadline.

And NTCs are by no means meaningless. They tie the hands of management and often result in teams getting a lesser return than if they were free to send the player to the highest bidder. The Flames got a Pittsburgh first rounder and 2 NCAA prospects for Iginla. The Bruins were offering a first rounder, an NHL ready defenseman, and a prospect who is a season or two away from NHL ready. Clearly, Boston made the stronger offer but the Flames were forced to take the lesser offer because of the NTC.

Outscoring is outscoring, both Simmonds and Voracek are younger as well. Richards and Carter weren't "the guys" on that Kings team as they would've needed to be on the Flyers. There were of course some other things happening leading to their departure. Gosh, you were on board with the Bryzgalov signing? Trade away a future Vezina winner to make room for that guy, when you could've had said Vezina winner and Vokoun in net that year with combined salaries well under Bryzgalov's cap hit? That doesn't seem like a very good move. In the scope of being able to eliminate contracts with a NTC, yes they are meaningless.