Olympic/International Ice/game > NHL ice/game

[chippa13 1844]

You're worried about bigger players after we showed you plenty of examples of more and more smallish players getting their shots in today's NHL.

I, for one, am in no hurry to see NHL teams adopt the Slovenia 1-4.

[DigiV 6]

You're worried about bigger players after we showed you plenty of examples of more and more smallish players getting their shots in today's NHL.

I, for one, am in no hurry to see NHL teams adopt the Slovenia 1-4.

oh that's a great comparison, lets throw in a team that had 1 NHL player and was never in the Olympics before. Come on man.

[grnmtnvt 18]

That is one of the dominant European styles and it is used because their players aren't as skilled.

No one wants to compromise on a rink. There is no problem to fix. There are small skilled guys in the NHL and there are large skilled guys in the NHL. And given how the medal rounds are settling right now, the NHL is doing pretty darn well- regardless of the size of the rink.

oh that's a great comparison, lets throw in a team that had 1 NHL player and was never in the Olympics before. Come on man.

[KILLERWHALE 6]

NHL Game > International Game

No BS cycling in NHL. Int game too much time, players slow down in the cycle game

In the NHL no time to breathe on the wall = more intense/skilled cycling. Int ice everyone seems to be able to cycle a bit.

International rules allow anyone to go after star players = NO Police officers like HOWE allowed to punch faces.

One good thing about InT game is no Trapezoid! I hate those things. Get rid of it please. How did it get approved? Brodeur is retiring, retire the trapezoids.

International games more funny > NHL game

Low tier teams crowding the net and 1 team chilling in the offensive zone. Too funny.

Latvia goalie struggling for life after all those shots LMAO!

Almost s*** bricks when 1-1. Latvia could have won, that is what's scary. TED NOLAN for World Leader.

Hate HABS/HABS Players, but props to Carey Price. Cool as a cucumber. Those were some tough saves!

Canada Gold. Leafs Cup Yea I SAID IT

[DigiV 6]

That is one of the dominant European styles and it is used because their players aren't as skilled.

No one wants to compromise on a rink. There is no problem to fix. There are small skilled guys in the NHL and there are large skilled guys in the NHL. And given how the medal rounds are settling right now, the NHL is doing pretty darn well- regardless of the size of the rink.

There never seems to be a problem to fix until they fix it and everyone's like "yah yah!" . I've seen these counter arguments before when the nhl was considering all the infraction rules. Again, I repeat that the NHL will have to consider rink size soon. Players are getting too fast and too strong. Soon you'll see what's happening in the nfl come to the nhl - how does the nhl answer the concussion issue?

A rink size between nhl and olympic size is going to be the only option

[Chris46 0]

Although the olympics has been exciting to watch because it's the best players from around the world facing off against each other, I think the play has been boring. Like other people have said, teams sit back and wait for mistakes.

I think it's good to see a team setting up in their zone and breaking out, but I'd much prefer to see the NHL style of play where players have to be more creative to create their chances on goal.

Bigger rinks have their place, and I think they should stay in the European Leagues (I'm from the UK btw). My home ice is a small pad, and I personnally hate playing on olympic size ice, yes it gives less experience players time to think, so it has it's benefits. But it's also hilarious to see teams that are used to the olympic size rinks coming to our ice, because they are so used to having all the time in the world, and it enevitably leads to some pretty big hits!

[DigiV 6]

Although the olympics has been exciting to watch because it's the best players from around the world facing off against each other, I think the play has been boring. Like other people have said, teams sit back and wait for mistakes.

I think it's good to see a team setting up in their zone and breaking out, but I'd much prefer to see the NHL style of play where players have to be more creative to create their chances on goal.

Bigger rinks have their place, and I think they should stay in the European Leagues (I'm from the UK btw). My home ice is a small pad, and I personnally hate playing on olympic size ice, yes it gives less experience players time to think, so it has it's benefits. But it's also hilarious to see teams that are used to the olympic size rinks coming to our ice, because they are so used to having all the time in the world, and it enevitably leads to some pretty big hits!

The disparity between the teams in this tournament is great, that's why you see 1-4 formations. This doesn't happen when two equal teams play each other.Regardless, i enjoy more tactics in the game, not less.

I don't think the NHL is more creative. This argument that the smaller rink benefits better players because you have to react quicker and make decisions quicker is completely bogus. The bigger rink without question favors the better skaters, stick handlers, passers, play makers. Why else would lesser teams play such a trapped game? Because they have more time to make plays? No, it's the opposite: bigger rink exposes weaker players and if they don't play a conservative team game they'll get demolished.

Look at the Latvia Canada game. A ridiculous, unbalanced game from a skill perspective. THAT's why Latvia had to play such a suffocating defensive style, and it isn't their style that caused Canada not to score, it was Canada. This isn't soccer where a team plays a defensive game and the offensive team barely has any shots... this is hockey, they had a crap ton of shots. They should have scored.

I've played on bigger ice and then returned home to smaller ice. I didn't suffer one bit, the opposite, i was flying. I was moving faster than i had ever moved because i was still used to having to continuously use my legs to make up ground on big ice, once i returned home (for those few weeks) my legs were always moving, i was always cycling, never coasting.

[iceman8310 105]

just go to finnish hybrid ice

[Neo5370 132]

I guess guys like Selanne and Bure were reduced to pluggers in the NHL. Such a shame they never showcased their speed.

While I appreciate the sentiment, you picked two all-time, all-world greats as your examples, but for every Selanne or Bure, there are way more Patrik Stefans. This was a poor way to make your point (which I neither disagree nor agree w/ btw).

[chippa13 1844]

What you were supposed to take from that was the sentiment. Plenty of speedsters come into the league and slice around and thru defenses. Seguin seems to do ok when he tries. Are we lamenting the fact that Stefan was a bust? Should we cry that Daigle didn't blossom, too?

[Neo5370 132]

No. The post you responded to claimed that fast-skating Europeans "adapt" to the "slower" NHL speed. This was a general assertion. You attempted to refute it by pointing to two extremely rare anomalies. The flaw with your reply is that while it is true that some fast-skating Europeans come over, continue to play that way, and are successful, however, there are/were likely many more fast-skating Europeans that could not continue to play that way and become successful.

What you said: "Selanne and Bure didn't need bigger ice to showcase their speed, therefore, other fast-skating players wouldn't benefit from playing on bigger ice."

That's like saying: "Bill Gates didn't need college to become successful, therefore, other people don't need college to be successful."

You're not wrong, but you're not really right either. This type of argument simply does not address whether bigger ice is better or worse; it simply associates your point of view with something appealing which in this case happens to be two of the best hockey players of all time.

Further more, we don't know if those two would have been even better (or worse) on bigger ice.

By your logic, I can claim that Selanne and Bure didn't need Vapor APX's to skate fast, so there is absolutely no reason for anyone to use APX's.

[chippa13 1844]

What you said: "Selanne and Bure didn't need bigger ice to showcase their speed, therefore, other fast-skating players wouldn't benefit from playing on bigger ice."

You're little word game is not what I wrote or intended. Please don't try to put words in my mouth, I don't want us both to sound pretentious.

[Neo5370 132]

You don't think this guy could play in the nhl? You're out of your mind.

The nhl ice is a clutter f/ck. you have 5 increasingly faster and stronger guys skating around with 4 goddamn refs. There's no room. Yes the game seems quicker because you only have a few steps before someone is on you....

Every time a big ice player comes into the nhl (think ovi) they are flying their first few years but then what happens? They all adapt into a quick burst choppy stride type of player as needed.

Guys in the nhl are quicker but guys in Europe have more end to end speed. I like seeing actual skating, skating that picks up speed, not the one second bursts you see in the nhl.

Look at Crosby... Kid couldn't skate end to end right now if he tried. I love watching finland play, they don't just dump the puck in, they take it back and reassess , charge with 4 guys... That's better hockey to me.

And to reply to the post above: yes shorter distance from blue line to goal line but it is still wider. And down low there's more room to set up. We see more passes, more pivots, and nicer slap shot goals from the point. I don't care of people collapse, collapse all you want, cuz the cycling is better.

This guy implies, "Euros can't skate fast on NHL (smaller) ice cuz no roomz.

I guess guys like Selanne and Bure were reduced to pluggers in the NHL. Such a shame they never showcased their speed.

You imply, "Nuh uh, Selanne and Bure could do it, itz not so hardz."

EDIT: Ok, I'll concede that the above may be not what you meant, but that's how I interpreted it. And I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

[grnmtnvt 18]

Concussions in the NHL will not be changed by the size of the rink, more likely by change in equipment and/or penalties.

There was a well defined problem in the NFL that was being negligently hidden to the detriment of the safety of players- there is no such conspiracy in hockey. The NFL is not changing the field size because players are hurting each other- the NFL analogy makes no sense. The NFL isn't saying, 'hey, lets add 10 yards on each side to reduce concussions', they are increasing medical attention, enforcing a head hits rule, and a well defined protocol for what happens after. If anything, giving players more space will let them get up to a faster speed east-west and cause more of the most dangerous concussion causing hits which involve lateral trauma- see Eric Lindros.

There never seems to be a problem to fix until they fix it and everyone's like "yah yah!" . I've seen these counter arguments before when the nhl was considering all the infraction rules. Again, I repeat that the NHL will have to consider rink size soon. Players are getting too fast and too strong. Soon you'll see what's happening in the nfl come to the nhl - how does the nhl answer the concussion issue?

A rink size between nhl and olympic size is going to be the only option

[grnmtnvt 18]

So, lesser teams wouldn't play the trap on smaller ice? You play the trap regardless of the size of rink, it is an issue of skill.

I would argue the opposite, big rinks allow weaker players more room to make marginal plays that wouldn't work on a smaller surface. You can be a marginal skater on larger ice because the passing game can get you out of it and not suffer. Weaker teams can keep puck possession longer (as weaker teams do in soccer all the time), slow the game down with mind numbing cycling on the half boards, and trap when they don't have the puck. How does a bigger ice surface= better stick handlers? You have to do less of it because you spend less time actually engaged with other players close in. I think the countries that play on those rinks have traditionally focused more on those skills and that is being confused with the rink causing that skill development. But that has changed in the last 20+ years.

The Latvia game doesn't support your argument. They would have played that style on a smaller rink too. Collapsing on the goalie is a style that would be played on either rink. Had the goalie not been a wizard, it would have been different. It had nothing to do with the size of the rink. I don't think the NHL is more creative, but I don't think that your argument that bigger ice=more interesting games & more skilled players is a very valid argument.

The disparity between the teams in this tournament is great, that's why you see 1-4 formations. This doesn't happen when two equal teams play each other.Regardless, i enjoy more tactics in the game, not less.

I don't think the NHL is more creative. This argument that the smaller rink benefits better players because you have to react quicker and make decisions quicker is completely bogus. The bigger rink without question favors the better skaters, stick handlers, passers, play makers. Why else would lesser teams play such a trapped game? Because they have more time to make plays? No, it's the opposite: bigger rink exposes weaker players and if they don't play a conservative team game they'll get demolished.

Look at the Latvia Canada game. A ridiculous, unbalanced game from a skill perspective. THAT's why Latvia had to play such a suffocating defensive style, and it isn't their style that caused Canada not to score, it was Canada. This isn't soccer where a team plays a defensive game and the offensive team barely has any shots... this is hockey, they had a crap ton of shots. They should have scored.

I've played on bigger ice and then returned home to smaller ice. I didn't suffer one bit, the opposite, i was flying. I was moving faster than i had ever moved because i was still used to having to continuously use my legs to make up ground on big ice, once i returned home (for those few weeks) my legs were always moving, i was always cycling, never coasting.

[KILLERWHALE 6]

European players fly around freely in Euro leagues because there aren't Scott Stevens on the ice to control their confidence.

Players, especially speedsters know right away in the NHL they need to be more aware that the Prongers, Stevens, :P haneufs etc. won't allow you to do as you please in their zone.

Let it be. Both are great to watch. I'd rather see BOTH over seeing one style of hockey. I think everyone enjoys both NHL and Olympic games. The players who shine on both stages show their true mastery of the game. Incredible.

Ovi slowed down because the owner/management told him not to go full OVI during regular season because his style is prone to injury type situations. He's a missle, but now respects the fact that some guys can drill him and end his career.

The best hockey players know when to coast and speed up at timely moments. Datsyuk is a speed demon, but knows when to tone it down, and even slow the game down when he chooses, increasing his deceptiveness potential. Genius

[thejackal 46]

Let it be. Both are great to watch. I'd rather see BOTH over seeing one style of hockey. I think everyone enjoys both NHL and Olympic games. The players who shine on both stages show their true mastery of the game. Incredible.

I like this comment. The fact that there are two sizes in surfaces makes things a lot more interesting from a tactics and player selection point of view. If hockey ever does adopt a Champions League format, it would make home ice advantage even more crucial, and upsets memorable.

It's a bit less drastic than box vs field lacrosse, or soccer vs futsal, but it's the differences which add to both types of play.

[Chadd 916]

European players fly around freely in Euro leagues because there aren't Scott Stevens on the ice to control their confidence.

Players, especially speedsters know right away in the NHL they need to be more aware that the Prongers, Stevens, :P haneufs etc. won't allow you to do as you please in their zone.

Let it be. Both are great to watch. I'd rather see BOTH over seeing one style of hockey. I think everyone enjoys both NHL and Olympic games. The players who shine on both stages show their true mastery of the game. Incredible.

Ovi slowed down because the owner/management told him not to go full OVI during regular season because his style is prone to injury type situations. He's a missle, but now respects the fact that some guys can drill him and end his career.

The best hockey players know when to coast and speed up at timely moments. Datsyuk is a speed demon, but knows when to tone it down, and even slow the game down when he chooses, increasing his deceptiveness potential. Genius

Ovechkin was getting penalized and suspended for things that other guys did and do (without penalty) on a nightly basis.

Personally, I wouldn't take much pride in the fact that north american leagues have guys who are looking to injure people. It says a lot about our culture.

[DigiV 6]

Concussions in the NHL will not be changed by the size of the rink, more likely by change in equipment and/or penalties.

There was a well defined problem in the NFL that was being negligently hidden to the detriment of the safety of players- there is no such conspiracy in hockey. The NFL is not changing the field size because players are hurting each other- the NFL analogy makes no sense. The NFL isn't saying, 'hey, lets add 10 yards on each side to reduce concussions', they are increasing medical attention, enforcing a head hits rule, and a well defined protocol for what happens after. If anything, giving players more space will let them get up to a faster speed east-west and cause more of the most dangerous concussion causing hits which involve lateral trauma- see Eric Lindros.

Changing equipment/penalties will only do so much when players of increasing size and speed have no where to go. I did not flesh out my NFL analogy well enough, my fault. The point i was trying to make was that the NFL started to tackle the problem of scoring more points because they think it will make it more exciting. And, yes it does make it more exciting to an extent, but now with the concussion issue the changing of the rules can and i believe will lead the game to be watered down. We're already at a point where people can barely get tackled.

Your belief that having bigger ice would cause more concussion is bull. Have we seen anyone get splattered yet in this tournament? You think hockey players enjoy open ice hits? they don't, not even those that give it.

So, lesser teams wouldn't play the trap on smaller ice? You play the trap regardless of the size of rink, it is an issue of skill.

I would argue the opposite, big rinks allow weaker players more room to make marginal plays that wouldn't work on a smaller surface. You can be a marginal skater on larger ice because the passing game can get you out of it and not suffer. Weaker teams can keep puck possession longer (as weaker teams do in soccer all the time), slow the game down with mind numbing cycling on the half boards, and trap when they don't have the puck. How does a bigger ice surface= better stick handlers? You have to do less of it because you spend less time actually engaged with other players close in. I think the countries that play on those rinks have traditionally focused more on those skills and that is being confused with the rink causing that skill development. But that has changed in the last 20+ years.

The Latvia game doesn't support your argument. They would have played that style on a smaller rink too. Collapsing on the goalie is a style that would be played on either rink. Had the goalie not been a wizard, it would have been different. It had nothing to do with the size of the rink. I don't think the NHL is more creative, but I don't think that your argument that bigger ice=more interesting games & more skilled players is a very valid argument.

Weaker players do better on bigger ice? Absolutely not. What bigger ice has actually done is show you how many guys are bad skaters, puck handlers, passers. You can get away with a lot more on smaller ice in terms of skills. The latvia game doesn't support my argument? Yes, it does. I don't think you read what i wrote right. I never said they wouldn't of played that way on smaller ice, i've been saying that teams play the trap on NHL size rinks as well.

Olympic ice may be too big for most to handle, but the NHL size is going to be increasingly too small as players become faster and stronger. There needs to be a compromise, as someone suggested, the Finnish league is a fitting medium.

[deathb4dismount 11]

NHL ice is not changing, get over it

[grnmtnvt 18]

Yup, there's not a chance, with another record year of profits that the NHL touches anything at all with regards to something as fundamental as rink size. Conversion costs alone would be a barrier, why cut into profits while reducing the number of seats in the rink. But, I guess we will see at the next GM meeting.

[DigiV 6]

Coming back to the nhl and geeze.... There's no room to skate! You guys complaining about teams collapsing, here guys just get stood up at the blue line! There's no room for guys to even get going.

But I will say yes there is more scoring, great. Game doesn't look as nice to watch though.

[IPv6Freely 2092]

Much more entertaining though.

[grnmtnvt 18]

Yes, it has been tough coming back to a faster more offensive style of play. Hard to watch, really.

[oldman 1]

An interesting article on Parise's and Suter's views of playing on the Olympic size ice.

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/2014/02/27/zach-parise-isnt-a-fan-of-big-ice-surfaces-like-in-sochi/