hyprlte 0 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 Last night in my league game the opposing team was on the rush into our zone. As the player crossed the blue line, he went in skates first then puck (at a point both feet were in our zone and the puck was on his stick still in the neutral zone). I after the play I told the ref "isn't that offside?" He proceeded to tell me no, because the player had possession. I remember seeing this exact play in the NHL and the ref called offside. What is the appropriate call? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
althoma1 574 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 I believe as long as you're in control of the puck you can skate the thing in backwards. The key is you have to already be in control of the puck before you cross the blue line. You can't be settling the puck down or just receiving the pass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zebra_steve 11 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 I cannot Speak for Canadian rules, but in USA Hockey you are permitted to precede the puck into the zone as long as you are in possession AND control of the puck before and while you are entering the zone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktang 34 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 Canadian rules are the same. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
technophile 0 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 It's surprising how many refs around here don't know that, though. I've seen several players called for offsides when they were carrying the puck either to their side or backing in (with control). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
furlanitalia 1 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 Just make sure no teammates are around you because unless I'm mistaken they can't enter until the puck is in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktang 34 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 It's surprising how many refs around here don't know that, though. I've seen several players called for offsides when they were carrying the puck either to their side or backing in (with control).It used to be offsides, but the rule was changed. So a lot of refs and linesmen still call it offsides because that is what they grew up with. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Law Goalie 147 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 I'm not 100% on this, but I think much of the confusion comes from the difference between putting yourself offside, and putting your team offside, as furlan suggested.If you skate the puck in backwards, you are onside; your teammates, however, are not onside until the puck crosses, regardless of whether your own body is currently onside. You could be all the way inside the zone, dragging the puck behind you, but your team can't follow you in until the puck goes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shotty 7 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 that gets called in our league all the time. i'm personally ok with it because it never seems to be on us. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lappy 0 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 It used to be offsides, but the rule was changed. So a lot of refs and linesmen still call it offsides because that is what they grew up with.To support this, Rick Nash did this during the Olympics and no Offside was called. He went in skating backwards and left it onside for the Trailer (Thornton I think) to shoot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie Joe 0 Report post Posted March 17, 2010 Not offside, by the rules but also as a puck carrier you are not creating an unfair advatage by carrying the puck into the zone in this fashion. Backwards or forwards you still have to wait as a supporting winger (for eg. sakes) for the carrier to "cross the line" before coming into the offensive zone. Its a technical point, but a good question never the less. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hyprlte 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2010 To support this, Rick Nash did this during the Olympics and no Offside was called. He went in skating backwards and left it onside for the Trailer (Thornton I think) to shoot.its interesting you menioned that, because i saw this in a leaf game awhile back and he was called. One of the refs i spoke to told me that this situation is in every ref exam. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gummer12 134 Report post Posted March 18, 2010 If it was called..someone else (non-puck carrier) must have been offside before the puck cleared the line, or the ref ruled that the puck carrier didn't have sufficient control of the puck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktang 34 Report post Posted March 18, 2010 Or the ref got the question wrong on the ref exam... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zebra_steve 11 Report post Posted March 19, 2010 Or the ref got the question wrong on the ref exam...You would not believe how many officials miss this question on their tests...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
technophile 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2010 I bet I would believe it. :P Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chadd 916 Report post Posted March 20, 2010 You would not believe how many officials miss this question on their tests......I'm surprised at how many questions some of the more experienced guys around here miss. Guys with a decade or two of experience keep their level two or tree by the skin of their teeth at times. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktang 34 Report post Posted March 21, 2010 I'm surprised at how many questions some of the more experienced guys around here miss. Guys with a decade or two of experience keep their level two or tree by the skin of their teeth at times.We had a debate about this very rule in the officials' room a few weeks ago. A very experienced (OK, older) linesman kept insisting that the correct call is "off-side". We found the situation in the case book, but he still insisted that it is "off-side".We bet money on it for him to go find out, but nothing happened afterwards. Would have been easy money for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zebra_steve 11 Report post Posted March 22, 2010 Yeah, and we still have guys refusing to call the game to the new standard..... ain't that so Chadd? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chk hrd 164 Report post Posted March 22, 2010 I think one of the problems is some of the older refs refuse to stay current with the updates and changes so when they are working with the younger guys the wrong calls are learned. Even if the younger refs thinks it's wrong the older one usually over rides it or refuses to believe them. And if a coach or player ever questions a rule, regardless of how nice you do it, they get offended. One thing that I would love to see is the ref's having to get reviewed by thier associations every year. And it should be an unscheduled review so they have no idea it's happening and are thier normal cheery selves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zebra_steve 11 Report post Posted March 22, 2010 Chk Hrd, you just touched on several of the biggest head aches I get to deal with regularly every season because of all the different "jobs" i have in hockey......You make a very valid point in that part of the problem here is the "experienced official slipping back to his old familiar standard because e done it that way for years. The veteran officials need to think about the new standard because of this and it really is tough. The younger guys really haven't called it any other way so it's easier for them - until they sit there and watch a vet go "old school standard"..... Every official "should" get an evaluation at least once a year. More frequently is preferable. The biggest issue is manpower as in there are a whole bunch of zebras and a hand full of guy that VOLUNTEER to go out and evaluate or train. Most are still skating a full schedule, working their real jobs, and have a family too.... Easy to say go train them or evaluate them.... Great in theory, but really hard to accomplish in the real world... but I'm working on it.... I Have to train the trainers and evaluators first.Normally I have pre, post game meetings with the official I am evaluating. I do perform the no notice reviews and evaluations, but these are normally reserved for guys that we have documented frequent complaints that have a recurring theme. You never really know who is in the building or who is standing behind that video camera.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chadd 916 Report post Posted March 23, 2010 Yeah, and we still have guys refusing to call the game to the new standard..... ain't that so Chadd?At our local clinic a lot of the laughed and said things like "I'll never call that" when they showed the initial video.Every official "should" get an evaluation at least once a year. More frequently is preferable. The biggest issue is manpower as in there are a whole bunch of zebras and a hand full of guy that VOLUNTEER to go out and evaluate or train. Most are still skating a full schedule, working their real jobs, and have a family too.... Easy to say go train them or evaluate them.... Great in theory, but really hard to accomplish in the real world... but I'm working on it.... I Have to train the trainers and evaluators first.Our local evaluators stopped doing evaluations because a couple guys didn't like the feedback they got. Then again, the evaluators are largely the people working varsity and college games, so every additional ref at that level is money out of their pocket. Not all of them think that way, but enough do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdaves 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2010 Not to jack this thread, but i had another question, if there were an official that maybe has an answer to my question.Recently while at an AHL game in Hamilton, a delayed penalty was called. The play was blown dead in the defensive zone (of the team that was going on the PP). Instead of having the faceoff at a dot outside the blue-line, the play went all the way down to the attacking zone? How long has this been in affect, and is it in all leagues now? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chippa13 1844 Report post Posted March 23, 2010 The AHL has been doing it for 2 or 3 seasons now. Like a lot of these types of rules, the NHL will ask the AHL to test it for them first. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdaves 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2010 Just like the 2ft blue-lines a few seasons ago? so it is currently not in the NHL? thanks for the response! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
