A guy on my team (that I run) has gone crazy

[twolinepass 0]

This guy joined as a free agent... read from TOP to BOTTOM. Emails are separated by ---

XXX,

Just letting you know that you're suspended for the game on Saturday..

twolinepass

----------------

that's fucking bull shit, but thanks for letting me know. I still have no clue why I was ejected from Tuesday's game let alone now the next one. Please challenge that or at minimum find out WHY for me.

twolinepass, please keep this between you and I and don't take it negatively but when I signed up, you told me I'd get to play center forward. I'm not complaining as do want to be a team player (and will play rear position if and when needed and also don't mind wing if other folks are at center) but part of the reason I got ejected for the game Tues. was I was getting tired of watching the opponents players skate all around and through our team and no one challenging them. Again, while I could barely understand them ejecting me for the game Tues, to now be out on Sat is a bunch of crap. On top of that I feel like some of the players on our team (won't mention any names), all they care about is their ice time, not playing as a team to win the games.

I know winning isn't everything and I'll admit I'm not the greatest either, but to have Kyle always getting the call for center and then him double shifting last game, I would sincerely appreciate the opp. ON OCCASION to show what I can do. When I politely requested to skate with Robert you told me I had to "earn it". I have a total of 3 pts all season and it's difficult to contribute more when I'm on a set of 3 wings and 2 centers are double shifting EVERY TIME we have less than 3 full lines of forwards...

Can't say I'm super happy but at the same time haven't been wanting to approach you as 1) I like you personally, 2) enjoy playing, and 3) was hoping to stick with this team moving forward..

Lastly, I paid good money to play and to be out for the next game when the opponent punched me in the head 2 times and I did nothing, well, it's fucked up and you should challenge it.

Let me know if you want me to keep coming after this Sat.'s game, because if not, I'll just stop coming and join another team next season as tired of constantly having to press to be considered an integral part of the team.

XXX

(I dont respond)

-----------------------

Hi twolinepass, hope all is well with you.

Did you get an explanation for why I'm out again tonight please?

Would be nice to also know

1) what happened to that cheap shot on the other team that caused all that, would be nice to know if he is out their next game and beyond...

2) that you understand my comments in my email below and care.

Good luck in the game tonight and tell the rest of the team.

XXXX

-----------------------

XXX,

The reason you are suspended for one game and he is not, is because

you actually received two game misconducts while he only received one.

He got:

5 for Fisticuffs

G for Fisticuffs

While you received:

2 for Roughing (the original call)

5 for Fisticuffs

G for Fisticuffs

10 for Obscene Gesture

G for Too Many Penalties

Arguing one game suspensions is pointless because its our word against

the refs and GUY WHO RUNS LEAGUE doesnt give a shit and wont do anything anyways.

The lines are the way they are because my line and the OTHER PEOPLE LINE

line seem to be working together and the reason your line is the one

that gets broken up all the time is because Zach and Jon are the ones

that miss games and it makes the most sense to keep the other two

lines together. And as for moving you up with Robert/Albert, we could

do it but we never have the center coverage to do it.

As far the the rest of the season and next season go.. You paid so you

can play out the rest of the season but I can tell that you're not

happy with playing time and your positing and it might be better for

you to find another team next season. Hockey is about having fun and

you're not having fun with us, so go out and find a team that will

work better for you so you can have fun while playing hockey.

---------------------------------

twolinepass, thanks sincerely for your email below and please see my comments enbedded below. Again, good luck tonight.

XXXX

The reason you are suspended for one game and he is not, is because

you actually received two game misconducts while he only received one.

He got:

5 for Fisticuffs

G for Fisticuffs

While you received:

2 for Roughing (the original call)

5 for Fisticuffs

THAT'S BULL SHIT-DID YOU EVEN SEE WHAT WENT DOWN? I DID NOT THROW ONE PUNCH

G for Fisticuffs

BULL SHIT-DID YOU EVEN SEE WHAT WENT DOWN? I DID NOT THROW ONE PUNCH

10 for Obscene Gesture

REFS AND OTHER PLAYER(S) DESERVED THAT! BUT I SHOULDN'T HAVE LET IT HAPPEN/DONE IT

G for Too Many Penalties

DUDE, HONESTLY, I THINK I'VE HAD LIKE 1 OR 2 PENALTIES ALL SEASON, SO IF THAT IS FOR THE 2 BULLSHIT FISTICUFFS ABOVE THEN SO BE IT, BUT IS ALSO BULLSHIT AND IF YOU ACTUALLY SAW WHAT HAPPENED YOU KNOW IT...

Arguing one game suspensions is pointless because its our word against

the refs and XXX doesnt give a shit and wont do anything anyways.

UNDERSTAND BUT XXX IS A PRICK AND YOU CAN LET HIM KNOW I SAID THAT IF YOU'D LIKE. I CERTAINLY WILL THE NEXT TIME I SEE HIM.

The lines are the way they are because my line and the XXX line seem to be working together and the reason your line is the one

that gets broken up all the time is because Zach and Jon are the ones

that miss games and it makes the most sense to keep the other two

lines together. And as for moving you up with Robert/Albert, we could

do it but we never have the center coverage to do it.

twoline pass YOU HAD ADVISED ME I'D HAVE A CENTER POSITION, AND I DIDN'T CARE WHETHER ON 3RD (OR 4TH) LINE. HAVE I GOTTEN WHAT YOU COMMITTED. HARDLY.

As far the the rest of the season and next season go.. You paid so you

can play out the rest of the season but I can tell that you're not

happy with playing time and your positing and it might be better for

you to find another team next season. Hockey is about having fun and

you're not having fun with us, so go out and find a team that will

work better for you so you can have fun while playing hockey.

TWOLINEPASS UNLESS YOU PREFER TO REFUND ME THE CASH FOR THE LAST FEW GAMES, AND I SINCERELY HOPE THAT IS NOT THE CASE, I DO WANT TO PLAY AND PROMISE YOU I WILL CONTRIBUTE AS MUCH AS CAN WHEREVER YOU PUT ME (TIRED OF HAVING TO BE A SQUEAKY WHEEL) TO HAVE AS MUCH FUN AS POSSIBLE AND FINISH THE SEASON OFF STONG. AS FAR AS NEXT SEASON, PERHAPS HOW THE LAST FEW GAMES GO, YOU WILL SEE THAT I CAN BE A GOOD TEAM PLAYER AND WORTHY OF STICKING WITH YOU FOR MOVING FORWARD PLEASE. SORRY I DON'T LIKE LOSING, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE SHOULD WIN, NOR GETTING PUNCHED TO THE HEAD 2 TIMES WHEN JUST PLAYING A LITTLE AGGRESIVELY TO TRY TO SPARK THE TEAM. LOOKING FORWARD TO YOUR HOPEFULLY POSITIVE REPLY TO THIS...

----------------------------

twolinepass, still expecting to hear back from you regarding my email below (and comments embedded 2 below) please.

Hope you had a good weekend.

Mike

-------

What do I do? I dont really want this guy on the team and he doesnt seem to be getting the hint...

[Chadd 916]

Take up a collection from the rest of the team and pay him not to show up. Or pay it out of your own pocket.

[sickwilly 37]

He did give you and "out" to let him go a couple of times in the email exchanges. I agree with Chadd that it would be a good idea to refund a prorated amount of his payment to try to avoid further conflict.

[JSK81 400]

As shitty as it is, I'd give the guy his money back and tell him he's weakening the team spirit, wishing him good luck in some other team.

[Chadd 916]

As shitty as it is, I'd give the guy his money back and tell him he's weakening the team spirit, wishing him good luck in some other team.

I wouldn't tell him anything other than good luck. No need to make the situation any worse, especially if you may have to play against him in the future.

[W.Heinle 0]

I wouldn't tell him anything other than good luck. No need to make the situation any worse, especially if you may have to play against him in the future.

I would inform the league as he signed up directly with them and ended up on your team through them.

...unless I misunderstood the 'This guy joined as a free agent' comment.

[JSK81 400]

I wouldn't tell him anything other than good luck. No need to make the situation any worse, especially if you may have to play against him in the future.

You might be right Chadd, I just tried to put it diplomatically cause the guy seems to demand an explanation every time.

A simple refund, thank you and bye should be enough.

[wrangler 157]

OK, aside from the emails, you don't want him on the team, based, I gather, on his all his behavior. I'm not seeing the "gone crazy" here -- this seems to be a guy who thinks, at least, that he's trying to work with you, and expressing his concerns. Obviously, you know him, and we don't. What do your teammates want?

If the team doesn't want him to finish the season, maybe you can just tell him you're sorry it didn't work out with you, and hope things will be better with another team. As sickwilly said, he's half ready to take a refund and go, and sounds like he expects that. You've got the best read on how to talk to this guy, since you know him; suggestions from us may not be all that helpful for that reason. Approaches have to vary with the personality of the indiviudual being approached. Good luck.

[Hawkeye 0]

How many games do you have left?

I would just buy him out at this point. Everyone is going to be uncomfortable if he stays, his postion on the team isn't going to change, and he's still going to be complaining if he doesn't get moved up in the "depth chart"

How many guys do you have on the team? Seems to me that if you have more than 15 showing up night in night out you have too many guys. Everyone wants ice time and in a mens league if you have more than 3 full lines someone is getting left out. Sounds like this guy is that guy.

If you don't have the money, or everyone won't cough up some cash, you may just have to ride it out.

My concern would be that he may want a refund for his suspended game, and perhaps the game he was tossed too. Which of course would change your buyout figure.

[5 Minute Major 1]

I'm in a similar situation. I wanted so badly to refund the guys money but decided to just stick it out (half way through the season) being this is the team's first year together. He s not going to be back next season though.

[ibeck 38]

Have you thought about giving him money back based on how many games are left in your season then just having a sub pay for when he plays?

[SNIPER91 2]

Sounds like a sticky situation..I as well, dont see the "gone crazy" part, but you know this player. I would have a talk with the rest of the teammates to get their take on the situation. Maybe try a probationary game or two to see if he can contribute in a positive mannor? If he needs to be put on "waivers" (lol) I think its only fair to refund his remaining money..IMHO

[McDugan 89]

I also fail to see how the guy is going crazy. We clearly don't have the full story here, but he seems not only to not be going crazy but to have a legit gripe and to be rightfully upset. He's given clear, thought-out responses to your messages and has to follow up and bug you just to get you to respond. Frenkly, your initial message telling him he was suspended with no explanation was rude and if I were in his shoes, that'd piss me off too, to have the captain of my team send me something like that without a "sorry, we'll miss you for this one" or any sign of solidarity at all.

I'm also assuming, since you never contest his assertions that he was told he'd play center and is being shunted into other positions, that that is in fact the case. The guy just wants to play on a hockey team. This is adult league, no? Not Jr. High. If you and the majority of the other guys don't want him on the team, man up and make it clearly known. If you don't want him on the team but other people don't have a problem with him, then it's your choice as captain whether or not to pull a dick move on the dude. But, really, he shouldn't have to "get the hint" - he's paid for ice time too, why shouldn't he expect to get it?

[chippa13 1844]

Am I the only one who finds the ideas of "earning the chance to skate with someone" and "depth chart" being used when talking about beer league just a smidge humorous?

If you don't want the guy on the team then simply tell him he is done and refund him for the rest of the season.

[Joshison 1]

I don't think you should be double shifting the same guy all game anyway, I understand you want your lines together but I mean its beer league split the extra time to be fair, everyone paid the same amount of money.

[twolinepass 0]

I would inform the league as he signed up directly with them and ended up on your team through them.

...unless I misunderstood the 'This guy joined as a free agent' comment.

My league just has a place where free agents put their name on a list and captains contact them and ask to join the team. This is how he ended up on my team.

OK, aside from the emails, you don't want him on the team, based, I gather, on his all his behavior. I'm not seeing the "gone crazy" here -- this seems to be a guy who thinks, at least, that he's trying to work with you, and expressing his concerns. Obviously, you know him, and we don't. What do your teammates want?

If the team doesn't want him to finish the season, maybe you can just tell him you're sorry it didn't work out with you, and hope things will be better with another team. As sickwilly said, he's half ready to take a refund and go, and sounds like he expects that. You've got the best read on how to talk to this guy, since you know him; suggestions from us may not be all that helpful for that reason. Approaches have to vary with the personality of the indiviudual being approached. Good luck.

This is just the latest in a laundry list of things he has done..

We are all younger guys, he is 50+ and has a hard time keeping up and complains when he cant double shift as center

throws teammates under the bus

My line scores a lot because I play with my two friends and the 3 of us have played on and off together for 10 + years, the reast of the team is ok with us together, he wants to kick me off my line so he can play on it and show his worth

Says he wants to be a team player but complains when he cant play the position he wants

Am I the only one who finds the ideas of "earning the chance to skate with someone" and "depth chart" being used when talking about beer league just a smidge humorous?

If you don't want the guy on the team then simply tell him he is done and refund him for the rest of the season.

When I said that I just wanted to shut him up because I want to play with my friends..

I have talked to the other 14 guys on the team and nobody wants him back.

[Hawkeye 0]

Am I the only one who finds the ideas of "earning the chance to skate with someone" and "depth chart" being used when talking about beer league just a smidge humorous?

If you don't want the guy on the team then simply tell him he is done and refund him for the rest of the season.

Depth Chart was my post. But I was getting at the same thing you are.

It's beer league. Roll your lines and everyone play hard. The only time you should be doubling guys or shortening the bench is in the last 5 of a tight game or in the playoffs. Otherwise your team is missing the point.

[twolinepass 0]

I don't think you should be double shifting the same guy all game anyway, I understand you want your lines together but I mean its beer league split the extra time to be fair, everyone paid the same amount of money.

He is talking about when we roll 3 sets of wings and two centers. He is our worst and slowest center so he gets dropped to wing.

[Joshison 1]

He is talking about when we roll 3 sets of wings and two centers. He is our worst and slowest center so he gets dropped to wing.

I gotcha, I must* have misread.

[Hawkeye 0]

He is talking about when we roll 3 sets of wings and two centers. He is our worst and slowest center so he gets dropped to wing.

If he can't be a team player then he needs to go.

When you have a 2 center/3 sets of wings situation. Your best two centers have to take the ice. Then you have the wings kill off penalties to even up the ice time.

If he can't figure that out he doesn't have a place on the team.

[twolinepass 0]

I gotcha, I must* have misread.

It wasnt clear in the email at all, not your fault :)

If he can't be a team player then he needs to go.

When you have a 2 center/3 sets of wings situation. Your best two centers have to take the ice. Then you have the wings kill off penalties to even up the ice time.

If he can't figure that out he doesn't have a place on the team.

I tend to agree, I feel bad because its beer league but seeing that people agree that he needs to go is making me feel better about doing it.

I guess I had warning, this was an email he sent when he joined the team

twolinepass, you're cool no worries, and your email was perfect for me. FYI I've managed adult teams a few times so can help you through this, no worries.

My advicee to you:

The first hurdle is to get around 15 players (3 forward lines and 3 rear pairs) - that'll make for covering the ridiculous high team fees and if a few don't show up once in a while , more playing time for those who do. Too many more than that (15 skaters) and people will start to complain about ice time and too many less than that you'll get beat by teams who do have a full roster, especially if several of your/our players aren't all conditioned reasaonably well.

And do you have a decent goalie yet? Gotta have a gaolie who is decent and will show up routinely, otherwise that'll make for a shitty season. Nothing sucks more than showing up to a game and not having a goalie (and then having to forfeit the game and not get to play a regular competitive game.

Anyway, I'm available for you, call me any time on my cell at XXXX and I'm excited about playing and if you need any help kind of coaching the team, getting eveyone on the same page with respect to taking shorter than longer shifts and going full speed while out on the ice as well as putting players at their least vulnerable positions, let me know, I'll be happy to assist...Not so much like to coach, but you need to take command so that during games players will do what you ask them/play where you want them to etc...I had teams where players would switch where I put them for a game to play with their buds, and honestly as a team every player needs to play with which ever lineup makes the team most potent. Mostly don't like to lose bad because not prepared or people on the team aren't playing with and for and as a team. Anyway, take care my man and I'm looking forward to meeting you in person.

Also, I assure you, I will be a solid contributor-not a weak link on this team, but be careful about picking just anyone up of the free agent list, there's some dweebs who suck and keep trying to play at levels way higher than they should be at and you get a few of them on your/our team and it can be a nightmare (had that happen and we lost a lot of games bad because just too many weak players...). If you want to send me a roster list (how many players did you get from the free agent list?) I'll check it to make sure none of them hooked up on your/our team for you....Still not to late to advise them sorry, don't have enough spots. I know that sounds mean but I know some of these characters and the teams that have been in these leagues for a while will all avoid them like the plague and you/we should to. I can also have you read names off the free agent liist (whic I don'ty have access to and vice versa may recognize players who are decent...

XXX

[CAmmon 2]

It sounds like you've made up your mind. Now you just need to man up and deal with it.

[Chadd 916]

If he can't be a team player then he needs to go.

When you have a 2 center/3 sets of wings situation. Your best two centers have to take the ice. Then you have the wings kill off penalties to even up the ice time.

If he can't figure that out he doesn't have a place on the team.

I'm always lobbying to get less ice time. I'd rather play wing with three pair of wings or three lines than play D and be out every other shift.

[rollpride59 0]

toss a coin up heads he stays tails he goes.. you'll know which to do when its in the air

[Joshison 1]

Think he got this one figured out considering this was from July.