Forged Composite

[mmmjags 0]

Is there any chance of forged composite being used in hockey products? The tiny bit I read about it seems like it would work.

[interpathway 9]

Forging by definition is taking a malleable substance and beating it into shape, am I wrong here?

Can't imagine delicate carbon fibers being heated to such extreme temperatures and molded in this manner.

And what would be forged?

OPS blades with bladders and foams in them?

Hollow and squared OPS shafts?

Composite skates and toe caps (read: not easily shaped without molds)?

Can't see it happening.

[mmmjags 0]

I don't think it's made using high heat. Callaway made a golf club using it and Lamborghini made a concept car with it. Here's a tiny bit of info from Callaway's website: http://www.callawaygolf.com/Global/en-CA/Innovation/ForgedCompositeTechnology/WhatIsForgedComposite.html. The newest issue of Car and Driver has a short article about it that explains the difference between forged composite and a typical woven composite.

I'm no engineer, so I have no idea what applications are realistic. It just seems like an interesting technology.

[interpathway 9]

Gotcha.

Bobby Jones Golf (and Callaway too, link didn't work for me) have been using forged carbon crowns on their drivers, fairway woods, and hybrids to lessen the weight up top to move discretionary weight lower to the ground and under the ball; read easier to get airborne.

The only problem is that these companies manufacture their pieces to mere millimeters thick, which unless highly resistant to damage will potentially be destroyed through the game of hockey.

But who knows, if you don't push the envelope we'd still be shooting with SW5030s (shudder).

[trevor13478 1]

I just read the article in car and driver about Lamborghini working with Callaway Golf to help develop and apply this technology to cars. I think there could be a future in hockey for this technology for sure. The fact that an elite car manufacturer is using the material for key structural components of a high performance vehicle is pretty encouraging that it could be strong enough to be applied to hockey.

The pros are that the molding process is much faster and easier than typical carbon weave molding, which means less man hours so likely cheaper manufacturing. Seemed like Callaway was able to make their molds much more accurate as opposed to the standard weave and the article said it can be stronger because of the fibers being aligned randomly instead of uniformly woven. Seemed to make sense to me, but I'm not an engineer by any means. I could see getting a uniform flex being a problem with the fibers being assorted differently but I don't know much about it. Sounds interesting to say the least...

[JR Boucicaut 3759]

Forge it to WHAT?

There isn't metal in a hockey stick.

[HattrickSwayze 3]

http://www.carbonfibergear.com/what-is-forged-composite-a-new-way-of-using-carbon-fiber/

As far as I can tell, it's called forged because of the process they use, not because it's forged to metal. Seems interesting.

[jsykes 35]

Forge it to WHAT?

There isn't metal in a hockey stick.

Forging isnt specific to metal, its a process for forming shapes out of a material. Its most commonly used with metal and basically is a process that takes a hunk of material (metal, or in this case a clump of the carbon fiber and glue) and uses a press and pressure to form the material into a shape. Sometimes heat is involved, sometimes not.

So in the carbon forging, instead of laying out sheets of carbon material on top of a mold and laying on the resin that will bond it, then putting into a vacuum that will press it all together and get out any air bubbles and impregnate the carbon fibers with the resin, the forging takes a hunk of the carbon materials already mixed with the resin, puts it into a shape or mold and then its pressed into the shape. This will get all the air bubbles out and create a solid carbon shape.

Interesting idea, but I think it would be difficult to implement in hockey sticks.

[NYRSinceBirth 0]

Forging by definition is taking a malleable substance and beating it into shape, am I wrong here?

Can't imagine delicate carbon fibers being heated to such extreme temperatures and molded in this manner.

Can't see it happening.

From my experience (build motors for cars), the idea behind forging makes the material stronger, in less space or in less or similar weight. It allows forged aluminum connecting rods be as strong at their steel (heavier) counterparts. The materials can be forged into blanks (big blocks) and CNC'd, or forged into raw shapes/designs then machined into finer end products. But my experience has been the same: metal heated and beaten. The heat might only be required to make the metal maleable and stronger (heat treatment), it may not be necessary for carbon weave/fibers. However, the forging boils down to strength characteristics and shape. Basically.

I'm not sure exactly of how the Callaway process works, but it sounds like the forging comes from the compressing or treatment of the carbon weave. It doesn't necessarily need metal to be forged in there way. How they do this, I don't really know, but if Lambo picked it up, it's probably very useful. Most likely expensive, but I'm sure it could be adapted to hockey equipment.

[mnpucker 33]

Nano technology will be the next advancement in hockey sticks. Fishing rods are currently utilizing Nano tech. Claims are increased strength and sensitivity..... Same characteristics we look for in composite sticks.

[Drewhunz 3]

NEXT???? It was attempted twice and was more or less unsuccessful in both applications.

[JR Boucicaut 3759]

Nano technology will be the next advancement in hockey sticks. Fishing rods are currently utilizing Nano tech. Claims are increased strength and sensitivity..... Same characteristics we look for in composite sticks.

Been done

Forging isnt specific to metal, its a process for forming shapes out of a material. Its most commonly used with metal and basically is a process that takes a hunk of material (metal, or in this case a clump of the carbon fiber and glue) and uses a press and pressure to form the material into a shape. Sometimes heat is involved, sometimes not.

So in the carbon forging, instead of laying out sheets of carbon material on top of a mold and laying on the resin that will bond it, then putting into a vacuum that will press it all together and get out any air bubbles and impregnate the carbon fibers with the resin, the forging takes a hunk of the carbon materials already mixed with the resin, puts it into a shape or mold and then its pressed into the shape. This will get all the air bubbles out and create a solid carbon shape.

Interesting idea, but I think it would be difficult to implement in hockey sticks.

But you don't want a solid carbon blade...

[Drewhunz 3]

So nobody has to wonder:

Easton Stealth CNT- Used nanosolve. Used chopped CNT's as a bridge in the adherance of shaft to blade. As seen in its durability issues- it didn't help much.

Montreal Nitro Lite- used Hybtonite nano epoxy (similar properties to nanosolve) as well as nanotubes in shaft and blade construction. $225 pricepoint from a fringe company+ ABS core blade didn't make for a hot seller. As Warrior now owns Montreal we'll see if this technology gets another shot in the arm.

[jsykes 35]

Been done

But you don't want a solid carbon blade...

Correct, hence the reason I said its not likely useful for sticks.

[watchgreat 4]

The cnt was a big hit, no?

[Drewhunz 3]

Durability was shit.

[mnpucker 33]

Info on this site never ceases to amaze me.....my bad.

[raganblink 82]

Durability was shit.

Possibly an understatement.

[Chadd 916]

But you don't want a solid carbon blade...

The original Fury blades didn't have a foam core if I remember correctly and were actually pretty decent. I would take them over anything on the market now for feel and durability.

[sickwilly 37]

So nobody has to wonder:

Easton Stealth CNT- Used nanosolve. Used chopped CNT's as a bridge in the adherance of shaft to blade. As seen in its durability issues- it didn't help much.

Montreal Nitro Lite- used Hybtonite nano epoxy (similar properties to nanosolve) as well as nanotubes in shaft and blade construction. $225 pricepoint from a fringe company+ ABS core blade didn't make for a hot seller. As Warrior now owns Montreal we'll see if this technology gets another shot in the arm.

I thought that the Nitro Lites were amazing for the two weeks they lasted. The blade durability was the worst of any OPS I've used, by far.

[mmmjags 0]

From Car and Driver: "Forged composite forgoes the weave and instead uses a random arrangement of loose fibers mixed with resin and forms them in a heated press at high pressure. The resulting composite is strong in all directions without the additional cost and complexity of adding multiple layers of material, as must be done with woven carbon fiber."

Again, I don't know if this is something that could ever be applied to sticks, but fact that it's cheaper and stronger makes it sound promising.

[IniNew 51]

From Car and Driver: "Forged composite forgoes the weave and instead uses a random arrangement of loose fibers mixed with resin and forms them in a heated press at high pressure. The resulting composite is strong in all directions without the additional cost and complexity of adding multiple layers of material, as must be done with woven carbon fiber."

Again, I don't know if this is something that could ever be applied to sticks, but fact that it's cheaper and stronger makes it sound promising.

For manufactures profit margin, yeah.

[Jarick 5]

I think the success of the One95 showed that sticks have hit a really good point in terms of technology, weight, durability, and feel. My guess is that the next "advancement" would have to be a way to manufacture them cheaper to start lowering the price points...I'm not sure how successful the top end sticks well over $200 USD are going to be.

[raganblink 82]

They're good sellers. For every 5 top end sticks we sell, well sell 6 160~ dollar sticks, 7 100~ sticks, and 8 60-70~ dollar sticks. Fine by me. Getting a topend stick is a drug.... super hard to not get another super nice one after you start.

[tareatingrat 4]

They're good sellers. For every 5 top end sticks we sell, well sell 6 160~ dollar sticks, 7 100~ sticks, and 8 60-70~ dollar sticks. Fine by me. Getting a topend stick is a drug.... super hard to not get another super nice one after you start.

Oh god is this true.

Right, wallet?

Wallet?

Oh no...I've bled him dry...