jimmy

Don't take his response in a bad way. It sounds like he's been burnt before, e.g. answering peoples questions, they they screw him by opening their little under the table side business, often at prices lower than his, and then taking many of his customers with them. So I can see why he's gun-shy of helping you. Nothing wrong with being a home sharpener but don't expect your local guy to help you get your mini-business going. I'm not saying at all that's what you are doing, but as I said, he's prob been burnt a few times.

Not to mention it is impossible to make a left turn in VC. No turn lanes, no turn arrows. You can literally spend 1/2 hr at one traffic light. Yea, I wish they would as well. Most haven't figured out that goalies like extreme bite. I use the 100/75 and it's perfect for me but I was skating on 15/32. Those on 5/16 and 1/4 will have to wait till something just for "goalies" is created.

Try the 100/75, at the moment it has the most bite. Most of my goalies who were deep using deep hollows like 3/8 found that the 100/75 gave them plenty of grip. I'm hoping BS will come out with something with more bite than the 100/75, just for goalies like you. But 100/75 may be enough for you.

Absolutely correct. It's hard enough explaining a regular hollow to a customer, having to sell a FBV and explain what it is is a lot of work and does takes time ... and time is money.

and... the spinners are way more expensive than a conventional diamond. and the spinners can only be bought from Blackstone, not from the local diamond store so shipping is more as well. So when you add the initial cost of the machine and supplies, added shipping costs, it does cost more per sharpening.

you dress that often during sharpening? No, only once for a regular sharpening. But cutting new steel needs more passes and clogs stone with metal so it needs to be redressed more. As for spinners, I've found that when the spinner is used up, you will get a flame while dressing because the diamond coating is gone and your dressing metal to stone instead of diamond to stone.

Spinners will last long time if you stick to one spinner setting and are only lightly redressing the wheel. However if you are going back and forth between spinners 100/50, 90/75, 100/75 etc, on the same head, the spinner will wear more. (so will the stone) Not really any different than if you did the same thing with a single point diamond dresser. I'm going thru them quick, but I cut in a lot of new steel and generally dress about 4 times per new pair. As you said, there are many variables, volume for one, but changing settings prob does the most wear.

What I meant was with a hollow the holder can be tilted and you can still get level edges, can't do that with FBV. Of course if one doesn't know how to set up a holder, it doesn't matter what cut, it will still be off.

Yes, true, your alignment has to be very accurate with the FBV. It is not as forgiving as a regular hollow cut. It is very hard to "eyeball". I use a special rubber compound to make a mold. I make a mold of a sharpened blade then examine the mold thru a microscope to ensure edges are perfect and centered. Since there are no measuring tools available yet to verify, for me this seems to be the best method to test alignment of machine and accuracy of the cut.

I believe Blackstone has a dressing system that works on other machines for $1800 plus spinners, So around $2200.

The Rocket runner wasn't a failure, it is a great product. Sharpeners who didn't know how to sharpen it properly, they were the failure. They were the ones who turned customers off to it. Many thought it was the blade and just didn't know it was just an incorrect sharpening.

The only problem I see with that contraption is that you will go thru spinners like crazy. Too hard a press and bingo, the diamond is toast. Pressure on the wheel needs to be controlled and doing it freehand is risky.

The type of sharpening does not mess up the profile, a bad sharpener does that. If they mess up a regular radius, they'll mess up a combo too. Crossgrinders are unnecessary. I'm surprised anyone even sell them anymore.

Law G, yes, that bugs the crap out of me as well. Unless I'm out of position and the net is empty, there is absolutely no reason for a defenseman to try to get the stick with his puck. If they don't tip it in themselves, they usually deflect it to the opposite side of my position on the original shot, where then another opposing player can just plink it in the open net.

Is it similar shape to the Rebellion 3-D blade? "When skating forward, you use mainly the center blade, surface sharpened for heightened speed. This center blade is about three times the width of a conventional blade. Designed to glide on ice, instead of digging in like a conventional blade, it offers less friction for faster less laborious skating. When turning, the radius-sharpened side blade takes over ensuring the entire blade grips the ice surface without gouging."

Nothing worse as a goalie during pick up is for the players to stop playing "hockey". I love it when I'm screened. On the other hand when everybody moves out of the way and lets the shooter waltz in another 20 feet closer (because he now has a clearer shooting lane), that's BS.

Are you kidding, he's loving hockey so much he's spending his whole paycheck in my store. Plenty of opportunity to get rid of him later! :D

As a beginner the same applies to the FBV's as does regular hollows, too much bite is not good. So start with a FBV like 80/50 or 90/50. My daughter's boyfriend just started skating and this worked well for him. At the beginner level, speed is not so important as is control, but the FBV can help in fatigue as most beginners just don't have their "wind" yet.

One of my customers, a Ivy League professor, did timing tests. He had been doing these same tests for long time with his old setup. His results with FBV and some other changes, were remarkable. He said he was never able to achieve the times he got. He even said he was now within split seconds of what NHL'rs were achieving.

Yes, it's called the offset cut. IMO, offsets do not provide any additional grip than a regular deep cut, and a regular cut doesn't prevent slide if you adapted correctly to it.

Goalies who like deep cuts will like the 100/75. Goalies can certainly use all the different FBVs, just find one that has the grip they like and they'll be happy. indacrease, the dual cuts have pretty much gone the wayside as most bfly goalies now want a lot of bite along the whole blade. have your son try 1/2" on the entire blade, you may see he likes that better. of course the 100/75 as well.

80/50

haha :lol: I hadn't thought about that. Only difference is our sand comes from our boots, yours come from your thongs or speedos!

The price of the spinners really has to be figured in, in addition to machine costs which is about 25% higher than a regular machine. You have to get 5 spinners at $85 ea ($425 total plus shipping) to offer the current 5 different FBV's. This is vs 1 diamond at $20 total which can do any hollow. In addition, going back and forth between 100/75 and 90/50, etc, really burns thru the wheels, twice as fast as a conventional dressing. Changing the spinners also takes about twice as long as a regular dressing. So while the mechanical sharpening process may be the same, time and operating costs are more so a premium price is certainly warranted. Other intangibles like having to take 10 minutes to explain and answer questions what a FBV is to interested customers also have to be considered. As for how long a sharpening lasts, I've found that earlier in the year the longevity of the edges was excellent, even longer than a regular. However as the winter came and rink floors were filled with rocks, dirt and sand (from road sanding brought in on shoes), the longevity of the FBV decreased. Those in the south and west who don't have a snow season, don't have to worry. Those of us in snow areas with rinks that do not clean their floors, will find reduced life of edges. I was playing at a rink that had been open for 4 hrs and the locker room had so much crap on the floor I could hear my skates crunching on it. Even worse after I tied my skates, I could feel the crap on the bottom of my sock. Really that bad. You can always wear the hard rubber guards until you step on the ice to prevent damage, but in reality who's going to do that.

There is a couple of reasons why a shop may charge more. FBVs have a performance edge over a regular sharpening. We pay more for OPS because we feel they give more performance, so same should apply for a FBV. In addition, it simply costs more to do FBV's. The initial machine costs are more, the diamonds cost more, and it may take a little longer to sharpen with FBV. Also, stones wear quickly going from 100/75 to 90/50 to 90/75 and back and forth. So, a little extra price for a performance sharpening is not unreasonable. I only charge $1 more. I don't think that is too much, and customers don't seem to mind paying it. No one else near me is doing FBVs, so I prob could charge more, but don't think that's right. At $1 more I'll recoup my costs, that's all I need. I don't think customers would pay double. Some gear whores maybe, but not most. But then again, people in NYC pay $20 for a regular.