jimmy

Yes, true, your alignment has to be very accurate with the FBV. It is not as forgiving as a regular hollow cut. It is very hard to "eyeball". I use a special rubber compound to make a mold. I make a mold of a sharpened blade then examine the mold thru a microscope to ensure edges are perfect and centered. Since there are no measuring tools available yet to verify, for me this seems to be the best method to test alignment of machine and accuracy of the cut.

I believe Blackstone has a dressing system that works on other machines for $1800 plus spinners, So around $2200.

The Rocket runner wasn't a failure, it is a great product. Sharpeners who didn't know how to sharpen it properly, they were the failure. They were the ones who turned customers off to it. Many thought it was the blade and just didn't know it was just an incorrect sharpening.

The only problem I see with that contraption is that you will go thru spinners like crazy. Too hard a press and bingo, the diamond is toast. Pressure on the wheel needs to be controlled and doing it freehand is risky.

The type of sharpening does not mess up the profile, a bad sharpener does that. If they mess up a regular radius, they'll mess up a combo too. Crossgrinders are unnecessary. I'm surprised anyone even sell them anymore.

Law G, yes, that bugs the crap out of me as well. Unless I'm out of position and the net is empty, there is absolutely no reason for a defenseman to try to get the stick with his puck. If they don't tip it in themselves, they usually deflect it to the opposite side of my position on the original shot, where then another opposing player can just plink it in the open net.

Is it similar shape to the Rebellion 3-D blade? "When skating forward, you use mainly the center blade, surface sharpened for heightened speed. This center blade is about three times the width of a conventional blade. Designed to glide on ice, instead of digging in like a conventional blade, it offers less friction for faster less laborious skating. When turning, the radius-sharpened side blade takes over ensuring the entire blade grips the ice surface without gouging."

Nothing worse as a goalie during pick up is for the players to stop playing "hockey". I love it when I'm screened. On the other hand when everybody moves out of the way and lets the shooter waltz in another 20 feet closer (because he now has a clearer shooting lane), that's BS.

Are you kidding, he's loving hockey so much he's spending his whole paycheck in my store. Plenty of opportunity to get rid of him later! :D

As a beginner the same applies to the FBV's as does regular hollows, too much bite is not good. So start with a FBV like 80/50 or 90/50. My daughter's boyfriend just started skating and this worked well for him. At the beginner level, speed is not so important as is control, but the FBV can help in fatigue as most beginners just don't have their "wind" yet.

One of my customers, a Ivy League professor, did timing tests. He had been doing these same tests for long time with his old setup. His results with FBV and some other changes, were remarkable. He said he was never able to achieve the times he got. He even said he was now within split seconds of what NHL'rs were achieving.

Yes, it's called the offset cut. IMO, offsets do not provide any additional grip than a regular deep cut, and a regular cut doesn't prevent slide if you adapted correctly to it.

Goalies who like deep cuts will like the 100/75. Goalies can certainly use all the different FBVs, just find one that has the grip they like and they'll be happy. indacrease, the dual cuts have pretty much gone the wayside as most bfly goalies now want a lot of bite along the whole blade. have your son try 1/2" on the entire blade, you may see he likes that better. of course the 100/75 as well.

80/50

haha :lol: I hadn't thought about that. Only difference is our sand comes from our boots, yours come from your thongs or speedos!

The price of the spinners really has to be figured in, in addition to machine costs which is about 25% higher than a regular machine. You have to get 5 spinners at $85 ea ($425 total plus shipping) to offer the current 5 different FBV's. This is vs 1 diamond at $20 total which can do any hollow. In addition, going back and forth between 100/75 and 90/50, etc, really burns thru the wheels, twice as fast as a conventional dressing. Changing the spinners also takes about twice as long as a regular dressing. So while the mechanical sharpening process may be the same, time and operating costs are more so a premium price is certainly warranted. Other intangibles like having to take 10 minutes to explain and answer questions what a FBV is to interested customers also have to be considered. As for how long a sharpening lasts, I've found that earlier in the year the longevity of the edges was excellent, even longer than a regular. However as the winter came and rink floors were filled with rocks, dirt and sand (from road sanding brought in on shoes), the longevity of the FBV decreased. Those in the south and west who don't have a snow season, don't have to worry. Those of us in snow areas with rinks that do not clean their floors, will find reduced life of edges. I was playing at a rink that had been open for 4 hrs and the locker room had so much crap on the floor I could hear my skates crunching on it. Even worse after I tied my skates, I could feel the crap on the bottom of my sock. Really that bad. You can always wear the hard rubber guards until you step on the ice to prevent damage, but in reality who's going to do that.

There is a couple of reasons why a shop may charge more. FBVs have a performance edge over a regular sharpening. We pay more for OPS because we feel they give more performance, so same should apply for a FBV. In addition, it simply costs more to do FBV's. The initial machine costs are more, the diamonds cost more, and it may take a little longer to sharpen with FBV. Also, stones wear quickly going from 100/75 to 90/50 to 90/75 and back and forth. So, a little extra price for a performance sharpening is not unreasonable. I only charge $1 more. I don't think that is too much, and customers don't seem to mind paying it. No one else near me is doing FBVs, so I prob could charge more, but don't think that's right. At $1 more I'll recoup my costs, that's all I need. I don't think customers would pay double. Some gear whores maybe, but not most. But then again, people in NYC pay $20 for a regular.

Actually zoning issues are more of a problem for home based businesses than you would imagine. It's very hard to run a home based business, any home based business, where customers come to the location. Trust me, I've done it, or tried to do it. In most cases you are limited to just a few per day, or restricted. Most towns cities frown on lots of traffic in a residential neighborhood. Your neighbors wont like it either. Sole proprietors still need to be registered with the state, and need a Federal Tax ID. And income is income,you must report it, regardless if you are small scale. Taking money from friends to sharpen skates does make you a business. If you want to do it from home, just do it right. Look up the requirements, then follow them. Simple as that. I was naive many years ago and not up to speed on the rules. Sure making some $$ on the side is cool, until someone you are stealing business from finds out you are doing it under the table. You don't want to deal with that hassle.

I went with X02 just thinking that I would have more and more people wanting the FBV, and thus I would prefer the heavier duty of the 2 portables. I wasn't worried about breakeven or profitability. I do not charge people to try out the FBV, but if they like it, I'll charge $3-5 to sharpen depending on how much I like them. I knew how to sharpen skates, and since moving here I haven't been able to find a place I trust to do a good job. So I wanted to just do them myself for my family of 4 and some of the kids I coach. If sharpening other people's skates makes me enough money to pay for wheels and spinners, then it's all good. My experience so far, if you can do a good job sharpening, word spreads fast. Make sure if you are charging people that you have the proper city, state and federal business licenses, and report your profits to the IRS and your state. If you charge, you are no longer a home sharpener, you are a business. You don't want to get caught doing it under the table or without licenses. As soon as your LHS finds out you are, they'll drop a dime to the IRS, etc. You definitely don't want that.

I've only had a total of 3 people of about 800 who tried it who switched back. Two said the 100/75 wasn't sharp enough, one said he just liked his old hollow better, but didn't dislike the FBV. So, 3 of about 800 is pretty good results. I think once you find the FBV setting that feels best for you, you'll be happy. If you're looking for someone who might say, the FBV sucks, I just don't think that's going to happen. :-) it's just too good.

If you can bend over and tie your skates without any problems, you are NOT old! Perhaps the FBV will extend your career another 10-20yrs. :-)

my understanding is that 100/75 from the bite angle alone is closer to 3/8 - not 1/2 just check yourself @ http://www.flatbottomv.com/technical_data.pdf Yeah, according to the FBV chart: 100/75 fbv = 3/8" roh 100/50 fbv = 5/8" roh 90/75 fbv = 3/4" roh 90/50 fbv = 1 1/8" roh Just to clarify... it's Bob that calls the 100/75 a 1/2", not me. IMO a 7/16" would be more along the lines of a 100/60 or so. To clarify this AGAIN, when I first spoke to Steve at Blackstone, he specifically told me that the 100/75 had grip in the 3/8-1/2" range. As such, we called it the FBV 1/2. On our website we fully describe it as having bite in the 3/8-1/2" range, so there is no confusion to those who order this setting from us. Keep in mind that 99.9% of hockey players do not visit MSH, so they have no clue what a 100/75 means. For shops describing the FBV we have to make it easy to understand for the non gear-whores. Most players don't even understand what a regular hollow is never mind a FBV. We've found that most skaters who use regular hollows 1/2 or deeper find the 100/75 adequate for grip. That's what's important.

What I've found is those who thought the 100/75 had too much bite, and the 90/75 not enough bite, they liked the 100/50. So far so good, it's filling the spot.

You'll need the xo2 to do the FBV. I think mini-spinners are $65 in addition to cost of machine. Use a 100/75 for your son to start.

Curious if anyone has found the 100/75 does not have enough bite? particularly on push offs. Also a funny story about the FBV, last night one of my teamates, a holdout who finally agreed to try it after hearing all the other guys raving about it, finally got to skate on the FBV for the first time. Only problem was, last night we played a team full of ringers, ex-college and AHL players. Poor guy looked so slow out there it was pitiful.