smu

Thanks for responding, but it is unfortunate that I only used my iPhone for photos. If I ever knew I would be posting to this forum, which is a shocker to me, I would have used my full size Canon and flash. I know I had to reduce the size of most photos so that I did not have a complaint of being too large. But now the skates have gone back. If it was only to do over again it would have been done differently. I just wanted to take some photos just to show how far off these skates were in size mostly and the toe stuffing issue. I saw no remarks about the holders and questioned why and now I realize that only the inside rivets can be seen clearly. For those that know that the inside rivets will show how the holders are centered these photos should be good enough. It is another more visible story to see skates from the outside bottom where the holders can be so far over as to have the holders at the very edge of the skate's out-sole. The holders should be centered by all the information that I have researched over the past ten years or so and I will explain in my second last paragraph, below. I have to say maybe there are variance at times, placed medially for pronators and closer the the inside edge or for supinators they are placed laterally close to the outside of the skate or outsole, closer to that lateral side, as we are talking here. In my research shows that normally a line is drawn from the center point in the heel pocket to the center of the big toe and the one next to it. This is usually where the skater's center of balance should be and where the blade and holders is best placed. This is then where the holder should be placed and riveted for most 'normal skaters". Someone please correct me if I am wrong and I am sure you will. Unfortunately, it does always come off the assembly line that way and if they do come of perfectly they unfortunately may be proper or correct for the many pronators and supinators that make up more skaters then people think. They are then over or under corrected! Here is where the Superfeet come and very well I might add. They have some arch support and heel-posting or heel correction in the medial side and on the bottom of the Superfeet. You will see that one side is higher than the other. This is to try and force the heel to stand straighter reducing pronation. For the mild over pronators and does them well. I don't think ones are made for the over supinators, but I could be wrong. I never had the needed to look these up! Thanks again!

I was just pleased that you answered I did not expect that you are a holder expert! I tried to add 3 enlarged photos to my uploads of yesterday I think just showing what how the rivets inside the skate can tell a lot about where the holder is placed outside the skate. Cheers - SMU

Maybe I can at least pass on the inside of both True Skates along with just the one photo I have of my Bauer skates showing the perfect insertion of rivets in the Bauer's and the off-set to the outside of the rivets with the True's. There is far less room on the outsole of the True Skates and so much so my holders were at the edge where it drops off leaving no more room. If the photos did not get posted here try looking through my other photos and these will be an easy find. I enlarged these photos in case they are in that other package. I could give some photos of the bottom, but I have to take so much black out and reduce contrast and raise other hings in the "touch-up" they do not come out very well. Thanks - SMU

I understand you cannot see the holder issue. The photos are too dark, maybe I can adjust some settings and get a couple of pics up. Had I known I was going to put these photos on the forum I would have done a far better job on everything and I did not think I had to defend myself as the LHS will confirm what I say.. The troublesome back two copper rivets can easily be seen inside, if you can find the correct skate. Because the holders were misaligned the blades bowed and was first spotted by my LHS when the skates first arrived at his shop. I did say I had two issues 1) Too big and all agree 2) Problem with holders. Where nobody agrees except when you see the coopers inside one. I will see if I can make adjustments to my photos to show the off-set problem. Thanks

This was similar to my size 5 Bauer, perhaps not quite that much, but very close.

Just trying to help Snipe! With what I see in your skate holders differs a lot from those retailer's "stock photos" that of course are going to show you perfect holders. So be it!

Vett88 if you are talking about Sniper9, I was trying to help, earlier because I saw where True put my holders on and it was wrong. I saw that Sniper 9's holders were both on the lateral side of his boots as well like mine and since Sniper9 is a pronator he might want to look at that. The post was lost when my photos were uploaded somehow. My discussion with Sniper9 was that his holders may not be placed in the normal spot and I told him how it was done, but I told him to look into it. He seems to have forgotten that I was trying to help him and has turned me off! The resolution of his photo is so good you can enlarge it to quite an extent and when I did I see that both holders are riveted as far over to the lateral side as they could possible go. My skates from True were the same way, laterally placed on the skate the same way as Sniper9. If I was a supinator they might work better, but not for a pronator as Sniper9 is. I suggested that he look into this especially since he is a pronator! If they were riveted medially he may be better off, but somehow with me trying to help he turned sour and said something about my holders and wanted no help from me, perhaps you could try and look at his problem again and zoom in on his holders you will see the issue. maybe there is something wrong at True?. What I mentioned is that the normal anchor spot for holders is the midpoint heel area and a line from there directly up to between the big toe and the next toe. This would be the other point for a line between the two to be drawn and where the holder is generally placed unless you have perhaps pronation problem, in this case good for an over pronator. I suggested he do some research on this since it has been awhile since I have looked into it and I could be wrong. Apparently he has now looked at my skates that I finally got posted, but they do not have high enough high resolution to see them up close and see that both of my holders are on the far lateral side as well. It would be easy to see on my holders if the definition was better. I was speaking to the LHS today and I said I was calling True tomorrow to discuss all the issues that are with the skates I received and try and get an understanding of what went wrong. Also Why do I see two pairs of skates and both recent with the holders riveted on the far lateral side? Hopefully get Rob to see if there is any reason to see why their skates have the holders so laterally placed as I don't want my new ones there plus talk about the other issues and see just what they do with pronation now, it seem s like less and less. Now with my holders in evidence the resolution is not good enough to see that my holders are placed in the same lateral area as Sniper9's but if you can now all understand that mine are out of wack and it is just not me I would be appreciative. They can view where the alignment from the coppers on one skate at least put the holder way off and the other holder just because the copper look almost normal are misaligned as well. Just like Sniper9's Holders! Thanks, Cheers - SMU

You just had post of your skates and I replied that they maybe your mounts are mounted on the far outside. As I was finishing my photos were taken in and I don't see our post anymore? Do you know what happend?

Thanks JR

Did you get my message about you holders?

Sniper9, I am back trying to eat lunch between many other things beside MSH, but I have to ask these questions as soon as you posted your pictures and good fast work I might add 🙂 . Do you Supinate or pronate in any way?

I heard under 100, but goalies ratio wise use them more, but this should be checked.

I am leaving for an appointment now, almost late. I was really waiting for JR to get back to me, but when I get back I will follow your instructions and if I need help at all I will post again or PM you! Thanks and Cheers

JR, I immediately expressed my apologies in the initial email and then I had to do it again for Snipper9, who steps in and takes offense to the way I treated you when it was none of his business! I knew this but apologized anyway and now I get it again! My apologies are clearly posted! What else can I do except this again, I apologize for any derogatory statements I made and do regret not rewriting that whole first email, if so we would not be here now talking about who did what! Lets get back to business. With regard to the upload process, no matter what you think of my computer capabilities, there was only the regular rectangular box "insert other media" at the bottom right corner in the box given me previously and no "Click to choose files" with a paper clip beside it. That would be very obvious to me and not just missed. It is not there in today's box either, if you meant to have it here. If I open this box (insert other media) it says two things; 1) Insert from URL and 2) Insert existing attachment, nothing like what you have suggested "Click to choose files" with a paper clip. Without knowing, perhaps it was number 2 above, but I was looking for exactly what you quoted. Thank for the help and I will be out later this morning if I can get that upload box of yours I will certainly try it as it would seem easy and if that does not work I will get back to Imgur. Cheers

I thought I could just upload them that's all, I was not set up with any programs to upload to the net as I never needed them any where else, so I thought. Yes, I jumped the gun, but can't you see I apologized for my rash behavior and said I was sorry. I am getting p...d off with this whole thing a lot more than anyone else. My LHS guy was his day off today so I got nowhere there. So, instead of erasing my reply and starting over I just thought I would make it known that I was hasty in my actions, I am only human and too tired to type anymore, as you know I have typed enough and getting very tired with the whole thing. I asked JR to give me the opportunity to post as he suggests, but it was not available to me at that point for some reason. I now have them on Imgur, but there has been no response from JR that would make it easier, I would have thought he would get back to me sooner. Its 1am, where I am now, so I am not looking to get the photos on the forum until JR gets back to me or I get time in the morning to see if can get Imgur to do it for me. This has sucked the life out of me, that's why yesterday I said let's close this down. I suppose you may think I have no photos, but they will be there as you know Vet88 has seen them. Cheers

I had a pm from a member and this has made him think twice and wanted my photos and who the LHS was, I said that True can make a great skate, but sometimes mistakes are made and fixed quickly, but like my issue if I am sitting wondering what is going on I can see why some would be reluctant to go with True, but I hope I allayed his fears and I said that’s mine must have been one of those few mistake and will be fixed soon. I also did not say where the LHS came from except not from his area and go for it!

"I really don't understand why" your attitude is so demeaning, next time think first! I don't have the experience with some apps as I see you must have. And, I have not bothered to post any photos unless it was easy! I now have spent plenty of time trying to get them on Imgur and have it done, just have to figure out how to get them to the members. I have been playing with this program for sometime and like anything new has a learning curve and for those of us that don't catch on that quickly, it takes a little longer and a little more thought! "I really don't understand"! Give me a break, I wanted to stop this insensitive thread or post yesterday, but still was being asked questions. This all will get fixed as I know now, but I do want to know what the heck went wrong. Anyway, thanks for the opportunity to lay them out here directly, I thank you for that, but I take it I have to make another post or am I still a little touched! With the photos they are not all marked, but take a good look at the rivets and see that they have been all put in more laterally than centered all the way around on the outsole and you can see inside as well and you can clearly see the really large off-set of the coppers in one, the other is much less. It was rather hard to show that they were misaligned all the way around, but this is the best I have. My LHS has the direct knowledge of everything I have said and seen. Don't forget to view the toe stuffing and masking tape. I can explain any photo that needs to be questioned. That is one thing that took sometime with Imgur I believe I was adding a description of everything. You may find doubles here, I was just trying to hurry. I apologize now for my back lash - 🙂 Oh again I do not see those instructions to upload to I just make another post or what? Cheers

I was going to try and shut down any more of my complaining, but you might have a point on the toe additions except that the skates still would have been far too large for me. Also, they did a lousy job of attaching the foam. They used masking tape to hold them in place which was a bit ridiculous! They may say it was not masking tape, but if not it was just a "horse of a different color" and I should have kept a piece, but I do have the photos. I now understand your thoughts on the holders and photos. One of our members has seen them, if you want to PM me I would be happy to send some along. I will try using Imgur (that I have not used before) to get them posted this afternoon and I will be calling my LHS as well. If anyone wants photos please PM me in case I have trouble with time or posting! I am playing in my lucky 13th game this morning and for the most part I have enjoyed little of those games. I am now using another pair of size 5D Bauer skates model s180, similar to my older Bauer x60s where I had the holders shifted medially, but did not really work well and are now unusable. I am using my 1º wedges (as seen in photos already posted by a member) to act as medial posting. It seems I need 3 of these in each skate (experimenting in every game) to just be able to play, not well, but not suffering enough that I stop playing, but certainly no joy! Thanks

A second scan was done, but no third? If True was told that these skates were way to big for me and they agreed they still have to be working off either one of the prior two scans! What else could it be? This does seem strange, I got to ask someone!

We have the Sale of Goods Act and the common law that states "the product must be fit for the purpose intended" both would apply, but this is not worth it. I need a good pair of skates that will look after my pronation, that's all I want! Thanks very much though! 🙂

Definitely will, no doubt it, just hoping it will be “my skate”!

Perfect, but I don't want to add anything more as it just come back at me! 🙂 Cheers - SMU

Thanks Leif, I am sooooo sorry now for re-posting the same story, but was it 12 times, I don't think so, perhaps 3X but I could be wrong. I do say that I want to shut this whole thing down in an earlier post today and wished I never had brought it up in the first place. Everyone is talking about the size issue, but why are the holders riveted on wrong and then asked True to look into that and the size and all I get back is stuffed toes! They did not even look at the holder issue even though they were alerted to it as well? Where is the quality control here with the first pair? Then they can't be bothered to fix that issue when they went back with instructions? I don't think one member (If I am wrong my apologies) picked up on this issue at all and that surprises me. Maybe they did not read my complaint story and I need to put it out there again! 🙂 No answer required, but I will post a few photos as one member told me how to do it and asked me to post, then I need to let this go.......away!

Not rude at all! Thanks very much, I asked about how to get the photos up before. It may not be until tonight that I can get a chance. I wonder though that if I do post again it will only tic people off, which it seems that's what I have done so far.

Same issue here, 2 separate issues with bulging discs and the second in 2013 after my CT scan showed one bulging disc In the L1-S5 sending pain down the sciatia neve and priformis muscle to spasm badly. I also had 2 vertebra sliding forward (Spondylolisthesis) 4 mm and another 6 mm! I thought this was terrible and I was done playing hockey, but the specialist said that my condition was nothing to some people and surgery was not in the cards at all. He said if I could play hockey do it as long as I could stand it. I went back to hockey and it did not hurt at all except after, my lower back was sore and the sciatica was always present (to this day) but not while playing hockey as I have been fine so I would suggest get back on the ice and try! I had a friend that was a great hockey player and he had the same problem but it hurt him to skate so we are all different. good luck!