smcgreg

Not sure if I should be offended you replied to everybody but me.... Care to point us to these? Honestly, you can get anything published .... somewhere.

Hmmm... interesting. I haven't skated on inlines enough to think about something like this. I honestly hate inline, but was doing it during shutdown to give my kid somebody to play with. I am using softer wheels, though. I was comparing it more to ice with regard to the feel. To your point about more "grip". I'm just going by what has been discussed on this thread rather than BT's documentation, but my impression was it was simply for spring effect to putatively increase linear speed. On the other hand, if what you propose were the case (e.g. increased grip in turns, allowing for a shallower hollow), this could result in greater speed without complicated stride mechanic interactions. So, that would be interesting. I skate on 3/4 and if I could go to 1", that would be awesome.

I'm curious about this too. If we look at the mechanics of running, we know that increased spring stiffness can increase running performance (but possibly increase injury risk). But skating isn't running. If you have trained skating mechanics, then I can see this spring energy return mechanism possibly helping, but after skating for a while, wouldn't the body adapt to the new mechanical dyanamics and minimize the benefit? Alternatively, the point I think you're getting at is the fact that just because the spring is loaded and releases, doesn't mean the timing of the release can contribute to increased speed. Mechanics would need to be "tuned" to this effect presumably. Further, I can see how mistiming of the spring release could be detrimental and contribute to decreased efficiencies. Somebody earlier compared them to spungs for ice. When I skate on my sprungs, I feel like I'm skating in mud. I guess I'm a bit skeptical? If there is data though, by all means, let's take a look!!! 🙂

I'm going to concur with SWPNW (that's still a mouthful) here. At that age, stiffness can actually be detrimental as it can remove some "feel for the ice" and really won't make much difference from an accelerattion/power standpoint. Both my kids skated in Makos (my 15 yo son still does) and whether it was M7/M8/MII or original, it really didn't mattter, but they are both very good skaters although have totally different styles. I see other kids in stiff top of the line boots as SQ/PW and even Bantams, and have very poor mechanics, because they are just "punching the ice". All that being said, does anybody really know what difference in stiffness between these boots is going to be? They're not even out in mass yet. In the end, as long as they all wrap and give good fit, that's the important thing. At 77 lbs, differences in stiffness from a performance standpoint will be inconsequential. So, I wouldn't sweat that issue too much, just make sure he tries them baked and gets a good wrap and good fit. The other issue would be this, by spending less, you're less concerned about getting a bit of growth out of them, so, two pairs in one season, but with the best fit, would be better than one more expensive pair with "room to grow" to get more time out of them. Of course, it's an opinion, so, take it for what it's worth.

Why would somebody need to read the whole thread with a nice synopsis like that 😉 Well done!

Not to be argumentative, but I've been in Makos since they came out. I went from Supreme 7/7.5 to 6.5 in Mako. So, I don't think it's generaizable that you should move up in size in Makos. Maybe in CCM, I don't know about them though. Just wanted to make sure the OP didn't think he should just move up a size without investigating further. Sorry if I confuse the issue though. As far as the width goes, my feet are like sausages in my D widths, but because they're so moldable, they're still comfy. If I put on a Supreme D width, I'm friggin miserable. The width is very forgiving in the Makos.

Hey Kris, I guess sarcasm doesn't come through in this medium. I was just poking fun at the situation since I essentially got raked over the coals for a post with a similar sentiment. that being said, in all seriousness, the sentence in bold hits home. At this point, it's not even just about development, my kid is kind of depressed right now. He's never had this much time with no ice and it's really getting to him. Skating, just skating, let alone the other stuff is his release and he doesn't have that right now. With regard to your second paragraph, you don't have to justify your position to me. My motives have never been about getting my kid to the NHL, just about giving him the best opportunities to pursue something that makes him happy as far as that takes him (actually both kids, but my son is more passionate about hockey than my daughter, but she's AAA too). I would probably do it if he was a house player. So, you're preaching to the choir. That being said, we intentionally avoided AAA at that age to keep ti fun as long as possible without the stresses that come along with SOME AAAs. That is certainly a personal decision though and if he's made AAA at that age and is having fun, then roll with it (sorry you have to deal with the politics though 😉 My daughter forced us into it by making us go that route now for 12U. Now to your question.... that's a tricky one. At that age, I think good synthetic can be ok. My kids both spent a fair bit of time on it at that age (not ours, sorry, there are limits to my funds) and the time probably helped their development. That being said, if it's about doing things at home, I honestly think inlines would be better. Here are a couple thoughts as to why... 1) My main objective is always about keeping it fun, especially at that age. Being outside in the off season, messing around with friends (or Dad) while playing hockey has a higher fun coefficient than being in the basement on fake ice. 2) Although I commented on keeping the hcokey specific skills as sharp as possible, again at 10, it's a slightly different story to me. There are a lot of really really good hockey players who played roller growing up. In fact, one of my good friends just rollerskated until he was a freshman in high school where he tried out for his high school ice team and ended up going to ice and ultimately AAA and juniors/college. Roller players always seem to have fantastic hands (he does) and it teaches different skating skills than ice (e.g. mohawks and continued movement as oppposed to stops/starts). There are lots of observations that are just that, observations, not hard data. Anyway, at 10, I think developing more diverse abilities is still important. The "bad habits" that come from roller are actually broader development skills which contribute to greater tools to call on later when on ice. 3) Getting back to 1) putting in 2 hr in the driveway with friends will develop skills (hands and skating) more than 30 - 60 min doing more specific things in the basement. To USA Hockey's ADM point, the former would be akin spending hours on the pond, which kids don't do any more. It would develop vision, creativity etc etc etc...... Anyway, if I had unlimited funds, I'd probably do both. If I'm debating between synthetic in the basement and good inlines for the driveway, I'd probably go with inlines to keep it fun and develop more things than just very specific skating/on-ice skills. That's my $0.02, I guess. Good luck and enjoy the journey.

His kids' 10 and nobody's going to hammer him about worrying too much about skating in the off season? Sheesh....

Yikes, 2-3 hr per day on inlines? yuck. Sorry, I'm spoiled by ice. That's a lot, but thanks for the info. I just rotated my daughter's as she had been skating everyday for about 30 min the past couple weeks. There is quite a bit of asymmetrical wear, so, these guidelines on how to exactly rotate are very helpful. Thanks,

Well, good for you. Not sure why you're saying what I said is crap, though. I don't think I said my kid only did hockey, because he doesn't. Like I said, he plays lacrosse and is generally active. Runs, plays a variety of sports and in the warm weather rides a bike quite a bit. Does strength training in various phases of the year. He loves to do everything, but loves to skate/play hockey most of all. In years past, we made a point of making him do other things to develop/maintain general athleticism. I think if you asked the USAH ADM people, they would agree with the notion that specialization occurs at some point and that there is no doubt 15U is a critical age. In fact, the 15 camp (the main pipeline to the NTDP selection camp at 16U) would be in July if it wasn't cancelled this year. Every JR/college scout in the country is there. How do you propose to impress that crowd in July if you don't skate in the spring/summer? The top 200 players in the country at 15U are there, good luck. I agree, you probably focused too much on hockey during your prime developmental years (12-14). That being said, you are a case = 1 and who knows what happened that summer or what happened to your competition. We don't know if you actually got faster or if it's all in your head. It's anecdotal. If all you did is hockey for 4 years, then went away and did some other dynamic sports AND got a testosterone spurt, I can imagine you were better, faster. That being said, you played HS and the difference between 15, then 16, then 17 yr olds in HS is pretty much night and day for each year. It's pretty typical actually to see a freshman struggle, then come back the next year and be a solid contributor and the next year be a dominant player. Anyway, my point was, at 15U, if your objective is to play juniors and college, it is the most critical year in your pre-junior hockey life. Does it mean things are over if 15U doesn't go well? No, but it narrows the choices/opportunities substantially. The spring/summer of 15U, most top players are doing a lot of high level tournaments/showcases. Kids that aren't skating aren't ready for these tournaments/showcases. In conclusion, I think you misconstrued what I wrote. That being said, your situation is just that, one situation and difficult to draw concrete conclusions one way or the other. I would also add, I don't think it's necessary to comment in an unsolicited fashion by saying what I wrote is crap based on your personal experience. Let's be more collegial than that. I edited my initial response to do so. Thanks.

So, weekly, how often were you skating?

No problem. Like I say, these things are issues I deal with day in and day out and am happy to debate them ad nauseum. That being said, the original question was focused and intentionally didn't go into the background for a reason. On a thread where we're discussing optimal player development I'm happy to go toe to toe with pretty much anybody and happy to do it. On a tech thread though, no so much. RE: your 9 yr old, enjoy it while it lasts. I miss those days already. My daughter is only 12, but the squirt days are worth their weight in gold.

As I think I wrote above, he runs, rides a bike and does strength. The strength is somewhat limited, but provided by the best hockey strength coach in the business. He loves to be generally active, that's not a problem. If he's not active he's miserable. He really misses skating though.

New to roller/inline due to pandemic. I've skated about 10 times myself and have noticed the inside wearing more than the outside of my wheels. My daughter has been skating pretty much everyday since lockdown and I notice hers worse. Should I be rotating them? Any guidelines as to how often? Thanks

Seriously? ..... Look we can debate about optimal player development until the cows come home. That's pretty much all I talk about most days. I'm not going to go into my background, but it's not like these are things I've never thought about. The point is, my son plays at a reasonably high level. He hasn't been on the ice in about 2 months now. The off season is over no matter what you're perspective. The big unknown is when ice will be available. For some, it already is. The 15Us in Sweden skate as much as they want now. Some billionaire kids are skating on ice several times per week right now. When the ice comes back, it will be a war for 15 year olds to get positions on teams since everything has been thrown up in the air. If you think the best thing to do right now is to cross train, good luck to you. My son wants to skate, because that's his calling card. He's generally fit. He wants to be able to do his old drills (working inside and outside edge, transistions, etc....) His current inlines are not tolerable for more than 30 min and I've done everything I can to make it better. The solution to help him with what he wants is in my original question. If the USHL doesn't play in the fall, that's not that relevant to a 15U. They will play though. They will likely start a bit late. Many teams will fold though due to social distance requirements. So, with a contracted league, it makes it even more important to put on a good show as a 15U. Now..... back to the question. I think I've gotten the info I needed. Thanks.

No worries, I was too combative as well. Cabin fever.

Sorry for the tone, I edited to be a bit more collegial. He's a 15U and in some ways, this is the most critical spring of his hockey future. At 15U, he's getting to the point where he should specialize more. Whether you like it or not, if you're not skating a lot the spring/summer of 15U, you're path is decided for you. USHL combine may still be in July and not sure when tryouts will be rescheduled for. Those who prepare properly will be in a good spot, those who don't, won't. He would love to be doing other things too, like playing lacrosse, but alas, no dice. We do pass/shoot the lacrosse ball some though, but not like playing/practicing. He loves to be doing multiple things, but more to "play" and be competitive than anything else. To continue the "debate", my daughter also skates, skates everyday with her friend, because that's the only way for her to get social interaction with kids now. She puts her skates on and goes when she wants, no pushing from me. My son LOVES to skate. Would skate 24/7 if he could. The Vapors he uses for inline make him absolutely miserable after 30 min. We've tried everything to make them tolerable. I've tried everything to stretch them and make them tolerable. Nothing fits like Makos though. He WANTs to be ready for when he is back on the ice, so, he doesn't miss the opportunities in front of him. Finally, he does run, ride a bike and do strength work (limited by circumstances), but wants to skate as much as he was before, but it's not possible with his current inlines, because they just make him miserable. Like I said, long story I wasn't going to bore people with, but you you wanted to be contrarian (argue). Again, apologies for the first response that was a bit snarky. Hadn't had enough coffee yet.

Long story I won't bore you with. Given my son needs to start spending a significant amount of time on inlines, we want to convert his mako ice skates to roller. The question is, since Makos are getting harder and harder to find, can they be swapped back to ice holders? Mako rivets are already an issue, so, my assumption is that going to an inline holder will make it even worse. So, going back to ice holder after that seems pretty unlikely. Just wondering if anybody had experience going to inline and back to ice holders on the same pair of skates. Thanks,

Ha,... hilarious. I actually contributed to this thread back when you originally posted it. I'd forgotten that I actually read this thread before I did a punch myself. I used the c clamp and spoon to punch out a spot on the back of my OG Mako that irritated my achilles and created a real problem for a while. This worked great for that. That was more a spot punch though, and like your widening rack shows, I'm really trying to make a D boot into a EE. So, this stretching rig look like it will work. As an update, I tried using inserts along the side of the foot after baking the way some other posters suggested and it really didn't do much. He was still having intolerable pain after 30 min. It's been 5 skates and 2 bakes, so, I think I need to try and make them wider with an overnight stretch like your set up with the C-clamps. Thanks

Thanks to all those who replied. I'll do some work and report back. Stay healthy everybody. Steve

Sorry if I'm being thick, but you mean the toilet paper to the oustide of his foot? Then tape to hold it in place? Just want to make sure I understand you correctly. Yeah, I already had him stand up, but maybe not long enough.

So, this is something I would normally hand off to my local shop, but... given the circumstances, no dice. So, my question is, are there any tools people can use at home to punch skates? Here's an explanation for what I'm trying to do 1) My son has flat feet. Has been in Makos for 4 years or so (on ice). Of course, nothing fits like Makos. 2) with the rinks shut down we got inlines to keep skating in the downtime. He's going into 15U, so, a very important year to have your skills. 3) The inlines are vapors, which were fit to his feet by the scanner and an experienced guy in the shop. 4) because of his flat feet, when he skates in them, they widen out in the forefoot and kill him. 5) I used a heat gun first, with not much improvment, then took the wheels off and baked them. Still not much better. He can only go about 45 min (normally could skate 3 hr or more otherwise). Soooo.... you can now see what I'm trying to accomplish. Trying to figure out a way to get the forefoot wider so, he's not so miserable, because who knows how long it will be until we're back on the ice. HOPEFULLY his makos still fit then. Thanks in advance.

Yeah, because lord knows we all want to sort through a thread with a bazillion posts to find something we might not even know about if it weren't posted as a separate thread. Oh well.

2..??? I bought 6 on close out, 2 for my daughter, 2 for my son and 2 for me. I used one of mine. My son grew through 2 of his. I had to buy another pair off of sideline swap, then took my last one. My daughter grew through hers and is one of his now. So, we're all on our last pair. Mine is in really bad shape. Holder feels like it's going to fall off soon. They'll both need a new pair of skates by the end of this season. Oh well, I had a great run of great skates for cheap while my kids were growing up.

Ahh... very good explanation. Intuitively I knew that from my Makos, but wasn't sure how to explain it. It's more relevant for both of us since he took my last pair of backup makos and the holder on mine is about to come off. So, both of us will likely need Trues soon..... ugghhh... should have bought more of those $150 makos on closeout. Thanks,