ktang

I've always thought that it was a speed vs manoeuvrability tradeoff, to a certain extent. Also, I think taller players, and those with a higher centre of gravity, would need a longer radius.

I think you are the one who knows / worked with Sean Skinner (the one who runs that symposium?). If these 2 assumptions are correct, perhaps you could see if his symposium could be run in an arena. The audience could sit in the stands, and miked-up presenters could show their moves on the ice. And people wouldn't be sweating to death.

We're working on them B) With white helmets / tinted visors, white socks, and white jerseys, you would look like a bunch of ghosts. Or Star Wars stormtroopers. :D

Yeah, I have to agree with Coffey's being one of the smoothest-ever skaters, and one of the most mobile. However, I think he needed some space (e.g. rounding the net) to build up his speed; he didn't have the 2- or 3-step acceleration that Bure / Kariya had. I think Niedermayer is the same kind of skater as Coffey.

I've never seen anyone do it better. :) When he was a Black Hawk he did one over the defenseman's back; he was going down the RW boards, the defenseman turned to go with him and bent forward / reached to poke the puck, Savard put the puck between the defenseman's stick and skates to the other side, and then he rolled over the defenseman's back (back-to-back). OK, maybe it wasn't a spin-o-rama, but still...

I see Gaborik as a quick but not super-fast skater who is an offensive threat because of his quickness (his skating strength).

I think Gaborik's centreman (Wes Walz?) is faster than he is.

To me, quickness and agility are more important than speed, but tryouts and all-star skill competitions that I have seen have more speed- and acceleration-based drills.

i agree, fedorov has been my favorite since i first started watching hockey in like 94, i think what makes him so amazing to watch is it looks like he does everything effortlessly, and looks like it goes in slow mo, but hes one of the fastest players in the league, his curls and pull ups around the top of the circles were amazing, and he always did it with the puck on his stick and his head up. I think Fedorov's outright speed and lateral mobility drive the D-men back so that he has the room to then do a curl / escape move.

How could you forget SOPEL? For me, in order to have the flowing hair the player must play without a helmet. With the helmet, it is more like streamers poking out of the bottom of the helmet(e.g. Jagr, Sopel, Ricci).

I haven't seen too much of Hedican. I have read about how fast he is, but not about how he gets to that speed. How would you classify him?

Yup, there hasn't been hockey for so long that I forgot his name! I'm in the Vancouver area, too. About Mario, he has a long, smooth stride when he needs it. He does a good stop along the LW boards, too. About Kovalev, I think he does everything well, depending on what he needs at the time, but he doesn't have a signature skating skill. But I haven't seen too much of him, except for one time when he, as a Ranger, dangled himself into, and then out of, the offensive zone, not passing to anyone. So a few more categories (feel free to add): Best all-around and balance - Kovalev (?) Best flowing hair - Guy Lafleur, when he had that mane, and Ron Duguay. Easiest - Brett Hull, Lemieux Slower, yet managed to carry the puck into the offensive zone - young Pierre Turgeon

Yup, that's him.

Bow-legged, super-fast skaters: Orr, Morrison, Russian winger on the Leafs in the mid-90s

This is related to gopens67's conditioning thread. Towards the end, we started talking about skaters in the NHL, like Niedermayer, Chimera, Kovalev, Fedorov, Bure, Afinogenov, etc. So, which skaters stand out for you? For me, they are: Ugly buzz-saw chop strides, but very fast - Guerin, Koivu, and Kapanen Quick starts, good agility and acceleration, but limited top-end speed - Kariya, St. Louis, Samsonov, Bure (pre knee injuries) Quick starts and acceleration - same as above + Sakic, Forsberg, Naslund Lateral movement forward - Fedorov, Sakic, Crosby, Leetch, Zubov, Zhitnik, Naslund Lateral movement backward - Leetch, #2 on the Canucks (Swedish guy), Lidstrom Long, smooth, "elegant" stride - Niedermayer, Coffey, Zubov, Zhitnik Long, choppy stride - Jovanovski, Nash, Crosby, Gartner Deepest knee bend - Kapanen, Coffey, Niedermayer, Crosby Itty-bitty choppy starts, then long strides (almost too long) - Roenick Best J-hook skidded turns - Nash, Gretzky, Naslund, Jagr Spread legs wide, then glide laterally - Zubov, Zhitnik, Fleury, Makarov, Sullivan, Leetch High top-end speed, but needs 3/4 of the rink to get there - Jovanovski Curls - Jagr, Gretzky, Denis Savard, Forsberg Stops - Yzerman pre-knee operation, Denis Savard, Gretzky, Ovechkin, Forsberg Tight crossover turns - Housley, Bourque, Gretzky, St. Louis Mid-range change-of-pace acceleration - Sakic, Forsberg, Lecavalier, Guerin

Reviewer's Specs Born 1967 in Montreal, lived in Canada all my life. 5'8" tall, 160 lbs. Have also played on the larger surfaces in Switzerland, Germany, and France. Strictly a hacker and minor hockey coach. In terms of consumer behaviour, I am the opposite of an early adapter. Previous skates were Swiss Graf 703s with the suede quarter panels, RMS screws for the blade holder, and Tuuk Custom+ blades. I skate with an above-average knee bend (maybe too much?) and like to use my ankles a lot. I have had these skates for almost 1 year (1 spring season + 1 winter season) at the time of this review. Fit I have skated since I was 3 yrs old, and these were the first skates that I had gotten new (I was 37). The sales rep did a good job trying out different skates for me, and these fit the best. He heat-fitted them with my shins set at a slight forward lean. The ankle pockets are in just the right place for my ankle knobs. These skates have a wider forefoot that fit my foot shape the best. I tried Bauer Vapor XXs and Easton Z-Airs, but they didn't fit as well. There is a pair of lace locking hinges in place of the eyelets closest to the heel. This is useful because I can tighten the lower part of the skate and leave the last 3 eyelets loose. Others might do the opposite. The top eyelet is a little high for me, so I leave it unused or I have the last 3 eyelets loose because I like to use my ankles more. Because of the good choice of skate and the heat fitting I did not experience any break-in pain, even from the first skate. During the past year the boot has become very slightly softer. As it became softer I got a little bit of lace bite after 1 month, but it went away after the boot fully softened up after 3 months to where it is today. I was playing 2 games and running 1 practice per week during this time. 10/10 Blade/Holder The E-RPL holder and perforated blades were pretty good for me. The radius felt larger (10- or 11-foot radius?) than the Tuuk Custom+ blades that I had on my previous skates, and the "flat" of the blade was further forward and had a slightly more forward pitch. The E-RPL holder is also perforated (to reduce weight?), but it is noticeably stiffer than Tuuk Custom+ holders and much stiffer than Pro Lite 3 holders in tight turns. They were properly aligned and mounted on my pair of skates. Holders are riveted. It was easy to remove the blades to clean off surface rust once in a while because the blade attachment bolts are on the outside, just above the blades, at the toe and the heel. I took a lot of pucks and skate cuts off the blade holder over the past year, and it has held up pretty well. I took a lot of pucks off the blades over the past year and they haven't broken. 10/10 Weight/Protection This is an extraordinarily light skate. I don't know if I am going faster, but I feel like I am accelerating better. I have taken some hard shots off the toes and heels with no ill effects. The only shots that hurt were the ones off the tongue and off the outside mid foot. Shots off the inside mid foot don't hurt. The ankle pockets are a solid material on the outside, so whacks on the ankles from goal sticks don't hurt as much. The achilles protector is flexible and very notched, so it doesn't protect as much. The balance between lightness and protection is pretty good for my level of hockey. A thicker tongue would help, but then lightness would be sacrificed. Weight: 10/10 Protection: 7/10 Durability My skates have held up pretty well. At first I was not undoing the lace locks properly, so I bent the hinges accidentally. However, I was able to re-shape them with pliers. Most of the thread holding in the "external skeleton" plastic pieces have worn off, but the glue or epoxy holding in these pieces are still holding the pieces on. I suppose I can re-epoxy them back in place if they eventually fall off. The toe cap is OK. The inside liner is OK. The blade holder is full of skate cuts but is holding up. The blades took a lot of shots and didn't break. The material around the tongues' felt has worn down a bit. The quarter panels have taken a lot of skate kicks and don't show any cut marks. The outsole (woven composite material) has not chipped yet. The brads under the insole seemed to rust prematurely compared to other skates. I have seen other Vector Pros whose top eyelets have ripped off. Mine haven't, probably because I don't use them most of the time and because I lace the last 3 eyelets loosely. I am also only 160 lbs. Overall, I thought these skates were pretty durable considering that they are a light skate. 8/10 Intangibles This is a pretty stiff skate; if you want to use your ankles more you will need to leave the top eyelet undone or lace the last 3 eyelets loosely. Some players don't like the silvery colour / orange highlights. Kids on my son's team like the "Spider-Man" stitching ("Spider-Man 2" was in theatres in 2004). The brads on the sole weren't tacked down properly, so I did this myself. They also seemed to rust more quickly than on other skates, so I coated them. Other than this, the skate seems to have been well-manufactured. I got a free Vector V120C stick as part of CCM's bonus-pack coupon promo in the summer of 2004. CCM's customer service was responsive to my queries about the stick. 8/10 Conclusion Comfortable skate for my foot shape with a lot of features. Very light and very stiff for good responsiveness. Good durability. There have been some complaints about the craftsmanship on these skates, but not as bad as some others. Overall: 9/10

CCM Vector V120C One-Piece Composite The "C" in V120C stands for the "Contoured", slightly more-rounded shaft corners. Personal Stats 37 yrs old, 5'8", 160lbs, left-handed shot. Have played ice hockey since I was about 3 yrs old. Strictly a hacker / recreational player, also a minor hockey coach. Consumer type: complete opposite of the Early Adapter. Previous stick: Easton 85-flex Z-bubble shaft, no grip (the older green woven-covering type), broken at the flare-out point (found at the rink), with wood Easton T-Flex low-lie round-toe mid-curve blades = T-Bubble combination. Also an Easton 85-flex T-Flex shaft with an Ultra-Carbon T-Flex blade. These are my comparisons for this review. Other sticks used in the past: Easton HXP 4095 aluminum shaft combination, Louisville TPS wood, Canadien 6001 wood. Why I got this stick: I got this stick with the summer 2004 coupon from CCM, whereby buying a pair of CCM Vector Pro skates entitled the buyer to a Vector V110 or Vector V120 stick. I opted for the Vector V120C because I felt that the contoured shape would be better for my style of game. CCM did a good job of processing the coupon mail-in, keeping me informed, and delivering the stick. I didn't use the stick at all for 5 months after I got it because I was satisfied with my T-Bubble and T-Flex combinations. As of this writing I have used the stick in 8 playoff and a few more regulation games. Blade I got the "Doan" pattern. Lower, rounded multiple-lie (5?), mid-heel curve, open face, round toe. The blade is quite thin and light, which aids my stickhandling and backhand flips etc. However, the "Texalium" weave that covers that blade frays off easily after it is cut by skate blades; it is almost as if there were not enough fibreglass resin applied. The blade is quite thin (compared to my wood T-Flex and Ultra-Graphite T-Flex blades) and quite stiff. Pattern: 10/10 Construction: 5/10 (unravelling fibres) Shaft/Flex CCM "Regular", equivalent to the Easton 95 according to the MSH flex chart (just looked it up now). The shaft has a grip coating and stickers on it. The coating was good for extra grip while shooting, but hindered my stickhandling a little bit because I am used to sliding my lower hand to the right position. I have leather palms. An unexpected benefit to the grip coating and stickers is that the additional grip helps me a little when I am tying up opposing players' sticks, both in helping me maintain my grip on the stick and in controlling the other stick. After just 2 games most of the grip coating had been worn off the lower corners of the shaft. The shaft has taken a beating (hacking, being hacked, pushing, prying), and has not cracked yet. There is an 18" taper in the shaft, just like on my T-Bubble and T-Flex combinations, that is supposed to lower the kick-point. This stick's shaft is noticeably but not substantially stiffer than my 85-flex T-Bubble and T-Flex shafts'. The contoured, extra-rounded corners does improve my stickhandling because I can roll the shaft easier when I am doing toe-drag and heel-up moves. Shaft: 9/10 Flex: 9/10 Stickhandling/receiving passes The bottom of the blade curves higher than normal at the toe, and that shape in conjunction with the round toe lets me do toe drags and heel-up moves very easily. I had to practice a lot to get myself used to the mid-heel curve (my previous curves were mostly mids), but now I can alternate between the two. Hard passes don't bounce off the blade too much. Stickhandling: 9/10 Receiving passes: 9/10 Shooting My wrist shots were quite good with this stick. The release seemed a little bit crisper; after shooting with this stick for a while I tried the T-Bubble and T-Flex combos again, and it seemed to take a hair longer for the shot to go. Accuracy was about the same, but I'm just a hacker. My backhand shots were OK off the heel and slightly better off the mid-toe, probably because of the blade pattern's mid-heel curve and extra-rounded bottom. Snap shots were harder with the 120C than with the T-Bubble and T-Flex combinations, probably because of the mid-heel curve and the extra stiffness in the blade. The blade also seemed less prone to opening up (blade and shaft stiffness?), so that shots too much off the toe didn't flutter wide-left. The grip coating let me shoot with more relaxed hands while still controlling the stick, which seems to increase my shot speed. My Slap shots were a lot better with the 120C, for a few reasons I think: (i) The stiffer shaft gives a little more spring after I load it up; (ii) There seems to be less torquing of the shaft, so the blade doesn't open up as much if I miss the sweet spot towards the toe; (iii) The blade seems stiffer, so it doesn't open up as much if I miss the sweet spot towards the toe; and (iv) The grip coating lets me shoot with less grip pressure, which helps my shot. I think. Forehand and backhand flip shots were quite easy because of the thin blade and the round toe. Accuracy with all shots is a little better with this stick because of less torquing. Shots: 9/10 Weight and balance The stick has a higher balance point than my T-Bubble and T-Flex combinations, so that helped my stickhandling. The puck feel was a little bit better. This stick is definitely not blade-heavy. This is a pretty light stick, and that in conjunction with the higher balance point helped with my stick checks and with keeping an active stick while forechecking and killing penalties. Weight: 9/10 Balance: 9/10 Durability The shaft has taken some good slashes from big guys, and the blade has been jammed and twisted among skates and the dasher board. So far nothing has broken. However, the fibre weave covering the blade is prone to unravelling after getting the slightest cuts in it. I don't really know what is underneath, foam or graphite, so I don't want to risk having the fibres' completely unraveling. This is more maintenance than I expected. Structure, shaft and blade: 9/10 Blade covering: 1/10 Intangibles Most of the stick looks pretty good, but the painting just at the fuse point (is it a fuse point?) is uneven. However, after 1 game most of the paint there started flaking off. The translucent resin and orange / light blue paint scheme stands out. Not many people are using this stick recreationally in my area (Vancouver, BC, Canada). Most of the one-piece sticks are Easton Synergies or TPS, so my stick stands out a little bit. Hence some extra slashes on it. The stickers' peeling off is a nice touch to me; it makes the stick look older and gives it character, in an ugly sort of way. CCM's customer service was quite responsive in keeping me informed about the delivery of this stick. Intangibles: 7/10 Conclusion This stick handles the puck, passes, and receives passes OK very well. The blade pattern enhances my puck handling. The grip helps with stick checks and shooting. The shaft and blade don't open up during snap- and slap-shots as much. Performance-wise, this is the best stick I have ever used. The blade's fibre covering is the weak point on this stick. Any cuts to the fibre covering needs to be attended to immediately, before the fibres unravel. If you can get enough of these sticks to last a whole season, consider this stick. If you need one stick to last most of a season, beware of the blade's unravelling, unless you are willing to let the blade break and reuse the shaft for a 2-piece combination. Performance: 9/10 Shaft and blade structure durability: 9/10 Blade maintenance requirements: 1/10