Bonds Biographer speaks out

[Jason Harris 31]

Why hasn't Bud Selig suspended Bonds if it is %100 certain he used steroids, as the author claims.

I think part of the reason the public feels Bonds cheated, while Selig hasn't done anything, is information has leaked from the grand jury that parties who were involved have admitted to providing Bonds with steroids (although Bonds stated that he didn't realize the items might be steroids). Since this information is leaked, Selig can't act upon it, although the public is certainly allowed to form their own opinions, as there is no legal binding to opinions.

Under that premise, that we are allowed to form our opinions based on information we've read/heard, I believe Bonds took steroids and I can't understand why. He was a surefire first ballot Hall-of-Famer, one who had to be included in the conversations of greatest player of all time before he likely began taking steroids. Instead, his reputation has been sullied, although it is probably fair to reword it that he has sullied his reputation.

[Fire0nIce228 1]

Interesting read about cheating in the NHL from everyones favorite, Brett Hull..

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writ....nhl/index.html

[Monty22 831]

Always wondered what was up with Ludwig's pads...

[mrusse01 0]

You've gone from debating to raving, probably time to stop now.

Yes I'm the one raving when it was the author here who suggested not only that Barry Bonds is evil, but that anyone who doesn't know for certain that he took steroids/HGH also must believe that we don't need juries.

[Allsmokenopancake 0]

You've gone from debating to raving, probably time to stop now.

Yes I'm the one raving when it was the author here who suggested not only that Barry Bonds is evil, but that anyone who doesn't know for certain that he took steroids/HGH also must believe that we don't need juries.

The quote is

They maintain there's no proof that Bonds used, so how can we condemn him? If we used that mode of thinking in day-to-day life, there'd be no need for juries. You either catch a person in the act of committing a crime or he's innocent.

There is ample evidence that bonds took steroids, he admitted himself when told about the clear that he thought it was flax seed oil, and he never "knowingly" took steroids.

There is more evidence to suggest bonds took steroids than there is to suggest he didn't.

You seemingly don't want to believe the preponderance of evidence, so that's fine, that's your perogative, however, "innocent until proven guilty" is a legal term, that applies only to a court of law. The court of public opinion has no such constraints.

As far as your "he hasn't been found guilty of anything"

There is a case here (in the DC area, rockville to be exact), where a man came here from africa as a teenager, attended an american high school, and community college.

He then raped girls, from as young as 18 months up to 7 years old.

When charged, his lawyer argued that unless the charges were translated into his native language, of which there are only 105,000 people who speak it in the world, he could not fully understand the charges.

The case was dismissed last week when they couldn't find a translator.

Being found guilty in court, or not, does not mean one is not guilty

[mrusse01 0]

I see where you are coming from, but even MLB which is not a court of law and basically comes down to one man's opinion (Bud Selig) has decided not to suspend Bonds (yet) after reviewing the body of evidence against him. Why? Bud Selig could use leaked grand jury testimony if he wanted to as justification to suspend Barry Bonds.

I'm just saying that if MLB thinks the evidence isn't there to suspend Barry Bonds then I don't think the evidence is quite as convincing as some, such as Jeff Pearlman, make it out to be. You start to get on a real slippery slope when you start talking about the court of public opinion and things of that nature as being a more accurate indicator of guilt or innocence than our justice system.

BTW, that is a ridiculous story about the trial in DC, do you have any links to it? EDIT: Found it...that is just retarded, I would hope the appeal will succeed.

[Jason Harris 31]

Selig could certainly use leaked grand jury testimony as justification to suspend Bonds, but he knows the Players Association would immediately jump in and say, "Whoa, Barry Bonds never admitted to knowingly taking any steroids and he never tested positive for them. You have no right to suspend him."

At that point, Selig would have the choice of capitulating or holding firm and waiting for the inevitable arbitration.

Thus, based on Selig dragging his feet on whether he'd be present for Bonds' record breaking homer, I'm confident he believes Bonds cheated but feels he can't pursue this based on the circumstantial nature of the evidence that has leaked.

[Allsmokenopancake 0]

Why? Bud Selig could use leaked grand jury testimony if he wanted to as justification to suspend Barry Bonds.

Actually, he can't use that. Simply because he cannot produce original documents, the court won't release it. So if he suspends bonds based on that, it will be a suspension based on a third hand account of what is allegedly grand jury testimony.

Whats there is not fake, but in terms of usable evidence, it won't hold up in court.

If the records are ever unsealed, and released under the FOIA, then he could use them.

But at the minute, without the proof presented to the Jury, he can't use statements from the testimony for anything apart from getting pissed off that Bonds is 2 HR's away and he can't do a thing about it

[mrusse01 0]

Salming is right...Selig COULD use that testimony if he wanted to, it just probably wouldn't stand up to an independent arbitrator or whomever settles these kinds of disputes that the union brings over suspensions (I don't think it would be an actual court of law).

Which brings us back to the point of is this really conclusive evidence? No, it's not. It's leaked testimony...how do we know if it is really even real testimony? We don't. As you said yourself, it is "a third hand account of what is allegedly grand jury testimony". That's the reason why it is inadmissable as evidence, so sorry to rain on the parade, but it's just not conclusive.

If Selig had any real balls and actually believe Bonds used, then he could suspend him, wait for it to possibly be overturned, it's better than doing nothing in my opinion (if you believe Bonds used).

[Jason Harris 31]

The important question, if one believes he took steroids, is why? Surly or not, he could have retired before 40 as one of the greatest players ever.

From all accounts, he's a workout demon, so he certainly would have been in great shape even without steroids (if one is to assume he took steroids). In all likelihood, he would have retired as the only player in history with 500 homers and 500 steals, 8 Gold Gloves, 3 MVP's (and maybe more, given how locked in he was at the plate in his late 30's). I said it earlier, but that is a player who would have been part of conversations about who's the greatest player of all time.

Instead, he's a pariah, which is a shame since it was within his control.

[mrusse01 0]

hmm...tough to say. If you believe he was on steroids and it really helped him hit the ball, then who knows how many of his HR's turn into long fly outs, who knows how many less walks he draws, runs he scores, AVG. and SLG. take a dip as well. Right now I think based purely on numbers Barry Bonds is the third best hitter in the history of the game behind Babe Ruth (#1) and Ted Williams, and you could argue that a couple of his seasons were the greatest individual seasons of all-time, or at least in the top 2 or 3.

If you take away his admittedly strange burst in performance late in his career and project his 'normal' stats out there he probably lands back in the top 20 or so greatest players of all-time, but that's just a guess. Still probably the best player of our generation though.

Why would he take steroids? I don't have a clue. People say he was jealous of McGwire and Sosa, but that is just conjecture. As an elite athlete I don't think you ever get to a point where you say to yourself "you know what, I'm good enough right now"...so if anything I'd think there would be no reason he or anyone else would take PED other than just to improve your performance, simple as that.

[Flack38 0]

I think its important to note that when he unknowingly took the cream and the clear they weren't banned substances just like andro wasn't when Mark did it... heck I bought andro from GNC that year he and Sammie went on the home run chase.

Bonds without question is the greatest hitter of all time and one of the best baseball players of all time. I don't care if he came up to bat with 20 empty needles in his ass, as long has he does his job to entertain me and is worth the over priced ticket I paid to get into the ball park.

I think its funny that people bitch and moan about his relationship with the media. In a day in age where everyone wants athletes to stop running their mouths and we want celebs off our news cast when there are more important issues to watch... here is Bonds, the best player to play the game about to break the most hallowed record in all of sports telling them media "F off I'm not talking to you." That right the is the exact reason why I want him to break the record. Well that and to shut up the people that are anti-Bonds.

[Chadd 916]

I think its important to note that when he unknowingly took the cream and the clear they weren't banned substances just like andro wasn't when Mark did it... heck I bought andro from GNC that year he and Sammie went on the home run chase.

The clear and the cream are both anabolic steroids, the guy who designed them has admitted it. Anabolic steroids are only legal by prescription and Bonds has never claimed he had a prescription. Any other use/transport/distribution is a federal crime.

As for MLB having a rule against it; they shouldn't have to have a rule saying that you can't violate a federal law.

[sabre09923 0]

Why would he take steroids? I don't have a clue. People say he was jealous of McGwire and Sosa, but that is just conjecture. As an elite athlete I don't think you ever get to a point where you say to yourself "you know what, I'm good enough right now"...so if anything I'd think there would be no reason he or anyone else would take PED other than just to improve your performance, simple as that.

Steroids are not only used to boost performance, but to help recovery. With all the running Barry did in Pittsburgh years, I'd bet that Barry's knees were pretty banged up. Taking steroids probably looked pretty good if his knees were bad -- which they are currently as well. You've also gotta remember that athletes are constantly looking for he next thing to put their performance over the other competitors, and steroids were the answer.

No guy should hit 73 homeruns when he's 37. Plain and simple.

[JR Boucicaut 3793]

He just hit #754.

[mack 44]

People should just IBB him every AB if everyone's so against him getting it.

[forsberg91 0]

Or just plunk him...

[mack 44]

I think if nothing else the Benoit tragedy has taught us not to piss off people on steroids.

[Jason Harris 31]

If you take away his admittedly strange burst in performance late in his career and project his 'normal' stats out there he probably lands back in the top 20 or so greatest players of all-time, but that's just a guess. Still probably the best player of our generation though.

I think if we gave him his "normal' stats, yet allowed for a seemingly improved swing in his late 30's, he'd be a near .300 hitter with 500 homers and 500 steals. No one else has come remotely close to that combination of power and speed. Of the 500 Homer Club, only Willie Mays had over 300 steals (338), while only Bonds' father had over 300 homers (332) among the Top 50 Base Stealers. Add to that 8 Gold Gloves and at least 3 MVP's, while I'm willing to concede at least one more MVP, because his swing was amazing five years ago. (No one else had more than 3 MVP's.)

So now you're talking about a 500 Homer, 500 Steal, 8 Gold Glove, 4 MVP player in an era when athletes are just better than they used to be.

He may have a reputation for being a jerk, but that's easily one of the Top 5 players of all time, possibly Top 3 -- without having to pad his stats.

[Flack38 0]

No guy should hit 73 homeruns when he's 37. Plain and simple.

How about Chris Chelios playing a sport thats exponentially more demanding than baseball at the age of 45?

[sabre09923 0]

No guy should hit 73 homeruns when he's 37. Plain and simple.

How about Chris Chelios playing a sport thats exponentially more demanding than baseball at the age of 45?

Except Cheli is a known workout freak and he isn't exactly putting up historic numbers. He also has been sustaining minor injuries last season and the year before.

[Datsyukiandeek 0]

No guy should hit 73 homeruns when he's 37. Plain and simple.

How about Chris Chelios playing a sport thats exponentially more demanding than baseball at the age of 45?

Except Cheli is a known workout freak and he isn't exactly putting up historic numbers. He also has been sustaining minor injuries last season and the year before.

Not to mention hes playing 3rd pairing minutes and usually saves himself for the post season. Hockey players are just better conditioned. Plenty of players, if they felt the need, could make it to 45. Do you really think Sakic, Jagr or Lidstrom are just gonna turn into fourth line players in the next couple years? I doubt any of those guys will play that long but theres no reason they couldn't.

[mik3 1]

If you take away his admittedly strange burst in performance late in his career and project his 'normal' stats out there he probably lands back in the top 20 or so greatest players of all-time, but that's just a guess. Still probably the best player of our generation though.

I think if we gave him his "normal' stats, yet allowed for a seemingly improved swing in his late 30's, he'd be a near .300 hitter with 500 homers and 500 steals. No one else has come remotely close to that combination of power and speed. Of the 500 Homer Club, only Willie Mays had over 300 steals (338), while only Bonds' father had over 300 homers (332) among the Top 50 Base Stealers. Add to that 8 Gold Gloves and at least 3 MVP's, while I'm willing to concede at least one more MVP, because his swing was amazing five years ago. (No one else had more than 3 MVP's.)

So now you're talking about a 500 Homer, 500 Steal, 8 Gold Glove, 4 MVP player in an era when athletes are just better than they used to be.

He may have a reputation for being a jerk, but that's easily one of the Top 5 players of all time, possibly Top 3 -- without having to pad his stats.

Exactly!

This guy was one of the top players ever even if you subtract about 150-200hr. He was a freak when he was younger. You could make an argument for him as the best defensive LFer ever till he was about 36. Add to that his speed and just ability on the bases and his ability to work counts and it's hard to knock the guy.

[mack 44]

He was always my favourite player in early-90s October when he'd play the Braves.

[trevor13478 1]

it's hard to knock the guy.

actually, it's quite simple. i'll give it a whirl...

He cheated. And now he will get credit for one of baseball's most sacred records which he doesn't deserve.