2008 US Election Thread

[-brady2 0]

I think a percentage of the women in the states voted for clinton because she is a woman. This will help sway votes.

News in general is bogus, and full of crap. Never hear both sides of the story.

Also, I lol'd at thread title

[kosydar 0]

From a McCain standpoint the absolute best thing about it was when he announced it. Completely overshadowed Obama's speech (which I thought was disappointing).

[jimmy 194]

McCain's "strategery" is brilliant. A woman, plus everytime someone says she has no experience, it'll only highlight just how little Obama has.

[mik3 1]

From a McCain standpoint the absolute best thing about it was when he announced it. Completely overshadowed Obama's speech (which I thought was disappointing).

If it being panned on a national level means overshadowing Obama, then yes, it did it's job.

[ponty 0]

Political crap aside I thought, for a second, that McCain selected "Karen" from the show "Will and Grace."

[gxc999 7]

Political crap aside I thought, for a second, that McCain selected "Karen" from the show "Will and Grace."

hahaha, lol. McCain's team took a calculated risk and I don't see it hurting them. At worst, it will break even.

[Jason Harris 31]

McCain's team took a calculated risk and I don't see it hurting them. At worst, it will break even.

After reading comments the past two days from Independents (who are obviously the target audience of this pick), I get the impression that choosing this particular woman will backfire. I realize that quoting two or three Independent women -- including at least one who voted for Hillary -- is lacking as a sample size, but the gist of the Independents' response has been the move borders on insulting, since Palin is lacking so much experience that it seems as though McCain's strategists are saying it won't matter to women.

The Republicans will obviously state Obama doesn't have much more experience than Palin (which, of course, would depend on how much credence one gives to being mayor/governor versus state rep/senator), but I'd counter that there's a big difference between being picked from the audience to play The Price Is Right versus campaigning for two years and convincing 21+ million Americans to vote for you. That might not be enough experience to deserve to be President, but it's certainly enough experience to deserve to be part of the conversation.

[mack 44]

He has experience campaigning and not doing much else. Not saying that puts Palin ahead of him by any means, but there's an infinitesimal amount of experience he has in the big picture.

[DarkStar50 679]

McCain choosing Palin is an example of his decision making abilities that should give the American voters reason to choose him? Palin is one 3 AM phone call away from "Good morning, Ms. President."? WTF?

[DarkStar50 679]

http://slapshot.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/...sal-hockey-mom/

Just some food for thought ..........

[Gummer12 134]

Bristol (daughter) Is Pregnant!!! RIGHT ON!!

[mik3 1]

Bristol (daughter) Is Pregnant!!! RIGHT ON!!

17 years old, unwed, that'll look really good to the southern "morals" voters. But, have no fear, 90% of them still probably wouldn't vote for a black man.

[Jason Harris 31]

He has experience campaigning and not doing much else. Not saying that puts Palin ahead of him by any means, but there's an infinitesimal amount of experience he has in the big picture.

It boils down to what credence each of us is willing to give the varying positions candidates have held.

Assuming the candidate is considered to have been "successful", I give credence to being mayor of NYC, but far less so to being mayor of a town of 7,000, mainly because the issues and demographics are far more diverse. I give credence to being a state legislator, because they are engaging in the political process of introducing and moving bills through two parties and independents; further, I give more credence to a state senator in Illinois than, say, Wyoming. I give credence to being a governor, although I give more credence to the difficulty of being governor of California (which has ranked anywhere between the world's fifth to eighth largest economy) than of Alaska. I might even give some credence to being CEO of a Fortune 100 company, but I don't think those candidates have had to face such unified opposition as the two-party system.

Nonethelss, the point I had been making was even if one were to ignore the eight years Obama spent as a state senator, I believe Obama's experience of galvanizing 21+ million people to vote for his vision has to be appended to his experience, since that is effectively what politics is -- winning people over to your point of view. In contrast, Palin was dropped into this race. Had she tried to run at this time in her career, I think we all can surmise she would have quickly fallen by the wayside due to lack of experience. I'm actually cynical enough to think that it's only the fact that Palin is decent looking at 44 that has caused some to claim this was a "genius pick." I'm quite convinced that McCain would have been lambasted if Palin was a man or looked like Janet Reno.

[JR Boucicaut 3802]

Hahaha I have some stories about Janet Reno...back when I was 17 our outdoor rh rink was by her house in Miami. LOL

[mack 44]

He has experience campaigning and not doing much else. Not saying that puts Palin ahead of him by any means, but there's an infinitesimal amount of experience he has in the big picture.

It boils down to what credence each of us is willing to give the varying positions candidates have held.

Assuming the candidate is considered to have been "successful", I give credence to being mayor of NYC, but far less so to being mayor of a town of 7,000, mainly because the issues and demographics are far more diverse. I give credence to being a state legislator, because they are engaging in the political process of introducing and moving bills through two parties and independents; further, I give more credence to a state senator in Illinois than, say, Wyoming. I give credence to being a governor, although I give more credence to the difficulty of being governor of California (which has ranked anywhere between the world's fifth to eighth largest economy) than of Alaska. I might even give some credence to being CEO of a Fortune 100 company, but I don't think those candidates have had to face such unified opposition as the two-party system.

Nonethelss, the point I had been making was even if one were to ignore the eight years Obama spent as a state senator, I believe Obama's experience of galvanizing 21+ million people to vote for his vision has to be appended to his experience, since that is effectively what politics is -- winning people over to your point of view. In contrast, Palin was dropped into this race. Had she tried to run at this time in her career, I think we all can surmise she would have quickly fallen by the wayside due to lack of experience. I'm actually cynical enough to think that it's only the fact that Palin is decent looking at 44 that has caused some to claim this was a "genius pick." I'm quite convinced that McCain would have been lambasted if Palin was a man or looked like Janet Reno.

It's also boiling down to people, not just you but others I've seen on other boards, defending Obama against Palin. It just seems wrong having to defend one's presidential candidate against the other's VP choice.

[jimmy 194]

He has experience campaigning and not doing much else. Not saying that puts Palin ahead of him by any means, but there's an infinitesimal amount of experience he has in the big picture.

Exactly, what he was in the Senate for 2 yrs before he started campaigning. When you consider all the breaks the Senate gets a year, how many actual days was Obama on the job in WASH. At least as a Governor, you are Governor every day, 24hrs a day solving problems, unlike a Senator. more leadership, more decisions, more responsibility.

[fultonreed 1]

vry good point jimmy - i concur

[Jason Harris 31]

It's also boiling down to people, not just you but others I've seen on other boards, defending Obama against Palin. It just seems wrong having to defend one's presidential candidate against the other's VP choice.

I'd look at it more that it's silly that some have suggested 6 years of mayor in a town of 6,000 in a remote area of our country, plus 1 1/2 years of governor in the fourth least populated state, is equivalent experience to 8 years as state senator from the third most populated city, plus 3 1/2 years of US Senator from the fifth most populated state.

He has experience campaigning and not doing much else. Not saying that puts Palin ahead of him by any means, but there's an infinitesimal amount of experience he has in the big picture.

Exactly, what he was in the Senate for 2 yrs before he started campaigning. When you consider all the breaks the Senate gets a year, how many actual days was Obama on the job in WASH. At least as a Governor, you are Governor every day, 24hrs a day solving problems, unlike a Senator. more leadership, more decisions, more responsibility.

Maybe, but you're making the suggestion that two years of campaigning means less experience, whereas he likely has a far better understanding of the needs of the American public than he had before he started his campaign. I'd call that real world experience and worth quite a bit more than "just" being a Senator.

I'd also say that's true for McCain, Romney, Hillary and everyone else that campaigned, which is why I don't put as much stock into the experience question -- as long as I feel the candidate has enough experience to understand how to massage the process.

I'm more concerned with their stances on issues.

[mack 44]

I don't find it silly to compare it at all. Small town? Yes, but a senator doesn't have the daily responsibilities that a mayor or governor has. If he were either of those positions I'd gladly give him all the experience credit, but the reality he isn't. At least he has put the kibosh on people attacking Palin's pregnant (unwed teenage) daughter by saying families are not to be touched. Then again, this is politics so people will assume they don't want his closet to be picked through by people. I do find it interesting about how much of his donations come from overseas though.

[Jason Harris 31]

I agree that a mayor probably has more day-to-day responsibilities than a Senator, but in smaller towns the position is less political and more management, which is why many small towns don't have mayors, they have city managers.

I imagine a Senator's daily routines are closer to a President's than a mayor's are, although less so than a governor.

[troy 12]

On This Week today one Republican senator said that Palin was better prepared/experienced to lead the country than Obama. And even used the argument that Alaska is closer to Russia as proof of foreign policy experience.

haha yeah, I posted that video on the last page.

I hate how bad cable news coverage has become. There's fox spewing stuff like that, then the idiot Olbermann being just as bad for liberals on msnbc.

From the National Review:

Gov. Sarah Palin as VP?

Before the media dismisses Gov. Palin's remark that she's Commander of the Alaska National Guard as unimportant to national security, they should consider this:

Alaska is the first line of defense in our missile interceptor defense system. The 49th Missile Defense Battalion of the Alaska National Guard is the unit that protects the entire nation from ballistic missile attacks. It’s on permanent active duty, unlike other Guard units.

As governor of Alaska, Palin is briefed on highly classified military issues, homeland security, and counterterrorism. Her exposure to classified material may rival even Biden's.

She's also the commander in chief of the Alaska State Defense Force (ASDF), a federally recognized militia incorporated into Homeland Security's counterterrorism plans.

Palin is privy to military and intelligence secrets that are vital to the entire country's defense. Given Alaska's proximity to Russia, she may have security clearances we don't even know about.

According to the Washington Post, she first met with McCain in February, but nobody ever found out. This is a woman used to keeping secrets.

Clearly, Alaska governors deal a lot more with issues of national security than, say the Governor of Arkansas. There are all sorts of treaty issues, missile defense stuff, bases, etc up there. The military is a very big presence. Also, while I think there are political drawbacks to the fact that Alaska's government lives pretty much entirely off oil revenues, understanding of international energy markets requires a grasp of international affairs as well. /quote]

[mik3 1]

I'd assume even the lowest level of government in Chicago does more than the highest level in Alaska.

[troy 12]

[Monty22 833]

I'd assume even the lowest level of government in Chicago does more than the highest level in Alaska.

You know what they say about assuming...

[kosydar 0]

Bristol (daughter) Is Pregnant!!! RIGHT ON!!

17 years old, unwed, that'll look really good to the southern "morals" voters. But, have no fear, 90% of them still probably wouldn't vote for a black man.

The more I think about it the more I think the teenage daughter being pregnant might be somewhat helpful (albeit very slightly). Palin is very pro life, and seeing that her daughter made the decision to keep her child has to impress many pro lifers. Her daughter is the prime candidate for an abortion (unwed, in high school, plus has the potential to ruin her mom's career, etc), yet she chose to keep it. Teenage pregnancy is a problem that resonates with many American families. This whole thing I think can be spun to make it look like Palin and her family have a lot of "everyday Americanness" in them (for lack of a better word), and that they handle tough situations in a way that they feel is morally superior. Plus the fact that its Palin's family means that there is still a little distance from McCain.