Blackstone Flat-Bottom V Thread

[Ahriman 1]

I wish I could say that myself.

90/75 felt like 1" or more glide and bite so I felt like I was going to lose it every turn.

100/75 felt like 5/8" bite and glide, too much bite and no "floating" super-awesome glide.

Most people I have put into the FBV say the 100/75 has more bite than 1/2", and I would agree. The 90/75 is right around 5/8 or 11/16 in terms of bite.

Yup, mirrors my exact experiences, unfortunately I'm not comfortable skating on either of those, have you heard much about the 100/50? I'm hoping for more of "1/2" bite with more glide" otherwise I'm sticking with a traditional sharpening.

[SolarWind 23]

I wish I could say that myself.

90/75 felt like 1" or more glide and bite so I felt like I was going to lose it every turn.

100/75 felt like 5/8" bite and glide, too much bite and no "floating" super-awesome glide.

Most people I have put into the FBV say the 100/75 has more bite than 1/2", and I would agree. The 90/75 is right around 5/8 or 11/16 in terms of bite.

100/75 is definitely a LOT more bite then 5/8 - I'd say to me it felt in between of 1/2 or 3/8 - more like 3/8

100/50 is more bite then 90/75 for sure, it's somewhere in between of 5/8 & 9/16, more like 9/16

so basically I agree with Chadd :))

[McB 0]

First post and hopefully not way off topic. Really interesting hearing all the comments on the FBV, it has yet to make it to the UK and as a sharpener I have a hard enough time getting skaters to acknowledge the importance of knowing their sharpen and looking after the blades on their skates. As for a goalie cut mentioned above, the most common request i have from net minders is a deep hollow off set from centre, giving a high edge and lots of bite on the inside edge of each skate and an almost edgeless state on the outside. It seems they say they push from the inside and slide on the out................... anyone else come across this? McB B)

[jimmy 194]

Yes, it's called the offset cut. IMO, offsets do not provide any additional grip than a regular deep cut, and a regular cut doesn't prevent slide if you adapted correctly to it.

[lohnman 0]

I sharpen my sons skates with the 90/75, which he prefers. I just got a new set of blades profiled from Noicing and had them put the 100/50 on them just to give it a try before I bought that particular spinner. I didn't tell him it was a different cut, I just wanted to see his response. You don't usually get much if anything from a 12 year old, I expected that he wouldn't have been able to tell the difference. I asked him what he thought of his new blades and he said they were very sharp. So I have to assume that the 100/50 is noticeably sharper than the 90/75.

[Ivan 1]

Did 90/75 for Team Ukraine Coach Alexander Savitskiy

http://www.sokol.kiev.ua/page-id-3026.html

http://www.hockey.org.ua/Komanba/m513.htm

His feedback was "just incredible".

Team Ukraine head coach Dmitri Khristich (frmr. NHL player - Washington, Boston, Toronto, and LA) politely declined. The only reason he declined was his modesty. He had signed some jerseys for my friends in the States and didn't want me to feel obliged to him for doing that for me.

Added 01/31: Savitskiy called me today and said he never skated so fast in his life. He played in the Russian Superleague and for various West European teams (I believe in Sweden too).

Dmitry Khristich http://forecaster.thehockeynews.com/hockey...career.cgi?1077

is on the FBV too now

[Joker518 0]

First time sharpener here with the X01...

How do I know I've dressed the wheel properly? Everything I've read says you only need to gently touch the wheel to the spinner once or twice and you're good to go but is there any indication I'd be able to gather from looking at the wheel? The wheel edge looks the same to me... Is it a very subtle thing?

Also, Do I dress the wheel before every pair I sharpen or is that a waste?

Thanks for your advice in advance!

[Chadd 916]

First time sharpener here with the X01...

How do I know I've dressed the wheel properly? Everything I've read says you only need to gently touch the wheel to the spinner once or twice and you're good to go but is there any indication I'd be able to gather from looking at the wheel? The wheel edge looks the same to me... Is it a very subtle thing?

Also, Do I dress the wheel before every pair I sharpen or is that a waste?

Thanks for your advice in advance!

If you see a puff of dust when the spinner touches the wheel, it is now dressed. You will not be able to see it with a naked eye. You can dress the wheel for every pair, that would simply ensure that each pair is done correctly. The wheel will hold up for quite a while, even if you dress it for every pair.

[Joker518 0]

Awesome, thank you for your help, Chadd.

[bigsnake76 2]

I was skating on 3/4" Im 6'0 205 and I can definitely tell a difference in glide kind of like my boy Billy Glide. It is an extra 2 bucks in STL to get the Flat bottom V, its worth it no doubt about it.

[rootski 0]

Anyone know of any shops in North Bay ON, that have FBV?

[bantamseadogs13 0]

I need to ask a question, guys. My son is loving the FBV, and he also uses the combo radius, 7' x 11'. I just came home from a Bantam AAA tournament in Canada, and all I heard is the rave about the Maximum Edge services. What exactly is the difference between that and FBV? I tried to convince the FBV is the newest and fastest growing concept out there, but basically I was kinda talking out my ass because I don't know exactly what Maximum Edge is other than profiling. Is there a difference in sharpening method, or is it the same as FBV or what? Please help me have a more educated argument for the next trip.

:D

[Chadd 916]

I need to ask a question, guys. My son is loving the FBV, and he also uses the combo radius, 7' x 11'. I just came home from a Bantam AAA tournament in Canada, and all I heard is the rave about the Maximum Edge services. What exactly is the difference between that and FBV? I tried to convince the FBV is the newest and fastest growing concept out there, but basically I was kinda talking out my ass because I don't know exactly what Maximum Edge is other than profiling. Is there a difference in sharpening method, or is it the same as FBV or what? Please help me have a more educated argument for the next trip.

:D

Maximum edge is nothing more than just a procedure to help you put a good edge on a skate. It's essentially a checklist of things to do when you sharpen and will help you do a good job if you follow the steps one by one. It's a good way to train new employees or to correct bad habits of hack sharpeners. However, it doesn't do anything special to your edges or give you an advantage over someone that does a good job by another method. You can use the M-E steps while sharpening skates with an FBV hollow.

[bantamseadogs13 0]

Thanks Chadd. So in your opinion, the profiling I am getting from No Icing is no different than what the guys talking about the M-E would be getting. With the exception that my son is actually geting a better sharpening and more glide with the FBV? The M-E is just getting "started" in the area that I am referring to, and some of these guys have no idea about the profiling I've been geting for 4 years now, and FBV couldn't possibly be anywhere as good as M-E, as they tried to tell me. YET, I heard for the 1st time all season that my son has the most powerful and smoothest stride on the team, taking 2 strides to all the other kids 4 strides and still beating them on speed drills. So maybe I'm not the one talking out my ass, huh? LMAO

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

Thanks Chadd. So in your opinion, the profiling I am getting from No Icing is no different than what the guys talking about the M-E would be getting. With the exception that my son is actually geting a better sharpening and more glide with the FBV? The M-E is just getting "started" in the area that I am referring to, and some of these guys have no idea about the profiling I've been geting for 4 years now, and FBV couldn't possibly be anywhere as good as M-E, as they tried to tell me. YET, I heard for the 1st time all season that my son has the most powerful and smoothest stride on the team, taking 2 strides to all the other kids 4 strides and still beating them on speed drills. So maybe I'm not the one talking out my ass, huh? LMAO

Personally I have been trained on the ME system and I would love to be able to use it in my stores but cant.

If I was an ME dealer I would use both the FBV and the ME system and I think it would be even better than anything out there.

Before FBV the finish and the system used with ME was pretty much the best "PROGRAM" out there IMO.

[bantamseadogs13 0]

Thanks Chadd. So in your opinion, the profiling I am getting from No Icing is no different than what the guys talking about the M-E would be getting. With the exception that my son is actually geting a better sharpening and more glide with the FBV? The M-E is just getting "started" in the area that I am referring to, and some of these guys have no idea about the profiling I've been geting for 4 years now, and FBV couldn't possibly be anywhere as good as M-E, as they tried to tell me. YET, I heard for the 1st time all season that my son has the most powerful and smoothest stride on the team, taking 2 strides to all the other kids 4 strides and still beating them on speed drills. So maybe I'm not the one talking out my ass, huh? LMAO

Personally I have been trained on the ME system and I would love to be able to use it in my stores but cant.

If I was an ME dealer I would use both the FBV and the ME system and I think it would be even better than anything out there.

Before FBV the finish and the system used with ME was pretty much the best "PROGRAM" out there IMO.

How does it differ from the profiling that I get from No Icing? I'm just trying to get educated. Is there a place I can find that explains the difference between ME and what I am using now, which is No Icing combo? My son really has no issues at all with that part, but I am really interested in the difference bewteen the two. Thanks for your information, trainer, I appreciate it. I looked on the ME site itself it is very limited on info.

Edited March 23, 2009 by bantamseadogs13

[forbs02 20]

I got to check out Boston University's set-up with the FBV system this past weekend. It looks pretty slick... I guess all of their guys are loving it.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

Thanks Chadd. So in your opinion, the profiling I am getting from No Icing is no different than what the guys talking about the M-E would be getting. With the exception that my son is actually geting a better sharpening and more glide with the FBV? The M-E is just getting "started" in the area that I am referring to, and some of these guys have no idea about the profiling I've been geting for 4 years now, and FBV couldn't possibly be anywhere as good as M-E, as they tried to tell me. YET, I heard for the 1st time all season that my son has the most powerful and smoothest stride on the team, taking 2 strides to all the other kids 4 strides and still beating them on speed drills. So maybe I'm not the one talking out my ass, huh? LMAO

Personally I have been trained on the ME system and I would love to be able to use it in my stores but cant.

If I was an ME dealer I would use both the FBV and the ME system and I think it would be even better than anything out there.

Before FBV the finish and the system used with ME was pretty much the best "PROGRAM" out there IMO.

How does it differ from the profiling that I get from No Icing? I'm just trying to get educated. Is there a place I can find that explains the difference between ME and what I am using now, which is No Icing combo? My son really has no issues at all with that part, but I am really interested in the difference bewteen the two. Thanks for your information, trainer, I appreciate it. I looked on the ME site itself it is very limited on info.

I cant answer that as I dont know No Icings form of profiling and how they do it!

[Chadd 916]

Thanks Chadd. So in your opinion, the profiling I am getting from No Icing is no different than what the guys talking about the M-E would be getting. With the exception that my son is actually geting a better sharpening and more glide with the FBV? The M-E is just getting "started" in the area that I am referring to, and some of these guys have no idea about the profiling I've been geting for 4 years now, and FBV couldn't possibly be anywhere as good as M-E, as they tried to tell me. YET, I heard for the 1st time all season that my son has the most powerful and smoothest stride on the team, taking 2 strides to all the other kids 4 strides and still beating them on speed drills. So maybe I'm not the one talking out my ass, huh? LMAO

I think M-E is overrated, as I have seen horrendous sharpenings come from a M-E shop. It doesn't mean anything if the guy behind the wheel is careless. If the guy behind the wheel is good and cares about his job, chances are he will produce the same quality edge without going through the M-E procedure step by step. It's the final product that is important, not the process that gets you there. Any process that gets you there every time is fine.

I have no idea what No Icing is doing for you but I have reservations about doing "remote" profiling. In my experience it's an experimental process that requires feedback and multiple changes to ensure you've optimized the profile for you and your skating style. Until you've gone to far one way or the other, you don't know if there is something better out there for you.

[troy 12]

Just wondering if one of the more FBV-knowledgeable guys could post rough conversions of FBV to standard hollows? It'd be much appreciated, thanks.

[SolarWind 23]

Just wondering if one of the more FBV-knowledgeable guys could post rough conversions of FBV to standard hollows? It'd be much appreciated, thanks.

here we go - straight from the horse's mouth (just look at the table & compare bite angles of FBV to a regular circular hollow)

http://www.flatbottomv.com/technical_data.pdf

[Too Old 1]

After three drop-in games (clock runs for 75 minutes) and maybe five 1.5-2 hour public skate sessions with the daughter I found that it seemed I was loosing the edge at times. Running my fingernail down each side of the blades I could just barely pick up a spot at the bottom. So I used a stone similar to the Miraclestone and made about 3 or 4 passes down each side of the blades. Night and day difference; the edge is there again. I'd imagine that it's time to swap out the blades for the spare 100/75 set that I got and send these in for a sharpening.

Edited March 23, 2009 by Too Old

[scorer75 9]

I also noticed a loss of the edge more quickly than with a regular sharpening.

Is this normal?

[Chadd 916]

I also noticed a loss of the edge more quickly than with a regular sharpening.

Is this normal?

Depends on how you skate and how much you let your edges degrade with a traditional sharpening.

[Too Old 1]

The best part is I bought another pair of runners. So, I can just pull them out and send them off to be done again, and have a fresh set to skate on right away. I wonder if the FBV sharpening lends itself to rolling over the edges more than a normal ROH since it's such a distinctly sharp edge? I didn't notice this on the previous 7/16" I was on. But I can live with it seeing how much better the skating is on the FBV.