VH Footwear/TRUE by Scott Van Horne

[AfftonDad 88]

On 9/21/2017 at 9:47 PM, IPv6Freely said:

Beautiful. Great packaging too. Much better than what my VH came in! Haha

I just got mine around a month ago and I didn't get the nice packaging and the bag, etc. Just a brown box. Oh well. The important part came though!

[Zac911 317]

10 hours ago, Nicholas G said:

Wow. They have you bake them for a long time comapred to other skates. 

For example, the Super Tacks and JetSpeed FT1 you only bake for a couple of minutes. I think Bauer is about the same, a few minutes. 

I'm kinda shocked they quote 20 min at 180 degrees! 

I believe it is 12 minutes at 180.

[Jason 65]

I'm also curious to hear if anyone has tried both Tuuk and the Step/VH holders on the True/VH skates. A comparison would be great.

[KUTYRKOKUV 4]

13 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

Don’t use photobucket - it’s garbage. Use imgur.com instead.

Thanks bud, just changed it up. I had no idea! 

[IPv6Freely 2092]

1 hour ago, KUTYRKOKUV said:

Thanks bud, just changed it up. I had no idea! 

I think I’d be contacting them about it. I personally don’t think either of those things is acceptable. Tongues are obviously an easy fix, the bubbling I’m not so sure about.

[Fletch 219]

2 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

I think I’d be contacting them about it. I personally don’t think either of those things is acceptable. Tongues are obviously an easy fix, the bubbling I’m not so sure about.

I’ve got some glue showing (to be expected from something handmade IMO, so no big deal to me) but no bubbling...

Edited September 23, 2017 by Fletch

[Fletch 219]

Spotted a linesman using the skates with the Step holder, looks like he tried to (had to?) black out the outside silver panel.  

[Fletch 219]

6 hours ago, Zac911 said:

I believe it is 12 minutes at 180.

At Ultimate Skate, they heated them for 8 minutes, IIRC... I didn’t notice the instructions until I left the rink, lol.  They were still really hot when I put them on so I don’t think it was a problem.  

[IPv6Freely 2092]

1 hour ago, Fletch said:

I’ve got some glue showing (to be expected from something handmade IMO, so no big deal to me) but no bubbling...

My VH has glue all over the place and the glued on colored accents (they’re not actually stitched on) are peeling off. But that was VH and I was okay with it. I expect better from True, though.

The tongues I could almost understand if they changed the design at some point, but the bubbling should have never made it past QC. 

[VegasHockey 1280]

7 hours ago, Zac911 said:

I believe it is 12 minutes at 180.

Looks at his pic, it says 15-20 min.

[VegasHockey 1280]

16 hours ago, flip12 said:

The Scott Van Horne boots have been in that neighborhood: MLX, VH, now True. Makos were rather long too: between 12-18 minutes or something IIRC. It's just a different layup/cure(?) recipe that allows for unlimited bakings as well. Pretty sure that's not possible with Bauer, CCM, etc. There just isn't a comparison between these and other lines in that regard.

I wonder what composite they use that is different compared to a Super Tack or JetSpeed skate. I guess it could also be the glue and such as well and not just the composite.  In my JetSpeeds, I started to get sweaty and began worrying around 3 minutes. I feel like 3 minutes was not nearly enough time for the skate to bake fully so it wrapped the contour of my entire foot and ankle. 

[Zac911 317]

1 hour ago, Nicholas G said:

Looks at his pic, it says 15-20 min.

Understand.  What I am saying is the Training Manual I have says 12 minutes-  Based off of using an oven designed for heating skates.  I did 12 on my own personal skates and it was more than enough ( 8-10 would have been fine per the document that comes with the skates ).

What I am READING from that piece of paper states Professional CONVECTION Skate Oven 8-10 minutes and if using a CONVENTIONAL Home Oven 15-20 minutes,  so it's important to distinguish that there is a difference amongst the two.  I know many guys that use their home oven.  I always cringe due to the lowest common demoninator or potential for accidents.

Edited September 24, 2017 by Zac911
Grammar

[KUTYRKOKUV 4]

8 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

I think I’d be contacting them about it. I personally don’t think either of those things is acceptable. Tongues are obviously an easy fix, the bubbling I’m not so sure about.

Just sent them an email, I'll keep you all posted.

[Fletch 219]

37 minutes ago, KUTYRKOKUV said:

Just sent them an email, I'll keep you all posted.

Not positive, but it looks like your tongue without the accents may be the type of tongue that is designated to have the embroidered number on it.  I’m going off of how my tongues look but I could be wrong.  

[Skate Mod 4]

On 9/14/2017 at 1:33 PM, ParkseY said:

I just got my True skates last week and they fit great on the foot but when I skate on them, after about 15 minutes, I get an extreme amount of pain on the outside of both my shins.  I have tried tying them differently, different insoles, etc. and am at a loss.  Any ideas as I'm about to ditch them and go back to my Bauers?  Thanks.

Without knowing what type of Bauer skates you use, holder type and if you tie up your laces all the way up or not. Few things to look at:

You are now using a speed skating boot for hockey, so if you're not a 230lb with very thick legs and feet, you are fighting too much stiffness in all the wrong places.

If the stiff boot forced you not to tie up your laces all the way up, no resistance at the top so nothing holding your foot in the upright position, that means your body weight is too much on your toes (ball of you feet), this puts more stress on your shins and it's very  unnatural position so don't expect it to go away with more playing time.

Lower cut boot, if True is lower cut then your Bauer - same thing not enough resistance at the top, too much weight on the front section of your foot.

Arch, if the slope of the arch in the True skate is lower so less contact with your plantar surface, this effects blood flow and stretching effect on your plantar fascia, that means it effects all your other leg muscles including your Achilles heel all teh way to your back, neck....

If that arch is too high, same thing you can't push through it, the foot is not stretching properly, same issues will occur, there is a small threshold  where it works perfectly all other situations it works against you regardless of the skate model you use, it's all about matching your plantar surface geometry to the skate midsole geometry.

 

[dougie360 1]

Had my VH skates for just over a year now, skating 2-3 times a week.  Had been great until recently.  Now all of a sudden, just after I lace up, I feel this edge cutting into the top of my right inside ankle.  When I start walking to the ice, it hurts a lot and I feel the top edge just above the last eyelet really cutting in.  I'm thinking that no way I can last a whole game.  I re-lace, adjust, but it's still there.  So I skate and luckily it goes away.  But its been coming back every time I lace up.  

I got these Pre-True, so I emailed one of the sales people I bought my skates from VH who forwarded my email to True.  They suggested I purchase the Metatarsal tongues as a replacement  for $80 USD.  (I already paid for my skates last year in USD at full price expecting some good exchange rate - but learned it wasn't going to happen). 

Hope this fixes it.

[IPv6Freely 2092]

That brings up a question I've been meaning to ask. Is the only difference between the black and the white tongues the felt color? Or are they different?

[malcb33 97]

6 hours ago, dougie360 said:

 just after I lace up, I feel this edge cutting into the top of my right inside ankle.  When I start walking to the ice, it hurts a lot and I feel the top edge just above the last eyelet really cutting in. 

They suggested I purchase the Metatarsal tongues as a replacement  for $80 USD.  

Are you saying the top edge of the cuff is digging in (the area Bauers have their comfort edge)? If that is the area, just heat it up and bend it out slightly (away from your ankle). If thats not the area, maybe I'm just not understanding, but a picture would probably help a lot.

I had the VH metatarsal tongues on my skates originally and didn't like them at all. The had a really thick plastic guard running the whole way down the front tongue, which made them very stiff and restricted forward flexion. They also weren't as comfortable as the straight felt option either.

[KUTYRKOKUV 4]

6 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

That brings up a question I've been meaning to ask. Is the only difference between the black and the white tongues the felt color? Or are they different?

So yes, the only thing different between the black and white tongues is the color. They have three different tongues (I think)...the regular, the long and the metatarsal. I believe that you can get all three in either black or white, at least those are the options that I was given.

[KUTYRKOKUV 4]

So, I just heard back from True, they said that they would send me a new pair of tongues if I wanted and that the bubbling was superficial, but if I wanted that they would send me a shipping label and I could send it back I to have it look nice. I'm going to have them send me a shipping label and I will be sending them back in to have the issue corrected, I don't think that's too much to ask. Anyway before I send them in I plan on skating on them every day until the shipping label comes. Still can't wait to get them on the ice, tonight will be the first time!

[IPv6Freely 2092]

20 minutes ago, KUTYRKOKUV said:

So, I just heard back from True, they said that they would send me a new pair of tongues if I wanted and that the bubbling was superficial, but if I wanted that they would send me a shipping label and I could send it back I to have it look nice. I'm going to have them send me a shipping label and I will be sending them back in to have the issue corrected, I don't think that's too much to ask. Anyway before I send them in I plan on skating on them every day until the shipping label comes. Still can't wait to get them on the ice, tonight will be the first time!

Awesome about the tongues, and even more awesome that they’d take care of the cosmetic issues as well! 

[ParkseY 0]

On 9/24/2017 at 10:48 AM, Skate Mod said:

Without knowing what type of Bauer skates you use, holder type and if you tie up your laces all the way up or not. Few things to look at:

You are now using a speed skating boot for hockey, so if you're not a 230lb with very thick legs and feet, you are fighting too much stiffness in all the wrong places.

If the stiff boot forced you not to tie up your laces all the way up, no resistance at the top so nothing holding your foot in the upright position, that means your body weight is too much on your toes (ball of you feet), this puts more stress on your shins and it's very  unnatural position so don't expect it to go away with more playing time.

Lower cut boot, if True is lower cut then your Bauer - same thing not enough resistance at the top, too much weight on the front section of your foot.

Arch, if the slope of the arch in the True skate is lower so less contact with your plantar surface, this effects blood flow and stretching effect on your plantar fascia, that means it effects all your other leg muscles including your Achilles heel all teh way to your back, neck....

If that arch is too high, same thing you can't push through it, the foot is not stretching properly, same issues will occur, there is a small threshold  where it works perfectly all other situations it works against you regardless of the skate model you use, it's all about matching your plantar surface geometry to the skate midsole geometry.

 

I use the same holder and steel for both my 1s skates and the Trues and tie them all the way up normally.  I think it is a muscle issue with too much of my weight being on the ball of my foot as I haven't worn the Trues in a couple of weeks and got a pair of the new 1x skates and have been skating in them with no issue (except the fit not being as good as the Trues).  

I think adding the Superfeet insoles probably did more harm than good in regards to my weight distribution.  Any suggestions on how to get the skates modified to get more of my weight towards my heel?  Different insoles, profiling, rebaking, etc?

[flip12 714]

6 hours ago, ParkseY said:

I use the same holder and steel for both my 1s skates and the Trues and tie them all the way up normally.  I think it is a muscle issue with too much of my weight being on the ball of my foot as I haven't worn the Trues in a couple of weeks and got a pair of the new 1x skates and have been skating in them with no issue (except the fit not being as good as the Trues).  

I think adding the Superfeet insoles probably did more harm than good in regards to my weight distribution.  Any suggestions on how to get the skates modified to get more of my weight towards my heel?  Different insoles, profiling, rebaking, etc?

Is that weight too much on the ball of the foot really a thing? Skaters were fine wearing Grafs when they're just as low cut as Trues but usually also incorporated a flared upper cuff to allow full range of motion. If you go long enough back before that, skates were even lower cut and much less stiff than anything seen recently. If being on the balls of your feet were an issue, players would have constantly been injured in those skates and I'm pretty sure they weren't in fact injured more frequently due to their skates than players are today.

How does the range of motion differ between the Trues and 1Xs?

[Skate Mod 4]

Parksey, 1S is the most upright boot on the market, but the heel to toe offset is the same on all Bauer skates, because they cut all of their boot patterns based on that holder offset.

If True cut their pattern based on Tuuk Edge - most likely not anymore and had the same boot height, boot pitch and volume, it would feel the same, if not then it will mess up the angles on the boot pitch, in most cases more aggressive thus you’re on your toes, superfeet adds even more aggressiveness. If you have proper tools, you can cut a hole in the heel of your superfeet so you sit lower on your heel. First skate with a Bauer insole inside the VH and see how it feels. If VH upper is much deeper then 1S which does look deeper then you’re still on your toes because nothing is holding you in upright position, unless that upper eyelets are cut back to the same depth as 1S.

Nothing can be done to it, once a pattern is cut you can’t stretch the boot anymore into a different pitch angle, if you add front lifts to be more upright you’ll change your heel to toe offset and it will screw things up even more.

Same with the eyelets it would be difficult to shift the volume by ¼” and not rip apart that section.

 

 

Flip12… you have a lot to learn on skate engineering and bio-mechanics before making ridiculous statements.

 

Graf initially was engineered by a speed skater not a hockey player, with one goal in mind speed. Graf went out of business because of aggressive boot pitch, low cut boot, soft boot and lack of understanding what works in hockey, they dominated because at the time no one knew too much what works in hockey.

Players are injured today because they are fixated on speed and nothing else with 13-foot profiles and flat spots; those that skate on smaller radius and no flat spot are less prone to injury.

[flip12 714]

53 minutes ago, Skate Mod said:

Flip12… you have a lot to learn on skate engineering and bio-mechanics before making ridiculous statements.

Graf initially was engineered by a speed skater not a hockey player, with one goal in mind speed. Graf went out of business because of aggressive boot pitch, low cut boot, soft boot and lack of understanding what works in hockey, they dominated because at the time no one knew too much what works in hockey.

Players are injured today because they are fixated on speed and nothing else with 13-foot profiles and flat spots; those that skate on smaller radius and no flat spot are less prone to injury.

 

Great! There's so much here 

1: When do I know I've learned enough where I can start making the ridiculous statements?

2: Interesting!

3, 4: Highly doubtful.

Edited September 26, 2017 by flip12