TRUE TF9/TF7 skates

[althoma1 574]

49 minutes ago, pgeorgan said:

Baked the skate. Skate has now cooled. Literally cannot get my foot back in without excruciating pain. 

When the foot is in the skate, there's actually quite a bit of negative space. I even went a whole size down from Bauer.

A couple things that may help getting them on and off:

Make sure you really loosen the laces and completely undo the top two eyelets (to rethread the top two eyelets when they're on your feet, thread behind the tongue and then pull the laces in front)

Twist your foot in and out.

If you're already doing those two things and still have pain, try spot heating and flaring out the top of the boot a bit, like in this video: 

That won't help with the negative space, but should solve issues with getting them on and off. If the negative space is width wise, there may not be much you can do. If you're talking about the negative space above the toe box then powerfoot inserts or a homemade version of those could help.

If you have a narrow foot, the Catalyst line in True might work better for your feet than the TF series. I have a wide forefoot and there's very little negative space in my TF9s - each foot is different though. 

[pgeorgan 76]

 

14 minutes ago, althoma1 said:

That won't help with the negative space, but should solve issues with getting them on and off. If the negative space is width wise, there may not be much you can do. If you're talking about the negative space above the toe box then powerfoot inserts or a homemade version of those could help.

Problem with that is then I lose wrap. Not a solution, imho. 

Idk. I'll take them to the obligatory sticks and pucks since I got the 30-day fit guarantee, but I'm not really sure these are meant for the Fit 1 type people. I also am wondering about the whole sizing debacle. The length is good, but the eyelets are digging in to my ankles. I would have to wear socks with these. 

[pgeorgan 76]

Going to try the next size up. I think honestly skate was not meant to be used a whole size down from CCM and Bauer. That's just a "hack" people are doing to be able to stick with this skate for whatever reason. 

[Sniper9 529]

40 minutes ago, pgeorgan said:

Going to try the next size up. I think honestly skate was not meant to be used a whole size down from CCM and Bauer. That's just a "hack" people are doing to be able to stick with this skate for whatever reason. 

Or it just doesn't work for you and it does for the people that enjoy them. How is sizing down a "hack"? The skate either fits you lengthwise or it doesn't. 

Honestly from reading your posts, I already knew it wouldn't work for you.   Dont even both getting a larger size. Might as well return the skates now otherwise it's just going to be 29 more days of you complaining about them. 

Edited January 6, 2023 by Sniper9

[RodneyPierce 11]

Hey, no need to toss a bunch of work into em if you think it's all for nothing my man.  Can always find another skate!

[Hills 712]

6 minutes ago, Sniper9 said:

Or it just doesn't work for you and it does for the people that enjoy them. How is sizing down a "hack"? The skate either fits you lengthwise or it doesn't. 

Honestly from reading your posts, I already knew it wouldn't work for you.   Dont even both getting a larger size. Might as well return the skates now otherwise it's just going to be 29 more days of you complaining about them. 

Must be a hack because it doesn't work for me!

[pgeorgan 76]

Ya just doesn't work for me. 

I tried a half and full size down and both are incredibly painful. Actually the most painful skates I've ever worn. 

My feet are absolutely destroyed from baking and fitting two separate pairs back to back lol. I need a stiff drink to numb the pain! 

Edited January 6, 2023 by pgeorgan

[beedee 227]

2 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

Baked the skate. Skate has now cooled. Literally cannot get my foot back in without excruciating pain. 

When the foot is in the skate, there's actually quite a bit of negative space. I even went a whole size down from Bauer.

Remember my comment on the previous page about the hot dog in a hallway feeling regarding the TF series? 😜

[althoma1 574]

1 hour ago, pgeorgan said:

 

Problem with that is then I lose wrap. Not a solution, imho. 

Idk. I'll take them to the obligatory sticks and pucks since I got the 30-day fit guarantee, but I'm not really sure these are meant for the Fit 1 type people. I also am wondering about the whole sizing debacle. The length is good, but the eyelets are digging in to my ankles. I would have to wear socks with these. 

I agree that the TF series isn't ideal Fit 1 type feet. In the TF series the R width is more likely to work for a Fit 2 type foot and the Wide is actually a bit wider in the forefoot than Fit 3, but provides better heel lock for my feet and has average depth.

From what I have read, the Catalyst line in R would be much better than the TF series for a Fit 1 foot.

 

[althoma1 574]

2 minutes ago, beedee said:

Remember my comment on the previous page about the hot dog in a hallway feeling regarding the TF series? 😜

I guess I have hallway shaped feet as the TF9 boots in W really hug my feet, but I scan as a Fit 3. For Fit 1 type feet, I can imagine the hotdog in a hallway feeling would be accurate. I experienced that feeling when I tried in Nexus skates (my forefoot is wide, but my heel and ankle isn't) years ago.

[pgeorgan 76]

23 minutes ago, beedee said:

Remember my comment on the previous page about the hot dog in a hallway feeling regarding the TF series? 😜

They just weren't for me. Very painful. 

Not an indictment of the skate itself. 

Having to go down a full size to get the right amount of negative space (or lack thereof), I ended up having the eyelets making my ankle bone raw. I imagine the redesigned boot is better. 

Edited January 6, 2023 by pgeorgan

[pgeorgan 76]

3 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

Or it just doesn't work for you and it does for the people that enjoy them. How is sizing down a "hack"? The skate either fits you lengthwise or it doesn't. 

Honestly from reading your posts, I already knew it wouldn't work for you.   Dont even both getting a larger size. Might as well return the skates now otherwise it's just going to be 29 more days of you complaining about them. 

Its like I said: boot isn't very "moldable" so much as it is expandable. Without a good out-of-the-box fit (which you kinda laughed at me for), it'll never fit properly. 

Skate fit lengthwise, but that was about it. Forgetting the whole rigamarole of getting it on and off in the first place, there was too much negative space.

Edited January 7, 2023 by pgeorgan

[althoma1 574]

5 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

Its like I said: boot isn't very "moldable" so much as it is expandable. Without a good out-of-the-box fit (which you kinda laughed at me for), it'll never fit properly. 

Skate fit lengthwise, but that was about it. Forgetting the whole rigamarole of getting it on and off in the first place, there was too much negative space.

You can't make any boots smaller or remove negative space. There's no brand or model that allows for this. You're right, the thermoformability of Trues makes them expand around your feet, plus you can get a good wrap, but it definitely doesn't allow them to shrink around your feet.

Beyond thermoformability, with Trues or any skate brand, you can punch or stretch them to make them wider, longer or deal with pressure points. Plus, padding compresses with use. That's why if you're between sizes, it's generally better to go with the smaller size. With Trues, it's ideal to have them feel too small and a bit too tight before baking and break in. If you feel room before baking, that's definitely not going to go away with baking - you'll only get more room after baking and break in. 

[pgeorgan 76]

9 hours ago, althoma1 said:

You can't make any boots smaller or remove negative space. There's no brand or model that allows for this. You're right, the thermoformability of Trues makes them expand around your feet, plus you can get a good wrap, but it definitely doesn't allow them to shrink around your feet.

Beyond thermoformability, with Trues or any skate brand, you can punch or stretch them to make them wider, longer or deal with pressure points. Plus, padding compresses with use. That's why if you're between sizes, it's generally better to go with the smaller size. With Trues, it's ideal to have them feel too small and a bit too tight before baking and break in. If you feel room before baking, that's definitely not going to go away with baking - you'll only get more room after baking and break in. 

The skates might be thermoformable, but at least in my case, that didn't translate well into their ability to take up the actual shape of my feet. 

All retail skates are made from some sort of generic last. Out of the box, True's last had the least resemblance to my feet as compared to CCM and Bauer. It is this particular fact that led to the poor fitment I experienced. Simply put, I was not a good candidate for their choice of generic foot last. 

IMHO, there's too much emphasis being put on "thermoformability". Outside of a completely custom skate, this feature has a very limited ability to effect the overall fit. You can't just grab any old boot and say, 'well this has best-in-class thermoformability, therefore it's going to fit the best". 

This is wrong. 

That's the takeaway here. For me, anyway. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by pgeorgan

[Sniper9 529]

8 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

The skates might be thermoformable, but at least in my case, that didn't translate well into their ability to take up the actual shape of my feet. 

All retail skates are made from some sort of generic last. Out of the box, True's last had the least resemblance to my feet as compared to CCM and Bauer. It is this particular fact that led to the poor fitment I experienced. Simply put, I was not a good candidate for their choice of generic foot last. 

IMHO, there's too much emphasis being put on "thermoformability". Outside of a completely custom skate, this feature has a very limited ability to effect the overall fit. You can't just grab any old boot and say, 'well this has best-in-class thermoformability, therefore it's going to fit the best". 

This is wrong. 

That's the takeaway here. For me, anyway. 

Did you heat them up yourself or in store?

In my experience the true customs are very formable so maybe the retail version is a bit diff. I think the retail tf9 instructions say to have them in the oven for 8 minutes? where the tf customs I have were 12-15 in the oven. They were so soft I could easily press down on the top of the forefoot and it would almost flatten. 

On another note, I think the catalyst line is best suited for you. I just got my catalyst pros baked in store. The cat pros are based off retails shell sizing and width so it should be fairly similar fit to retails in general in terms of length and width/volume.  I'll make a more detailed post in the other vh thread but in general what I noticed was that the catalyst was much more narrow in the forefoot and overall fit. And the toecap def is lower volume. I felt the toecap the same volume as my tf customs after I made diy power foot inserts for my customs and lowered the tongue on my customs. The cat pros was baked and fitted normally in terms of no shrink wrap was used nor was it needed. The fit was very snug but bc true has nice foam lining in the forefoot and they don't use a two piece toecap system it didn't cause hot spots. It just felt like my foot was bring hugged all over. I was actually shocked how much better it felt than my tf customs after the first bake and not even needed a wrap. Heel lock is also better in the cat pros. 

[pgeorgan 76]

2 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

In my experience the true customs are very formable so maybe the retail version is a bit diff. I think the retail tf9 instructions say to have them in the oven for 8 minutes? where the tf customs I have were 12-15 in the oven. They were so soft I could easily press down on the top of the forefoot and it would almost flatten. 

We're beating a dead horse here. The True retail skate last does not at all resemble my foot. I have now confirmed this not once, but twice, with two different sizes. 

CCM and Bauer both have 3 different fits across 2-3 different skates. True, until recently, had just the TF series in regular and wide. If they had something "tapered", eg, that might've been a better candidate. I'm calling bs on SVH marketing video from a while back saying the TF would fit "85-90%" of market. 

All things being equal, I think a company with 9 options (like CCM) is likely to have the greater chance of a match than one with 2 options (pre-Catalyst). 

Catalyst I'm sure is an improvement. If I'm able to get my hands on a pair in person, I will be sure to try it out.

Going forward, if I ever end up in a pair of True's, it'll likely be the SVH customs. Catalyst Pro. After looking into it, it looks like the Catalyst don't have the extra "wrap" of the SVH. I think I would be happier if some of that were removed. Watching the video, it also appears you can get custom foam added. That was prob my biggest gripe about the TF9. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by pgeorgan

[Sniper9 529]

4 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

We're beating a dead horse here. The True retail skate last does not at all resemble my foot. I have now confirmed this not once, but twice, with two different sizes. 

CCM and Bauer both have 3 different fits across 2-3 different skates. True, until recently, had just the TF series in regular and wide. If they had something "tapered", eg, that might've been a better candidate. I'm calling bs on SVH marketing video from a while back saying the TF would fit "85-90%" of market. 

All things being equal, I think a company with 9 options (like CCM) is likely to have the greater chance of a match than one with 2 options (pre-Catalyst). 

Catalyst I'm sure is an improvement. If I'm able to get my hands on a pair in person, I will be sure to try it out.

Going forward, if I ever end up in a pair of True's, it'll likely be the SVH customs. Catalyst Pro. After looking into it, it looks like the Catalyst don't have the extra "wrap" of the SVH. I think I would be happier if some of that were removed. Watching the video, it also appears you can get custom foam added. That was prob my biggest gripe about the TF9. 

My cat pros have almost identical wrap as my tf customs. The video says otherwise but the gap between the eyelets are nearly identical and for both I need to drop the top eyelet for proper ankle flexion. 

So because the tf9 doesn't fit YOU, you're claiming it doesn't fit 85-90% of tht population. Basically you're saying you have the most avg foot out there (not sure how you can even back this up) and because of this you should have been one of the 85-90% that fit well in the tf9s. 

 

[pgeorgan 76]

2 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

My cat pros have almost identical wrap as my tf customs. The video says otherwise but the gap between the eyelets are nearly identical and for both I need to drop the top eyelet for proper ankle flexion. 

Ok, so you're proving my point that SVH marketing is incorrect/misleading. 

2 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

So because the tf9 doesn't fit YOU, you're claiming it doesn't fit 85-90% of tht population. Basically you're saying you have the most avg foot out there (not sure how you can even back this up) and because of this you should have been one of the 85-90% that fit well in the tf9s. 

 

Based on the fact that I fit into any number of CCM/Bauer skates, it would be a safe assumption to say that no, TF9 do not fit 85-90% of the population. I do not need an "average" foot for this to be true. 90% of normal probability distribution is roughly 1.645 sigmas. I just need to be somewhere in there, and mathematically, based on what I just said, its **highly** likely that I do. 

Lastly, the onus isn't on me to prove this point. It is on SVH/True. 

[Westside 232]

Just let it rest my guy. Geez. We get it. Trues don’t fit you. Onto the next topic…

[Hills 712]

8 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

Did you heat them up yourself or in store?

In my experience the true customs are very formable so maybe the retail version is a bit diff. I think the retail tf9 instructions say to have them in the oven for 8 minutes? where the tf customs I have were 12-15 in the oven. They were so soft I could easily press down on the top of the forefoot and it would almost flatten. 

On another note, I think the catalyst line is best suited for you. I just got my catalyst pros baked in store. The cat pros are based off retails shell sizing and width so it should be fairly similar fit to retails in general in terms of length and width/volume.  I'll make a more detailed post in the other vh thread but in general what I noticed was that the catalyst was much more narrow in the forefoot and overall fit. And the toecap def is lower volume. I felt the toecap the same volume as my tf customs after I made diy power foot inserts for my customs and lowered the tongue on my customs. The cat pros was baked and fitted normally in terms of no shrink wrap was used nor was it needed. The fit was very snug but bc true has nice foam lining in the forefoot and they don't use a two piece toecap system it didn't cause hot spots. It just felt like my foot was bring hugged all over. I was actually shocked how much better it felt than my tf customs after the first bake and not even needed a wrap. Heel lock is also better in the cat pros. 

Retails ones still form A LOT and you have to be careful of over wrapping the eyelets so you can actually get your foot out just like the customs. But they still don't mold as much as the customs do obviously.

[Sniper9 529]

1 hour ago, Hills said:

Retails ones still form A LOT and you have to be careful of over wrapping the eyelets so you can actually get your foot out just like the customs. But they still don't mold as much as the customs do obviously.

When you baked your cat pros did you follow the instructions? The reason I ask is bc the new instructions say to only bake for 6 mins Max. Which is far from the 10-15 mins for the vh and when true took over vh. 

[pgeorgan 76]

10 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

When you baked your cat pros did you follow the instructions? The reason I ask is bc the new instructions say to only bake for 6 mins Max. Which is far from the 10-15 mins for the vh and when true took over vh. 

SMH. 

[start_today 770]

Imagine having the extra time and disposable income to buy $1k+ custom skates you don’t want or need or even like just to endlessly complain about them before you get them, ignore advice to help them fit, and assert a bunch of unfounded assumptions, all so you can make some protracted internet argument, while lashing out at people offering advice and saying “you guys are all True fanboys, Bauer skates is the best 4eva.”

It’s like when a child throws a tantrum about not wanting to eat a food that they’ve never even tried, but in those cases the child didn’t go out and spend a bunch of energy getting that food.

 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by start_today

[Hills 712]

16 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

When you baked your cat pros did you follow the instructions? The reason I ask is bc the new instructions say to only bake for 6 mins Max. Which is far from the 10-15 mins for the vh and when true took over vh. 

Yeah, we followed what came in the box.

[Sniper9 529]

3 hours ago, start_today said:

Imagine having the extra time and disposable income to buy $1k+ custom skates you don’t want or need or even like just to endlessly complain about them before you get them, ignore advice to help them fit, and assert a bunch of unfounded assumptions, all so you can make some protracted internet argument, while lashing out at people offering advice and saying “you guys are all True fanboys, Bauer skates is the best 4eva.”

It’s like when a child throws a tantrum about not wanting to eat a food that they’ve never even tried, but in those cases the child didn’t go out and spend a bunch of energy getting that food.

 

 

Love it. Amen.