McAmmond Injured

[Fire0nIce228 1]

It makes the Armstrong hit in the playoffs last season look like nothing..

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

If the NHL did things the right way, there would be no long-term fire to fuel. If the players were allowed a little more lee-way in policing themselves and one another, a situation like this would have had an opportunity to burn-out last night (though the fact that Downie was immediately tossed from the game would have made it difficult). Instead, rules have been put in place which essentially protect guys like Downie from any repercussions of their actions on the ice.

Darcy Tucker, anyone? Ryan Hollweg? Colby 'bitch ass' Armstrong? They're all guilty of doing this crap night in and night out with it going un-policed and un-sanctioned. In fact, I think I'll sit back and smile with great joy when something horrific happens to Colby Armstrong. What goes around comes around kid....I don't hate anyone in this world, but Colby Armstrong is the dog shit that you scrape from the waffle of your sneaker sole.

Listen, I was pretty outraged last night over what Downie did to McAmmond. Dean McAmmond is a guy that didn't deserve that, especially after coming off the concussion in the Finals. More than that, he certainly didn't deserve it from some puke who's proven NOTHING at the NHL level.

If Downie was that pissed off about being punked out, why didn't he go after Schubert? Because he can't, because he IS a punk. I said it in the Training Camp thread, Steve Downie is one of the most overrated 'prospects' to come along, and he won't have a very prosperours NHL career if he keeps pulling antics like last night.

I understand this is a violent sport by nature, and hockey players are tough SOB's, but this was totally uncalled for.

/RANT

i agree that some hits that have been thrown,are very derserving of few games. but thats the role some of theses guys play. when i played thats what i did. stur shit up, get into ppls faces. colbys hit on koviu was fine, glided int him, koviu turned away... patrick eves was guilty of having his head up his ass... i have rang a few guys bells for doing the same thing he did. i watched the downie hit a few times in slow mo... and it actually looks like he didnt leave his feet until after the hit, i think he charged him huge, and was trying to make an impact on the game. unfortunately it was alot more than he expect. head hits wont be stopped, alot of hits that have caused injuries last years were clean.. its just when the shoulder made impact. and im almost positive that downie wasnt like well.. he just had a concussion i wont hit him.. like no all of us have played in some intenses games, where blood flows, and sometimes we all do something we regret. at the NHL level at this time of year, the guys are gunning for a spot, and like i said before sometimes we under estimate ourselves. i hope downie gets suspended. but i also hope the hits dont stop, i dont want to go pay and watch someone sunday morning shinny with defence men waving their sticks, as forwards dangle their way through everyone... hits like the one on eves, and tucker on kapanen, or tucker on JR are part of the game that needs to be there.

I have a question and a couple comments.

How old are you? Based on what I've just read, I have a hard time imagining you're old enough to have ever "stur shit up, get into ppls faces...rang a few guys bells".

Secondly, please go back to grammar school or at the very least ask someone who can read and write to check your submissions before posting. Reading garbage like that posted above is tough on the rest of us.

regardless of how i wrote something all you have seem to do what was point out a few of my mistakes... thats my how i feel about. hitting is part of the game. i dont know where you played hockey, or how competitively, but some players get into that zone so much they dont realize the outcome of their actions. downie is looking to make a team, so he through a huge hit, was he alittle carried away, of course. does that happen to most of us, yes it does.so instead of chriping a few grammer errors stay on topic.

Love to stay on Topic. Min 25 games for being a complete ass.

And it doesnt matter how much hockey you have played you havent earned the respect you think you have if you think for a second by earning a spot that was a needed check.

As for a Zone???? That kid is a total head case every guy I know in the OHL hates the guy for the stupid shit he does. I am not a big fan of Alu but know him very well and Downies does not deserve to play in the AHL or the NHL in fact with his head issues and personal problems he shouldnt be allowed to play hockey!

Does he have some talent yes....does he have the respect of his fellow players.....not for a second!

25 games min and should be a year IMOP.

[Viking 1]

So does this mean that Canadians will stop booing Jack Johnson every time he touches the puck?

No. The fact that Steve Downie is also little prick doesn't make Jack Johnson any more likeable.

[mrusse01 0]

This was a very hard bodycheck. That's it.

When did we get to a point in hockey where seemingly every large hit is cause for suspension and starts debate over the very fabric of the game? Seriously, what was the last big hit that didn't have someone claiming foul over? This wasn't a head shot, it wasn't late, and it wasn't an elbow...it was a very hard hit by a pissed off player who lost his temper and probably regrets it.

If you keep coming around the net like that looking behind you, in the NHL you are going to get thumped, plain and simple.

Hockey at the pro level is a fast, vicious, dangerous game. That was a fast, vicious, dangerous hit.

[DarkStar50 679]

when you cross over the line from a hard hit to a dangerous hit, you have still crossed over the line. While no one can determine intent, was Downie's intent to lay out a hard hit or a dangerous hit?

[mrusse01 0]

when you cross over the line from a hard hit to a dangerous hit, you have still crossed over the line. While no one can determine intent, was Downie's intent to lay out a hard hit or a dangerous hit?

I think the intent is irrelevent. Of course he was trying to 'hurt' him, when you skate full speed into someone that doesn't see you coming, you know it's going to hurt them pretty bad. You hope they get up from it and are fine afterwards, but it doesn't always happen that way. Hockey is a dangerous game.

There are two things that bother me about this hit: a ) it was pre-season and b ) it was on a player with a known concussion history.

But with both points you can argue Downie was just doing his best to make the team, and hitting people is part of his role. If it's Tucker or Armstrong, an established NHL'er who makes the hit I think in that case it is just going too far for no good reason and that player would lose some respect in my eyes.

If I'm coming down that ice in Downie's skates and see the play developing, maybe I think to myself 'McAmmond has a history of concussions, it's preseason, I won't really lay into him here'...but on the other hand if I've just gotten pumped in the corner, I'm pissed, probably embarassed, worried that I've just got lit up and the coaches aren't going to take that favorably in evaluating if I make this team, then yeah, I'd probably do the same thing as Downie and hit McAmmond as hard as I can.

[LkptTiger 1]

Would you hit him late and high, too?

[QandA 0]

]

If I'm coming down that ice in Downie's skates and see the play developing, maybe I think to myself 'McAmmond has a history of concussions, it's preseason, I won't really lay into him here'...but on the other hand if I've just gotten pumped in the corner, I'm pissed, probably embarassed, worried that I've just got lit up and the coaches aren't going to take that favorably in evaluating if I make this team, then yeah, I'd probably do the same thing as Downie and hit McAmmond as hard as I can.

That's way too much thinking for a play. When you're on the back check you don't think, oh that guy has a concussion, it's preseason, I'm gonna let up and let him go. Preseason or not hockey play hard. The fact is, if Downie were coasting on the back check, stayed on his feet, he still would of clocked McAmmond, not to the same extent, but he's in such a vulnerable position.

[KingPest19 0]

regardless of how i wrote something all you have seem to do what was point out a few of my mistakes... thats my how i feel about. hitting is part of the game. i dont know where you played hockey, or how competitively, but some players get into that zone so much they dont realize the outcome of their actions. downie is looking to make a team, so he through a huge hit, was he alittle carried away, of course. does that happen to most of us, yes it does.so instead of chriping a few grammer errors stay on topic.

After I go to the trouble of kindly asking you to use normal English like the rest of us, you respond with that? If English is not your first language, then I apologize for being on your ass, BUT if not, then I am saddened by what our schools must be teaching...

ANYWAYS, back on topic. I agree with a few of your points, but disagree with the important ones. Everyone who's been trying to move up a level in ANY sport at any point in their life understands about trying to give a little extra to make yourself stand out.

However, almost everyone also knows that means dropping the mitts a few times with a willing partner, playing with a bit of a chip on your shoulder, and finishing your checks hard AND CLEAN. It does not give you an excuse to go out and make like Superman and drive your elbows into someone's face. I don't think any coach at any level would say that attempting to injure another player shows them that you're ready for that league.

Downie has always had a reputation as a dirty, cheapshotting little weasel, and he played it to perfection last night. That was obviously a whiny little punk embarrassed over getting crunched a few times going out looking for blood. Here's a nice little video clip showing the class and sportsmanship that he's famous for.

Make sure to watch to the end to see his fantastic soccer and baseball skills.

Heres another one showing what a class act he is

Always classy to put your stick balde near someones eyes because they wont drop with you.

[GoHabsGo24 1]

not to mention this one:

what a scumbag. Too bad he wont get the suspension he deserves. Too bad he has talent but is a total twat with no respect for anyone else...

[mrusse01 0]

Would you hit him late and high, too?

It was right on the fringe of being a late hit as far as I'm concerned, he was admiring his pass. Maybe it's ruthless by new NHL standards, but players like Scott Stevens threw hundreds of checks throughout their career WAY later than that.

As for it being high, where is he supposed to hit him, in the stomach? You throw a hip check nowadays and people go nuts saying you are going after his knee. It's a body check, he hit him with his shoulder, when you hit someone with your shoulder most of the time you're going to hit the person in their shoulder area, which unfortunatly happens to be right beside the head.

Maybe I just wasn't good enough or something, but when I had someone lined up I never thought to myself 'hmm..I'm going to try and hit him in the head/shoulder/chest/whatever'...I just hit 'em. Keep your elbows in, hands down, head up, and that's it.

And yes, there is enough time in a hockey play to think 'who is this guy...should I really hit him'? That's the biggest problem I have with this play, I wouldn't hit someone like that with a concussion history because I realize it could end their career. Downie knew exactly who that was coming around the net, he stalked him from 3/4's of the ice away.

[LkptTiger 1]

He could have easily taken more body on the hit; unfortunately (but not surprisingly) he was going after the knockout, so he chose to leave his feet and go after Dean's head.

[troy 12]

Just to add, it took McAmmond slightly less than one second in the Youtube video to go around the net, in slower motion.

[cause4alarm 6]

The guy on my left shoulder says:

I think the debate as to whether

the hit was late

he left his feet

he was charging

he used his elbows (maybe not debatable)

there was deliberate intent to injure

is largely irrelevant. I'm not sure if it's an actual NHL rule, but contact to the head should be deemed illegal and there should be a strict, well-defined, zero-tolerance policy.

The guy on my right shoulder says:

I'm a short hockey player. I can't tell you how many times I've been elbowed in the face by some tall guy on the other team who got away with it (when they do get called they "add insult to injury" by whining that it's not their fault that I'm so short). If I had a chance to line up one of those bastards and hit them in the face (and if they're 6'3"+, I'd definitely have to leave my feet to do it), I honestly don't know if I could say that I'd restrain myself in the heat of the moment. Sometimes it's unfair to speculate when you're in certain circumstances.

That said, McAmmond clearly didn't do anything like that to Downie to warrant that. (Note: I also believe they're both about the same height.)

On the other hand, for those who said that Downie should have gone after Schubert--I can't say that I completely agree with that. Like I said, I'm a small guy and because of that, I get knocked around a lot. When I get up after getting knocked down, I'm going after anybody on the ice who isn't wearing my colors (aside from the ref, of course). I don't like to be distracted with personal vendettas, so I consider everyone on the other team in my crosshairs, although I try to keep my hits as legal and reasonable as possible.

[BoDangles 0]

He could have easily taken more body on the hit; unfortunately (but not surprisingly) he was going after the knockout, so he chose to leave his feet and go after Dean's head.

How do you know he was going for the knockout? now if he would have pulled a Chris Neil and stuck his elbow out then was going for the knockout, but his elbows were in.

[Wolfpack_1986 146]

He could have easily taken more body on the hit; unfortunately (but not surprisingly) he was going after the knockout, so he chose to leave his feet and go after Dean's head.

How do you know he was going for the knockout? now if he would have pulled a Chris Neil and stuck his elbow out then was going for the knockout, but his elbows were in.

i think the air jordan move gave that away...

[LkptTiger 1]

He could have easily taken more body on the hit; unfortunately (but not surprisingly) he was going after the knockout, so he chose to leave his feet and go after Dean's head.

How do you know he was going for the knockout?

Surely you're joking, right?

[cause4alarm 6]

How do you know he was going for the knockout?

Is anybody here familiar with Starman's Flying Cross Chop?

[sabre09923 0]

Chalk that up for the first time anyone's ever mentioned Pro Wrestling (NES) on the forum.

[mrusse01 0]

So there is a difference between a really hard hit, and a hit where you are 'going for the knockout'?

Whenever I hit somebody it was as hard as I could, I never thought 'hey, I'll hit this guy at about 75% power, don't want to knock him out'.

[LkptTiger 1]

There is a difference between hitting someone hard and being dirty about it. When you have the opportunity to tee-off on someone, do you throw a good, solid body check, or do you leave your feet and go after his head?

[bdj 0]

I think he hardly Jumped into him like people are saying and that it was just a bad situation all together. I will say it was a bad hit and I in no way promote hits to the head or intent to injure. He didnt leave his feet until contact and there was NO way his hit was any later than the scott stevens special. The guy was just trying to make his mark in the league and it went wrong and will probably cost him, but the only reason this hit is even debatable is because he hit an injury prone jacknob

[DarkStar50 679]

hey mack, could we amp up the brain power a few more levels on this?

[chippa13 1844]

"He'll get what's coming to him," McGrattan said. "He'll do it to the wrong guy and somebody will put him out of hockey. You do that at his level a couple of times, guys in junior won't do it, but guys at this level will.

"He'll get what's coming to him next time we play him, that's for sure," he said.

Here's hoping that all Downie suffers the next time they play is a couple of lost chicklets, otherwise, these words could come back to haunt McGrattan.

[tips09 0]

I think he hardly Jumped into him like people are saying and that it was just a bad situation all together. I will say it was a bad hit and I in no way promote hits to the head or intent to injure. He didnt leave his feet until contact and there was NO way his hit was any later than the scott stevens special. The guy was just trying to make his mark in the league and it went wrong and will probably cost him, but the only reason this hit is even debatable is because he hit an injury prone jacknob

I completely agree with what you said bdj