Toe-Pulls

[DoubleT96 0]

Might be a stupid question, but last night played a game for the first time in about a year. I've always tried to follow good hockey etiquette, but I'm not sure if some of the unwritten rules have changed since the last time I played.

All was cool during the game until about halfway through the first I moved up to forward. When I rush with the puck, I tend to use toe-pulls ALOT to go around players and make me way toward the goal. I used a couple toe-pulls in row and got a decent shot off, but every shift after that, I found i was getting head hunted. One guy plain out tomahawked my shaft, and I thought for sure that he cracked it. Any way, my question is, are toe-pulls considered show-boating, or did this team just react badly? I'm not trying to show-boat, but if it's become an unwritten rule or something then I'll change my game a bit.

[mrusse01 0]

There's nothing wrong with toe drags (toe pulls) if you can actually do them and get around people. Some guys (i.e assholes) get really pissed if you deke them no matter how you do it.

[Jarick 5]

If the players are below your level and it's open hockey, maybe etiquette would be to scale it down a bit. Otherwise nothing wrong with it.

[mrusse01 0]

If the players are below your level and it's open hockey, maybe etiquette would be to scale it down a bit. Otherwise nothing wrong with it.

That's true, but I'd say that goes with anything, not just toe drags.

[Jason Harris 31]

Any way, my question is, are toe-pulls considered show-boating, or did this team just react badly?

Yes to both questions IF you are playing in the wrong level. There is no doubt the other team reacted badly, but if you're a B player going against E players, they won't like when you pull out B moves.

[lotus 2]

Yes to both questions IF you are playing in the wrong level. There is no doubt the other team reacted badly, but if you're a B player going against E players, they won't like when you pull out B moves.

This.

Definitely chill a little on it if it's turning people inside out who have trouble staying on their feet as is. However, whenever I play with or against people of a significantly higher skill level, I simplify my game big time. It's usually for the better anyway.

There are certainly those people who will get pissed if you beat them though, they're everywhere. Some people take it really personal. I wouldn't dwell too much on it.

[iceholes 0]

i dont know if its showboating... but if you need two toe drags and could not locate another player for a look... you are either outskating your line... or are just hot dogging. If you are using multiple toe drags on the same rush... I can see how that can be construed as showboating.... besides, if its non-checking...yeah it can be rather much, cause you know you'd get knocked on your azz the second time you tried it

[chippa13 1844]

They are commonly known as high school moves. Pulling them constantly in no-check leagues could get you ragged on and you'll probably hear once or twice, "Try that in a checking league."

[mrusse01 0]

They are commonly known as high school moves. Pulling them constantly in no-check leagues could get you ragged on and you'll probably hear once or twice, "Try that in a checking league."

That bullshit. If you are playing guys your own level and are toe dragging them, it's their problem. Any legitimate player would be able to stop you just as effectively in a contact league as they would in a non-contact one.

The real advantage in non check leagues (stuff I don't think a lot of people think about) is to be had cutting across the blue line, using body position along the boards, that kind of thing...it's not toe dragging or otherwise beating guys one on one.

[chippa13 1844]

Easy, killer. Just telling it the way it is around these parts.

[Sed27 0]

They are commonly known as high school moves. Pulling them constantly in no-check leagues could get you ragged on and you'll probably hear once or twice, "Try that in a checking league."

Chippa I toatally agree. There are some things guys can get away with because checking is not allowed...

I believe the key word is constantly. Pulling a nice toe drag to get around a guy in a game where there is comparable skill level is fine by me.

However, there are some guys that repeatedly go coast to coast and attempt to pull the same dekes every time. I'm talking about those players who have obvious skill but never seem to pass to their teammates and will attempt fancy moves for the sake of making themselves look good. Showboaters like this shouldn't be suprised is they get a hack or two.

[mrusse01 0]

They are commonly known as high school moves. Pulling them constantly in no-check leagues could get you ragged on and you'll probably hear once or twice, "Try that in a checking league."

Chippa I toatally agree. There are some things guys can get away with because checking is not allowed...

I believe the key word is constantly. Pulling a nice toe drag to get around a guy in a game where there is comparable skill level is fine by me.

However, there are some guys that repeatedly go coast to coast and attempt to pull the same dekes every time. I'm talking about those players who have obvious skill but never seem to pass to their teammates and will attempt fancy moves for the sake of making themselves look good. Showboaters like this shouldn't be suprised is they get a hack or two.

I think that's just a crutch guy's use because they got beat....'oh, if this was checking I would have totally had him'. Ok bud.

I guess I haven't played contact in a while, but I seem to remember it being easier to just stick check a guy than it was to lay him out with a hit.

If you are showboating, trying to make yourself look good, or refusing to pass those are all problems unrelated to toe dragging. Anybody who starts chirping at another player of similar skill because he keeps getting beat by him is an asshole in my opinion. Whenever I get beat I'm mad at myself, not the other guy.

[Chadd 916]

They are commonly known as high school moves. Pulling them constantly in no-check leagues could get you ragged on and you'll probably hear once or twice, "Try that in a checking league."

You left out the part where they're looking down the whole time. I just stand them up, checking league or not. I'm not talking about a big hit, just hold my ground and let them run into me.

[Eazy_b97 1]

I get an insane amount of tears the second I body anyone at all. Usually someone trying a toe drag or cut move and I'm holding my position. There's often times I have to give up position in order to avoid senseless issues. Usually I'll give a lane and lift a stick or something along those lines. Getting to be frustrating, as my hands will be down and I'm not making a move into the player.

As for the toe drags, it depends, if you use it well and aren't hot dogging in general, it shouldn't be an issue. If you are doing it while there are better options, you'll likely hear about it.

[Chadd 916]

I get an insane amount of tears the second I body anyone at all. Usually someone trying a toe drag or cut move and I'm holding my position. There's often times I have to give up position in order to avoid senseless issues. Usually I'll give a lane and lift a stick or something along those lines. Getting to be frustrating, as my hands will be down and I'm not making a move into the player.

As for the toe drags, it depends, if you use it well and aren't hot dogging in general, it shouldn't be an issue. If you are doing it while there are better options, you'll likely hear about it.

Guys bitch about it but they usually don't try it again.

[DoubleT96 0]

Thanks for all the comments! I was playing in a silver league where I typically play in a gold league, but I don't think the skill level last night was completely disproportionate. In the situation last night, I made the first toe-drag to beat a guy one-on-one near the boards, as I was cutting in toward center ice. Right away, i noticed the second guy try to step into me, so I dragged around him, out of instinct more than trying to make a flashy move. Typically, I would have looked to see if I created an open passing lane after the first drag, but the second guy came at me so fast that I was really pivoting out of the way and found myself dragging the puck.

After reading the comments above, I can see how the team may have thought I was trying to showboat. At the handshake, I made it a point to tell all the guys on the other team "hey nice D out there." Just so they knew I wasn't trying to be some asshole, but one guy yelled, "hey, why don't you play both sides of the rink next time." So, he obviously had his own feelings.

In the end, though at least I know that toe-drags can be considered more than just a deke. So in the future, I'll definitely be aware of the skill level and amount of use of that particular move. I really appreciate all the thoughts!

[chippa13 1844]

Not for nothing but dragging a couple guys in a row and then saying, "Nice D out there" after might not come off well for you.

[DoubleT96 0]

no, it wasn't meant like that. After I made the drags, I didn't say anything; that's not my style. It was after the game during the handshake. A couple guys really did make some nice defensive plays and I was just letting them know. One guy made a nice backhanded pick and I made sure to tell him. He thanked me and gave me a tap on shoulder. Some other guys made some solid plays and I let them know about.

[tro 4]

The only time I think toe dragging is bush, is in a shinny game against competiton not up to your level and when your killing a team and your doing it to show off and make the other team look bad.

In a regular league game, that is close, I will toe drag all day long if it gets me through a guy or two. I have been dropped a couple of times by guys mad about it, but that's cool, I don't get to upset, I usually expect it. And I really don't mind if a guy makes a good d play and simply stands me up like Chadd said.

But, I won't hesitate to do any move or as the kids say, dangle.(except lacrossing the puck, be prepared to get nailed if you pull that in my men's league)

Speaking of Toe Drag, Last night Edmonton vs Atl, Hemsky did a drag on a guy it OT that made the d look like a child, I am just stunned when a guy can pull it off in the show like that. He might have the best drag in the league.

[Law Goalie 147]

The one thing about the toe-drag that really is effective is that it quickly and substantially changes the 'shooting triangle' - that is, the open angles between the puck and the posts. A correctly timed and positioned toe-drag leading into a well-placed snapper that exploits the newly-opened angles can be a huge problem for a goalie who can't adjust in time, whether from a simple lack of skating ability or the need to cover other options.

It's also a good way to quickly get the puck into a clumsy defenceman's feet to partially screen the release.

There are some guys who just sell this move unbelievably well. It shouldn't work, but it does. It's like snake-oil. I was at a tournament last year where one of our guys was so hung-over he could barely pull his socks on, let alone skate. He got on the ice, parked himself on the boards, and actually toe-dragged two guys in a row who tried to pressure him at the half-boards without ever moving his feet: he just sold it with weight-shifts and stick movement. Now, of course, he also made himself dizzy in doing this, and they just came back and double-teamed him. Still, a good illustration of how effectively this move can confuse aggressive and/or sub-par defenders.

[mrusse01 0]

The one thing about the toe-drag that really is effective is that it quickly and substantially changes the 'shooting triangle' - that is, the open angles between the puck and the posts. A correctly timed and positioned toe-drag leading into a well-placed snapper that exploits the newly-opened angles can be a huge problem for a goalie who can't adjust in time, whether from a simple lack of skating ability or the need to cover other options.

Well said....I find it particularly useful to come in on the off wing with the puck out wide towards the slot, and quickly drag it inside and snap short side. Even with no defender I will often do this, and I've noticed a lot of goalies have a real problem with it, because as you mentioned it changes the shooting angle so quickly. Pulling the puck back and towards you also loads the shot up a bit so you can get a little extra zip on it, great move all in all.

[interpathway 9]

Bush league is running your yap about the other team.

[Law Goalie 147]

The one thing about the toe-drag that really is effective is that it quickly and substantially changes the 'shooting triangle' - that is, the open angles between the puck and the posts. A correctly timed and positioned toe-drag leading into a well-placed snapper that exploits the newly-opened angles can be a huge problem for a goalie who can't adjust in time, whether from a simple lack of skating ability or the need to cover other options.

Well said....I find it particularly useful to come in on the off wing with the puck out wide towards the slot, and quickly drag it inside and snap short side. Even with no defender I will often do this, and I've noticed a lot of goalies have a real problem with it, because as you mentioned it changes the shooting angle so quickly. Pulling the puck back and towards you also loads the shot up a bit so you can get a little extra zip on it, great move all in all.

Exactly. As you said, it even works on breakaways; it gets the goalie thinking a little about the deke instead of the shot, and then it's already on the way with speed.

I find it most difficult to deal with in a 3-on-1 where the drop to the trailer is clean, and the trailer drags. I'm already so damn worried about the passing options and whether my D has the third guy covered that that being forced to re-evaluate the angles is a real problem.

[fieldofdreams 0]

Not for nothing but dragging a couple guys in a row and then saying, "Nice D out there" after might not come off well for you.

Agreed. Even if you truly meant it with all the best intentions, the guys who are still fuming because you schooled them might misconstrue that as a bit of a taunt. A simple "great game", or "nice hustle" sould suffice.

[DoubleT96 0]

The only time I think toe dragging is bush, is in a shinny game against competiton not up to your level and when your killing a team and your doing it to show off and make the other team look bad.

In a regular league game, that is close, I will toe drag all day long if it gets me through a guy or two. I have been dropped a couple of times by guys mad about it, but that's cool, I don't get to upset, I usually expect it. And I really don't mind if a guy makes a good d play and simply stands me up like Chadd said.

But, I won't hesitate to do any move or as the kids say, dangle.(except lacrossing the puck, be prepared to get nailed if you pull that in my men's league)

Speaking of Toe Drag, Last night Edmonton vs Atl, Hemsky did a drag on a guy it OT that made the d look like a child, I am just stunned when a guy can pull it off in the show like that. He might have the best drag in the league.

I agree...if some guy wants to stand me up; i'm completely fine with that. Even if he wants to step into me a little; I expect that during the game. I mean, if some guy drags around me, I'm more pissed off at myself for allowing that to happen; not at him.

However, I don't think hacking shins like a lumberjack or worse, tomahawking my stick is necessary. Bruises heal, but he's not the one that has to buy another $200 stick if it breaks. Even if it doesn't break at that moment, if he puts a stress crack in the shaft, the stick's done.