Difference in length - D vs EE width

[Hockeydog 8]

From experience I know that a Supreme skate in a EE width will add a bit of length to the same size skate in a D width ( 7.5 D slightly shorter than 7.5EE) My question is since the Flexlite is built on a wider last, would a 7.5 D Flexlite be the same length as a 7.5D Supreme of a 7.5EE Supreme, or something entirely different?

My motivation for asking is because I am in a 7.5EE Supreme to accommodate my forefoot, but the EE width heel is a bit bigger than optimum. Also in the EE width of the skate my toes never touch the cap, although they are close, whereas in the 7.5D Supreme the length was pretty spot on. My choices seem to be maybe seeing if a 7EE would work lengthwise or go with a Flexlite as the ankle fit is narrower. My LHS carries neither EE widths or many sizes in Flexlite so I'd have to ask them to order, which requires me to buy them up front and get store credit for unwanted merchandise. I don't need all the store credit I'd get if I had them order 2-3 pairs of skates, so trying to narrow down the possibilities as much as possible. Thanks for any input!

[Hockeydog 8]

Any help would be appreciated.

[mwerth 5]

From my experience, part of the reason the EE-width skate feels longer than the corresponding size in a D-width is due to the wider heel. Your foot is able to sit further back in the EE-width skate because of the extra room the added width creates.

I have no business telling you to buy anything, but in my case, I switched from D width to EE width and had to go down a half-size in length.

[Chadd 916]

No difference in length. As mentioned, you may feel it is bigger because your heel is able to move farther back in the boot.

[Law Goalie 147]

Exactly. The only other thing that can seem to cause a length difference between widths is that feet are flexible: if you squash one into too narrow a boot, and that boot is more rigid than the foot (as skates inevitably are) the foot actually gets longer. In short, wearing or even trying on too narrow a skate can give the impression that a 'longer' size is required. This is why the advice always given on MSH and through any credible fitter is to start oversized and work backwards to a point of discomfort, then go back up.

[elpresidente99 1]

I noticed the same things, now i`m in a vapor apx 9D because the 8,5D doesn't fit in length. The 8,5EE was too wide but fit lenghtwise perfect. The 9D have the perfect width for me. After braking them in i could say maybe i would fit in a 8,5 D because now i have a bit space but it is still perfect in size. So you have to expect that they get a little bit bigger after breaking in.

Greetz

[Hockeydog 8]

I'd like to thank all of you for sharing your wisdom. With the 7.5EE One70's I can squeeze my index finger between the back of my foot and the skate, when my foot is pushed to the toe cap. I think that is enough space to warrant having my ISP order a 7EE for me to try on. If I am not mistaken the heel width should go down ever so slightly going from a 7.5EE to a 7EE, as well as the forefoot width, both of which would be fine.

[althoma1 574]

D width and EE width skates of the same model are the same length. If your foot is fairly wide then the sides of your foot are compressed in the D width skates which is what makes the D width feel a bit shorter. As others have mentioned it could also be the bigger heel in the EE that allows your heel to sit further back.

I wouldn't count on the 7EE being that much narrower in the heel - if you have significant slop at the ankle in the 7.5EE then you may want to go with a skate that has a narrower ankle to begin with. I've worn Flexlites in the past and the forefoot in a D Flexlite is similar to an E or EE in other models, but the heel is still narrow. The best thing is of course to try them on in your size, but if that's not an option I'd lean toward the Flexlites if a wide forefoot and narrow heel is what you're after.

[Hockeydog 8]

Thanks althomal1 ! I don't have a lot of slop in the heel, but I do have to crank down pretty hard on the laces at the second from top eyelet to get a good heel lock. Some of that could be the bit of extra length? Based on what I have shared, would you suggest a 7D Flexlite or a 7.5D Flexlite?

Would the narrower heel push me to a 7.5? My LHS is not too swift, having originally fitted me in a 8D one70, so I'd rather be as clear as possible before I have to ask them to order anything they may not have in stock.

[jbss71 1]

Where are you? You might be better off wasting a tank of fuel and find a shop to try stuff on.

[Hockeydog 8]

I have thought about that. Almost visited the Hockeymonkey Superstore in NJ, but the other reason I was headed that way that was didn't materialize. I think with the help of youse guys I am getting close.

[althoma1 574]

Thanks althomal1 ! I don't have a lot of slop in the heel, but I do have to crank down pretty hard on the laces at the second from top eyelet to get a good heel lock. Some of that could be the bit of extra length? Based on what I have shared, would you suggest a 7D Flexlite or a 7.5D Flexlite?

Would the narrower heel push me to a 7.5? My LHS is not too swift, having originally fitted me in a 8D one70, so I'd rather be as clear as possible before I have to ask them to order anything they may not have in stock.

I'd try them on before buying them if it's remotely possible, but if you have to buy them site unseen I'd lean toward the 7D. Padding compresses when skates break in (I've had skates that felt a tad tight length wise feel perfect after breaking in) and you could also have them stretched if necessary. You can't make skates that are too big smaller.

Where are you? You might be better off wasting a tank of fuel and find a shop to try stuff on.

I agree with that - you'll save some grief and headaches in the end by going to a shop that already has the skates you want to try on in your size. That's your best bet.

Another option would be to order from somewhere like icewarehouse since it sounds like you're in the US and they offer free return shipping on skates within 7 days of receipt - you could order one size and swap them if it turned out to be the wrong size.

[Hockeydog 8]

Thanks again all! My LHS is getting in some Flexlites, will have a 7D in there for me.

[Hockeydog 8]

I actually measured how extra length I have in current skates. I have an extra 5/16th of an inch. I think I have read on MSH that a half size is

about 2/16th or 5/32nd of an inch. Is this enough to warrant dropping a half size? Waiting on Flexlites to get in LHS but also might have them order 7EE Supreme as I didn't have to deposit down on the Flexlites. Thanks!!

[Hockeydog 8]

Had to put this project on hold for the holidays, and I guess someone else wanted at size 7 Flexlite for Christmas ! No worries as I did have the LHS order a

7EE Supreme skate for me- since the Flexlites were to be in stock. Tried the 7EE Supremes on, a smidge tight in the forefoot, toe touching the cap when standing, grazing when knees bent. I think I am going to go for them, just wanted to clarify that once baked and broken in I'll get a bit more toe space. Thanks !!

[althoma1 574]

How is the heel? Any lift? You shouldn't have to crank the top two laces to avoid heel lift - tightening the 3rd and 4th laces to achieve a secure fit is fine (but you don't want to overdo it and end up with lacebite), but most people want some mobility in the ankle area at the top (at least I do...others tie it tight right to the top and even tape their ankles. I like to only gently snug up the top couple laces and others even skip an eyelet or two at the top).

Toes brushing the end with the knees bent is ideal and you'll get a little more room after they break in and the padding in the heel compresses. As for the forefoot, that area should expand enough if the pressure is minor when you bake them and break them in as long as it's before the toe cap - if the issue is with the toe cap itself that may not go away.

If there's no heel lift after walking around in the skates for a while and the forefoot pressure is before the cap then it sounds like they'll work well. If there is heel lift (or significant heel lift if you don't crank the second lace from the top like you were doing with the 7.5EE's) or the forefoot pressure is in the toe cap area then perhaps you want to wait to try on Flexlites.

[Hockeydog 8]

The heel on the 7EE is fine. Not much cranking is needed to lock my heels in. Any forfoot pressure is before the toecap, so I am good there as well. I can crank down hard on the laces and kill my forefoot, but a ligher touch with the lacing and the pressure is minor. Pencil test is good with the exception of right when the eylets go vertical, there it is on the edge but still passes. If I can try on a 7 Flexlite I will, but I think these may be the ticket ! Thank you for your help althomal1 !!

[Larry54 243]

D width and EE width skates of the same model are the same length. If your foot is fairly wide then the sides of your foot are compressed in the D width skates which is what makes the D width feel a bit shorter. As others have mentioned it could also be the bigger heel in the EE that allows your heel to sit further back.

I wouldn't count on the 7EE being that much narrower in the heel - if you have significant slop at the ankle in the 7.5EE then you may want to go with a skate that has a narrower ankle to begin with. I've worn Flexlites in the past and the forefoot in a D Flexlite is similar to an E or EE in other models, but the heel is still narrow. The best thing is of course to try them on in your size, but if that's not an option I'd lean toward the Flexlites if a wide forefoot and narrow heel is what you're after.

Then why do Bauer 7.5D skates have 263mm blades, and Bauer 7.5EE skates have 272mm blades? According to the Bauer chart, it's the same situation for all the 1/2 sizes. I thought it was because skates followed the same convention as shoes where EE width is not only wider but also around 1/4 size longer than D width.

[ArrogantOwl 7]

It may because due to the extra width of the skate, the holder and blades are re-positioned in comparison to the location of the boot which is why they may be longer.

[Hockeydog 8]

Just an update, I tried a 7D Flexlite on, was way to short! I ended up with a 7EE. Baked and skated a couple of times. Toes are not

pushed hard against the toecap but are more than just feathering when fully laced up and knees bent in skating position. No pain but feels like toes just can't quite stretch out completely in the boot, if that makes any sense. Hope with some more break in I'll get the bit more space I need.

[cooperalls 4]

Then why do Bauer 7.5D skates have 263mm blades, and Bauer 7.5EE skates have 272mm blades? According to the Bauer chart, it's the same situation for all the 1/2 sizes. I thought it was because skates followed the same convention as shoes where EE width is not only wider but also around 1/4 size longer than D width.

No, the width can also dictate the size holder that is put on a boot. In all likelihood, that 7.5D with the 263mm holder has a little exposed outsole at the toe and/or heel, but the rivet spacing required for the 272mm would cause the "bloom" of the steel rivet and the head of the copper rivet to contact the sidewall (or upper) of the skate, prohibiting its installation. For what it's worth, My Vapor XXXX 7.5EE skates came with 263mm holders/steel. There was enough length available on the outsole to accommodate a 272mm holder. I installed 272mm holders/steel without any issue. I think it recently became the convention to install the next size up holder on half-size, EE skates.

Also, I don't believe EE shoes (or skates) are 1/4 size longer than D width shoes. In terms of length, a 7.5D and a 7.5EE are identical. Feet are malleable. When I wore D width skates I wore a size 8, because the decreased width elongated my foot. An 8D fit properly in terms of length, but caused discomfort in my forefoot. When I went to a EE skate, I backed down in size to a 7.5. This is because my foot was allowed to spread out.

[DigDug 5]

Hah, Hockeydog, I know *exactly* how that toe situation feels. Its actually something that is really bothersome, until you forget about it.

[Hockeydog 8]

I 'll give it some time, hopefully the pocket will break in enough to give me the little bit of space I need. Not sure if the Supreme skate can be stretched but I have read that stretching sometimes is not a permenent fix and could be damaging to the skate. Thanks for the responses !

[Hockeydog 8]

I have been trying the 7EE and 7.5EE skates. Size 7 must be some breaking point in the Supreme line. The 7EE is just a bit too small and the

7.5EE provides a use-able fit, not quite too big, but not really a high performace fit either. Heel lock is good if I lace to the top on the 7.5EE and crank down on the top laces, but if I skip the top eyelet ( which I like for forward flex) I get a small amount of heel slip, again nothing un-useable, just not as good as it could be. I may drive around and find a CCM, Graf or Easton to try. Can anyone tell me if a CCM D with heel is

wider than a Supreme EE width heel?