Heel Lock - Help?

[IPv6Freely 2087]

I don't suggest anything because I don't even know what your feet look like.

(Please, no foot pics. I avoid those topics on general principle.) If we cross paths again I may make an assessment.

No problem. I'll just have to make these work for now.

[wrangler 157]

Maybe you can find a decent shop somewhere in your travels.

Yes, you're supposed to be able to stand up in your skates without pain.

[donkers 31]

The last time I got fitted for skates like 3 years ago I hit up the PIAS in Mira Mesa, the shop at SDIA, Monkey, and Hockey Giant all in one day. It was a long day but worth it to find the right skates in the right size. If you've looked at Grafs at all Jake's in LA has the best selection of Grafs in Southern California.

[giogolf 9]

Optimus, skate fitting is such a PITA.. That being said there are some good points made in this thread. I think the most important one is, unless your going full custom, fit the skate to the smallest foot, because you can stretch, punch, and lengthen your way to happiness in the other foot.

Combine that fitting mentality with pencil test, and understanding your foot dynamics. Know that actual size of your foot when bearing weight, know where you need width, how high your instep is, ankle width and shape.

Then start trying on everything, and I seriously mean everything... I spent 4 hours in Giant trying on all there models, even sub models as fit varies between the Nexus 1000,800,etc...

I think fitting is definitely an art as well, you need to understand that the perfect fit doesn't start out after you first lace your skates up in the store.. We need to consider what will give in the baking process and what will continue to give as you play in them.

I know its to late now if you are sticking with these skates so hopefully you find a trick that makes these skates work.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

Optimus, skate fitting is such a PITA.. That being said there are some good points made in this thread. I think the most important one is, unless your going full custom, fit the skate to the smallest foot, because you can stretch, punch, and lengthen your way to happiness in the other foot.

Yea I understand that premise. That unfortunately means I have to try another model altogether, since it's not something that can be fixed with size alone (if the length is right, width is right, but heel width isnt right, a size change in that model isnt going to help me).

What brand/models have narrow heels? RBK, Nexus, and Supreme are all out. I'd be looking at the $300 range (the exception to that being the Mako - if that fits, then that's what I'm getting).

[giogolf 9]

That's a tough one, they are all so different.. The Supreme are a anatomical fit, which are straight tapered through the forefoot, but tighter in the ankle. You mentioned you had poor heel lock in the Supreme when you tried them on.. This could be because they are a stiffer skate and the ankle wasn't accepting your heel as it would when they get baked or broken in. The Nexus is an all around softer boot that gets stiffer as you go up the line but still softer than most of the Supreme line.

When I tried on the Supreme, I could barley make the eyelets budge when first lacing them they were so stiff.

Reebok tend to have average to wide everything, compared to Nexus line the Nexus is much deeper and much wider with a slightly tighter ankle.

The other problem I see is the microfiber and or cloth type liners can get slippery for some people... The liner in my old 14Ks where cloth and didn't grip well, the clarino in my Nexus feel like leather and grab more.

Another thing to note, the Nexus are so voluminous and cushy that if there is extra room or volume somewhere it will be amplified after they get worn in.

My feet on the Bauer measuring stick are 7.5 and 7.9... I ended up with a size 7E in a Nexus 800.. I was pushing the toe cap significantly when fitting, but not to the point where my toes bent. After baking both feet brush the toe cap nicely.

[wrangler 157]

Go try on a bunch, even the expensive stuff, to get an idea. You may even decide that a great fit is worth more money, even if it's not a Mako. Especially if you find a fit in a skate where the prior year's model is on closeout.

Getting the best fit won't just improve your skating, it will take care of your feet.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

Go try on a bunch, even the expensive stuff, to get an idea. You may even decide that a great fit is worth more money, even if it's not a Mako. Especially if you find a fit in a skate where the prior year's model is on closeout.

Getting the best fit won't just improve your skating, it will take care of your feet.

I don't care so much about the money thing - happy to shell out the money for well fitting skates. The limit I mentioned was just because this is really starting to get expensive, since I really don't know if a skate fits me until I'm on the ice.

I've been disappointed every time I've made the trip up there. The stock is terrible and the people don't seem to care. I'll try the ankle booties and the socks i just ordered first, maybe they'll be just enough to fix the issues.

[wrangler 157]

Then don't go there; go elsewhere.

I would think that a good fit is out there for you, and it's just a question of finding some good shops. If you really want it, it can take an investment in driving time, at home, and maybe on the road, but your feet will thank you for it. A shop that will bake them, and let you return them if they don't work for you, would be nice.

The stuff you're trying is kludges, and I would not expect it to be as good as a skate fitted to your foot.

[giogolf 9]

I don't care so much about the money thing - happy to shell out the money for well fitting skates. The limit I mentioned was just because this is really starting to get expensive, since I really don't know if a skate fits me until I'm on the ice.

I've been disappointed every time I've made the trip up there. The stock is terrible and the people don't seem to care. I'll try the ankle booties and the socks i just ordered first, maybe they'll be just enough to fix the issues.

This is probably crazy talk and will go against everything I said as well as everyone else in this thread, but... If one boot fits perfect, and you haven't broken the bank on these, maybe see if a shoemaker can add some extra fabric in the heel of problem skate...

This will void your warranty, and could ruin your skate, but, if done right and stitched in the stiff areas I could work.. I have seen pro skates stitch extra crap to the outside of their skates before... why not the inside.

[Chadd 916]

This is probably crazy talk and will go against everything I said as well as everyone else in this thread, but... If one boot fits perfect, and you haven't broken the bank on these, maybe see if a shoemaker can add some extra fabric in the heel of problem skate...

This will void your warranty, and could ruin your skate, but, if done right and stitched in the stiff areas I could work.. I have seen pro skates stitch extra crap to the outside of their skates before... why not the inside.

If I were going to do something like that, i would take a thin layer of memory foam and glue it in.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

Then don't go there; go elsewhere.

I would think that a good fit is out there for you, and it's just a question of finding some good shops. If you really want it, it can take an investment in driving time, at home, and maybe on the road, but your feet will thank you for it. A shop that will bake them, and let you return them if they don't work for you, would be nice.

The stuff you're trying is kludges, and I would not expect it to be as good as a skate fitted to your foot.

Yea, I'll try to find shops when I travel. It's not easy though.

If I were going to do something like that, i would take a thin layer of memory foam and glue it in.

That might be an option if the Stable26 socks don't work out for me.

[Jordan 13]

No insole is going to make your heel wider, I really don't understand why people always suggest insoles for width issues

If your heel is slipping due to width, that is clearly the case.

If your heel is slipping because the curve of your heel is shollow relative to the heel pocket, then insoles can help.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

I can see if your heel and ankles arent sitting quite right, a footbed MIGHT move your foot to the right spot. But definitely not the case here.

I took out the superfeet and the pain i had in my feed on the outside (where the heel meets the outer foot) went away. When you compare the superfeet to the stock Nexus insoles, its really easy to see why it was causing discomfort. The superfeet are MUCH wider, and likely cramping my feet.

So as a quick note... I just tried one of the ezeefit ankle booties on under my skate socks, and put my skate on and tied it up.

I wasnt able to make my heel slip, no matter how hard i tried. I guess that's a positive sign. Will try on the ice hopefully soon.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

Sounds like the Superfeet were not the correct size or not trimmed properly for the skate?

[hunt3rsean 44]

I have purchased the Stable 26 socks and am still currently using them. They are on the expensive side but fixed my issue with heal lock. It took 3 or 4 tries with the different thickness inserts but I have them dialed in now. Very happy with them and they are very comfortable. My issue is I got too excited and jumped into a pair of skates before trying additional models. But, they were lower on the cost scale so I'm going to be going on a fitting sprenzy this summer (since I have skates that are working right now) and take the proper time to fit. I'm happy with the skates/sock combo and it's fixed any heal raise issues, but I'd like to have a pair of skates that don't need that "bandaid" feature to make them work right.

[stick9 881]

Yea I understand that premise. That unfortunately means I have to try another model altogether, since it's not something that can be fixed with size alone (if the length is right, width is right, but heel width isnt right, a size change in that model isnt going to help me).

What brand/models have narrow heels? RBK, Nexus, and Supreme are all out. I'd be looking at the $300 range (the exception to that being the Mako - if that fits, then that's what I'm getting).

Try an older Easton, like an S12 or S17. I can't say whether or not they will fit you, just that it's a pretty narrow heel with exceptional heel lock. Heel lock has always been sort of hit or miss with me until I got a pair of Eastons.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

Sounds like the Superfeet were not the correct size or not trimmed properly for the skate?

Theyre the right length for trim, but I dont think I can trim the SIDES of the superfeet to make them thinner, can i?

Heres superfeet beside the Nexus footbed:

The pain I was having was right on this spot (not my foot):

Taking the superfeet out and using the stock insoles, I've had no issues since I've done that. I honestly think the superfeet just took up too much volume and it was cramping my foot.

[Davetronz 109]

Theyre the right length for trim, but I dont think I can trim the SIDES of the superfeet to make them thinner, can i?

Heres superfeet beside the Nexus footbed:

Based on the footprint on your Superfeet and the fact that you're saying the Superfeet are sized/cut properly for the length of your skate, your skates are too big. At least half a size, maybe a full size.

I'd look at possibly punching some spots at the front of your skate once you're in the proper size, but I'd assume that when you're putting on a skate that is your actual correct size you're feeling that the width up front isn't sufficient enough and confusing it for improper length. From there you're compensating to a larger size to get a bit more width in the areas that are causing you discomfort. This is causing your foot to move forward in the skate and loss of heel lock.

[JR Boucicaut 3760]

I'm agreeing with Davetronz here - I don't like to play the insole game when it comes to measuring skates (as it could fit in several sizes of skates), but if both heel cups are level with the edge of the table there, you can see that the stock insole is bigger than the Superfeet.

It's fairly common for those to compensate for lack of width by going into a bigger skate, and that creates a myriad of problems.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

That would explain a pain in the bottom of the foot as it would pull on the arch area and cause an issue even with Superfeet. If the ball of the foot is in the wrong spot its in the wrong spot.

I to agree with the above.!

[IPv6Freely 2087]

Hmm okay, I wouldnt say it was really compensating per se. I always thought your toes should touch the end of the toe box when standing straight up, but pull away slightly when the knees are bent. Is this wrong?

Davetronz, you say "From there you're compensating to a larger size to get a bit more width in the areas that are causing you discomfort." but I'm not going to a larger size to get more width in areas causing me discomfort. I don't get discomfort from width (unless I tie my skates up tight, in which case they go numb).

So while it may be true that im in skates that are too big, I dont like the wording being used because it makes it sound like i sized up because i had width issues - because that's not what happened. It's not like I said "this isnt wide enough, give me a bigger skate". I put on skates until what i mentioned a few sentences ago is true, assuming that that was the correct size. Thats what the people in the stores keep telling me is correct so I had no reason to assume otherwise.

You also mention my foot moving forward... I don't feel that at all. Just up and down. Basically the easiest way to re-create the lack of heel lock is to extend my leg straight out, and then try to point my toes straight out. I feel slippage in my right skate, but none in my left.

Keep in mind the footprint on the superfeet is likely where my foot is while in a hockey stance, and not where it is when standing up.

[JR Boucicaut 3760]

Wow.

I've never seen anyone take such offense to someone's assessment when all they're trying to do is help them out.

I'm ducking out of this one. I wish you luck in finding your optimal fit.

[wrangler 157]

I think you're hearing sense from these guys. They've got a lot of experience, and have read a lot of footprints before looking at yours. Even to my inexperienced eye, it looks like not enough width, and too much length, in the boot. Realize that your perceptions in the fitting process may not necessarily reflect exactly what was really happening.

Get fitted.

[IPv6Freely 2087]

There was no offense taken, I just wanted to make sure everyone understood the situation. It's not like I'm arguing with the advice being given or something. But when you have multiple people telling me I went up a size because the width was bad when that's not the case, I have to correct them.

The size may be wrong, but not because I didn't like the width.

Now, how do you determine the right size, if not in the way the people fitting me are saying?