Balsillie's Back

[shotty 7]

^ you never know. the only reason why the nhl has put a bid forward is so they can sell the team on their own terms. so if they want to charge a $250 million relocation fee, they can, without redfield t. baum getting in the way ;)

[JR Boucicaut 3759]

BBY's getting old.

Part 1

Uhm, not really.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...X-c0I8IHNMSaldA

Part 2

"They obviously don't want Jim as a partner; plain and simple! They will foot the bill as long as they need to in order to keep him out. Remember, this whole thing is ego driven on both sides."

Behind every big ego in this game is a bigger wallet. I can imagine the NHL buys the Coyotes, sells them to JB for $500 million under extremely strict conditions, he gets his team and moves them to Hamilton, and the NHL gets what they want, which is more money. In this saga, anything is truly possible...............

They're still selling phones due to inundation of the market (every wireless carrier carries their phones whereas Apple's on AT&T, Android/Google are on T-Mobile and Palm's on Sprint) but the technology is starting to pass them by. They do well in the business sector because of the security of their network. Hell, they can't even make a decent touch-screen phone.

[ktang 34]

BBY's getting old.

Part 1

Uhm, not really.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...X-c0I8IHNMSaldA

Part 2

"They obviously don't want Jim as a partner; plain and simple! They will foot the bill as long as they need to in order to keep him out. Remember, this whole thing is ego driven on both sides."

Behind every big ego in this game is a bigger wallet. I can imagine the NHL buys the Coyotes, sells them to JB for $500 million under extremely strict conditions, he gets his team and moves them to Hamilton, and the NHL gets what they want, which is more money. In this saga, anything is truly possible...............

NHL buys the Coyotes, but the NHL also runs the officials.

So, the NHL gets the Coyotes into the playoffs, and then the NHL gets them into the Stanley Cup Finals. The NHL gets the Coyotes to win in quadruple-OT in Game 7. Phoenix goes nuts over the Coyotes (a la Cardinals), and the NHL sells the team at a profit (that goes to the other 29 owners) to a non-Balsillie group that will keep the Coyotes in Phoenix. This saves Bettman.

[DarkStar50 679]

BBY's getting old.

Part 1

Uhm, not really.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...X-c0I8IHNMSaldA

Part 2

"They obviously don't want Jim as a partner; plain and simple! They will foot the bill as long as they need to in order to keep him out. Remember, this whole thing is ego driven on both sides."

Behind every big ego in this game is a bigger wallet. I can imagine the NHL buys the Coyotes, sells them to JB for $500 million under extremely strict conditions, he gets his team and moves them to Hamilton, and the NHL gets what they want, which is more money. In this saga, anything is truly possible...............

They're still selling phones due to inundation of the market (every wireless carrier carries their phones whereas Apple's on AT&T, Android/Google are on T-Mobile and Palm's on Sprint) but the technology is starting to pass them by. They do well in the business sector because of the security of their network. Hell, they can't even make a decent touch-screen phone.

The touch screen phone is not their niche. When you own 56% of the market, that leaves yours competitors splitting and fighting over the other 44%. Kind of like what Bauer has done in hockey. B)

It's easy to name 5 teams already losing big bucks, that have no interest in paying out to fight this fight. Those teams have enough trouble financially inside their own house. ;)

[cptjeff 0]

BBY's getting old.

Part 1

Uhm, not really.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...X-c0I8IHNMSaldA

Part 2

"They obviously don't want Jim as a partner; plain and simple! They will foot the bill as long as they need to in order to keep him out. Remember, this whole thing is ego driven on both sides."

Behind every big ego in this game is a bigger wallet. I can imagine the NHL buys the Coyotes, sells them to JB for $500 million under extremely strict conditions, he gets his team and moves them to Hamilton, and the NHL gets what they want, which is more money. In this saga, anything is truly possible...............

NHL buys the Coyotes, but the NHL also runs the officials.

So, the NHL gets the Coyotes into the playoffs, and then the NHL gets them into the Stanley Cup Finals. The NHL gets the Coyotes to win in quadruple-OT in Game 7. Phoenix goes nuts over the Coyotes (a la Cardinals), and the NHL sells the team at a profit (that goes to the other 29 owners) to a non-Balsillie group that will keep the Coyotes in Phoenix. This saves Bettman.

I really hope you're not serious.

[hockeyherb 1]

BBY's getting old.

Part 1

Uhm, not really.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...X-c0I8IHNMSaldA

Part 2

"They obviously don't want Jim as a partner; plain and simple! They will foot the bill as long as they need to in order to keep him out. Remember, this whole thing is ego driven on both sides."

Behind every big ego in this game is a bigger wallet. I can imagine the NHL buys the Coyotes, sells them to JB for $500 million under extremely strict conditions, he gets his team and moves them to Hamilton, and the NHL gets what they want, which is more money. In this saga, anything is truly possible...............

They're still selling phones due to inundation of the market (every wireless carrier carries their phones whereas Apple's on AT&T, Android/Google are on T-Mobile and Palm's on Sprint) but the technology is starting to pass them by. They do well in the business sector because of the security of their network. Hell, they can't even make a decent touch-screen phone.

The touch screen phone is not their niche. When you own 56% of the market, that leaves yours competitors splitting and fighting over the other 44%. Kind of like what Bauer has done in hockey. B)

It's easy to name 5 teams already losing big bucks, that have no interest in paying out to fight this fight. Those teams have enough trouble financially inside their own house. ;)

Besides, they're apparently doing all this because Toronto (and to a lesser extent Buffalo) are digging their heels in to protect their territory. The 'character' issues could just be a convenient cover to distract from their illegal territorial rights provision.

Balsille: Leafs are standing in the way

Let's get real, if Al Davis can own an NFL franchise and they somehow manage to be a highly successful league anyway, what harm could Balsillie do?

[Chadd 916]

Let's get real, if Al Davis can own an NFL franchise and they somehow manage to be a highly successful league anyway, what harm could Balsillie do?

The team share of the NFL National TV contract covers each teams salary cap commitment. For years the only team in the NFL that lost money was the Ravens and I think even they turn a profit now.

[hockeyherb 1]

Let's get real, if Al Davis can own an NFL franchise and they somehow manage to be a highly successful league anyway, what harm could Balsillie do?

The team share of the NFL National TV contract covers each teams salary cap commitment. For years the only team in the NFL that lost money was the Ravens and I think even they turn a profit now.

The NFL is definitely the jewel of sports leagues now but I guess my point is that if that league can be so successful with one owner who is a living zombie determined to torpedo that franchise for eternity how bad could Balsillie be for the NHL? He's probably got more money than most other owners too so he can stick it out a lot longer.

More on the coming NHL vs. the Leafs battle. I'm really starting to believe this is what it's coming down to - not "anyone but Balsillie" but rather "anywhere but Southern Ontario"

Next Fight Could Be NHL vs. Leafs

[Chadd 916]

Let's get real, if Al Davis can own an NFL franchise and they somehow manage to be a highly successful league anyway, what harm could Balsillie do?

The team share of the NFL National TV contract covers each teams salary cap commitment. For years the only team in the NFL that lost money was the Ravens and I think even they turn a profit now.

The NFL is definitely the jewel of sports leagues now but I guess my point is that if that league can be so successful with one owner who is a living zombie determined to torpedo that franchise for eternity how bad could Balsillie be for the NHL? He's probably got more money than most other owners too so he can stick it out a lot longer.

More on the coming NHL vs. the Leafs battle. I'm really starting to believe this is what it's coming down to - not "anyone but Balsillie" but rather "anywhere but Southern Ontario"

Next Fight Could Be NHL vs. Leafs

If he refuses to follow the rules now, do you expect him to respect the salary cap? What about putting someone in the lineup that was never officially called up? While the NHL teams compete against each other, it's also a partnership. At least 26 NHL owners don't feel he would make a good partner. If the NYc area can support three teams, why can't Toronto support two? It makes sense to me, I just don't think JB is going to be the guy to move there.

[shotty 7]

Let's get real, if Al Davis can own an NFL franchise and they somehow manage to be a highly successful league anyway, what harm could Balsillie do?

The team share of the NFL National TV contract covers each teams salary cap commitment. For years the only team in the NFL that lost money was the Ravens and I think even they turn a profit now.

thats insane.

[hockeyherb 1]

My feeling though, Chadd, is that the NHL is just doing everything they can to avoid a showdown with MLSE in Southern Ontario. It's going to take a pushy, deep pocketed guy who won't take no for an answer like Balsillie to get another team in that area.

I think a lot of people assume that if the NHL buys the Coyotes the next step is they sell to Reinsdorf and he moves the team to Kansas City or some other US location so they can avoid that showdown. I'd be willing to bet that this has all been pre-planned and coordinated by the NHL and Reisndorf already and how Bettman was able to sell purchasing the Coyotes to the rest of the owners. I doubt given the crappy level of financials of so many teams they would have signed on if there wasn't some promise to flip the team fairly quickly in advance.

Here's a comment by a guy who runs a great fantasy hockey site out of Ontario. (His last comment about billionaires is a head scratcher however.)

http://www.dobberhockey.com/index.php?opti...tid=24:rambling

"Excellent article by James Mirtle, found here, regarding the little-reported fact (I know it's "allegation", but I'M saying that it is "fact") that the Leafs are standing in the way of any sale. As I've been saying since the Nashville sale attempts, the Leafs are the powerhouse behind stopping him. They don't say a word and they pull their long, thick strings with the Toronto media as a "favor" to play down their involvement or stay away from the story entirely, but it is the MLSE's greed putting a stop to any move - and they'll keep doing it until a team actually arrives in Southern Ontario. The entire thing is happening behind the scenes, so MLSE looks like angels to many, but mark my words - the MLSE is the most powerful organization in the NHL and not only will Gary Bettman do whatever he can to please them, I think he's literally frightened of the consequences of failure. MLSE won't stand for a move and they carry a big stick. And the funny thing is - the Leafs would profit from a move. Like the Yankees vs. Mets, a Leafs vs. Hamilton rivalry would take hockey to new heights - not just driving up television earnings, but merchandise sales. But that's why billionaires boast only average intelligence and above-average luck: they can't see the forest through the trees. Dinosaurs. They'll die off and the forward-thinkers will take over. Eventually."

[DarkStar50 679]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/hock...article1270136/

MLSE has tons of power and is just sitting back.

[hockeyherb 1]

How many Tums per hour do you think Bettman is consuming?

He's caught in the middle of this coming epic battle of MLSE lawyers vs. Balsillie lawyers. Time to do a Greenspan and duck out before his reputation is ruined....oh too late!

[Chadd 916]

While I don't dispute that MLSE doesn't want another team in Toronto. I think that is farther down the list of issues. Another team in southern Ontario does nothing to improve the reach of the league or exposure to new fans/markets.

[DarkStar50 679]

While I don't dispute that MLSE doesn't want another team in Toronto. I think that is farther down the list of issues. Another team in southern Ontario does nothing to improve the reach of the league or exposure to new fans/markets.

Sorry Chadd, but could we put those two ideas to bed? A. the league has already "reached" too far, just look at the sorry state of Atlanta, Florida, NYI, among others; and B. new fans are not out there, they are playing with their xbox and you have to admit in this economy, there are no new markets to cultivate. So, here sits Hamilton and southern Ontario, with fans ready to support an NHL team of their own. Why not? MLSE doesn't want another team just in Toronto. They don't want another team anywhere near them. And now, it seems like they have the power to tell Bettman just that.

[RiSeOnFiRe 0]

While I don't dispute that MLSE doesn't want another team in Toronto. I think that is farther down the list of issues. Another team in southern Ontario does nothing to improve the reach of the league or exposure to new fans/markets.

Sorry Chadd, but could we put those two ideas to bed? A. the league has already "reached" too far, just look at the sorry state of Atlanta, Florida, NYI, among others; and B. new fans are not out there, they are playing with their xbox and you have to admit in this economy, there are no new markets to cultivate. So, here sits Hamilton and southern Ontario, with fans ready to support an NHL team of their own. Why not? MLSE doesn't want another team just in Toronto. They don't want another team anywhere near them. And now, it seems like they have the power to tell Bettman just that.

I cant speak for Atl and Fla, but living on LI, theres a good amount of buzz about the Islanders this year. The place went nuts during the draft, had a HUGE public rally for the Lighthouse project thats closer than ever to being approved. Lets not forget they had one of the few true dynasties in the league. I wouldnt lump them into the same group as Atl, Fla or Pho. Sorry for the little rant haha.

I would agree with Darkstar, there is no where else to expand to. The next step would be to Europe and that wouldnt happen. I dont see Phoenix having a turnaround anytime soon. They're young kids have not yet stepped up, and the next draft is pretty weak. They wont be making any money in Phoenix for at least the next 7 years. And at the rate they're loosing money, what like 30 mil a season? I dont know how anyone could swallow that. I see Phoenix like an open wound. Does the league risk bleeding out? Id rather them move to Hamilton, where regardless of the on ice product they'll turn a profit. Thats of coarse a simple way of looking at it. Unfortunatly legalities make it retardedly complex.

[DarkStar50 679]

Hopefully, the Islanders can start to turn it around. It's just that the owner is losing money like crazy and the Nassau Mausoleum is 40 years old.

I like your description of the Coyotes as an open wound.

[saba 0]

and I'm not convinced moving to Hamilton in the long term is going to make money either. After an initial buy up and having to live in the salary cap world how is Hamilton going to make coin in a very diluted market. Leafs, Sabers, Ham will all be fighting out for the same fans, merchandise etc..Combine that with a possible non-winning team convince me that a new Ham team besides having a rich owner will be seeing coin more than any other mid wrung middling franchise.

One more thing to think about PHO is now the 4th most largest cosmo area in the US. Ask the NFL how they feel about not being in the LA market? OBTW Phoenix is very compatible with the LA/Vegs/PHX market

[chippa13 1844]

While I don't dispute that MLSE doesn't want another team in Toronto. I think that is farther down the list of issues. Another team in southern Ontario does nothing to improve the reach of the league or exposure to new fans/markets.

Sorry Chadd, but could we put those two ideas to bed? A. the league has already "reached" too far, just look at the sorry state of Atlanta, Florida, NYI, among others; and B. new fans are not out there, they are playing with their xbox and you have to admit in this economy, there are no new markets to cultivate. So, here sits Hamilton and southern Ontario, with fans ready to support an NHL team of their own. Why not? MLSE doesn't want another team just in Toronto. They don't want another team anywhere near them. And now, it seems like they have the power to tell Bettman just that.

Reach takes time to build at the grassroots. Players born in the likes of California and Florida are now being drafted. I have made this statement ad nauseum but it doesn't seem to sink in. Give the struggling areas a competitive team for a few years and watch the market take off. Nobody wants to embrace a perennial cellar dweller at NHL prices.

[DarkStar50 679]

The Panthers were in the Cup Finals. Then what happened? The Caps were in the Cup Finals. Then what happened? Buffalo was in the Cup Finals. Then what happened? Tampa Bay won the Cup. Then the NHL had a lockout and Tampa's GM spent his payroll money on three players. Poof Tampa Bay.

Let's agree to disagree.

[chippa13 1844]

Everyone likes to skip the part about competitive for a FEW YEARS. Florida went to the finals and has made the playoffs maybe twice since. Tampa went from winning the cup to the basement in short order. Buffalo had an owner indicted for something or other. The Caps were the same as Florida's story. Notice the buzz about Washington these days, though.

[Chadd 916]

Everyone likes to skip the part about competitive for a FEW YEARS. Florida went to the finals and has made the playoffs maybe twice since. Tampa went from winning the cup to the basement in short order. Buffalo had an owner indicted for something or other. The Caps were the same as Florida's story. Notice the buzz about Washington these days, though.

Hell, the Penguins couldn't give away tickets barely a decade after their last cup win.

[DarkStar50 679]

I believe hockey registration numbers are down in Canada and the USA the last few years among youth players.

We are unofficially taking a break in this thread about JB until tomorrow's latest court room decision. Just thought I'd mention it.

[chippa13 1844]

I'm sure the economy has a little something to say about that. If you're scrimping do you enroll little Johnny in hockey for $1,000 a season or basketball for $50?

[Chadd 916]

Over the last few years, USA Hockey has masked the decline in male players by promoting the increase in female players and by extorting rinks into forcing adult leagues into USAH registration.