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Interesting topic & discussion, just want to drop 2 anecdotes I've encountered over my years and how they relate: Years back I was dealing with some awful hip pain that lead me to an orthopedist by the name of Brian Busconi, you know you're in the right spot when your doctor has a HockeyDB page and a Harvard Hockey Jersey in his office, notta big deal. After we got done with the pleasantries of going with PT instead of any surgery he actually asked me about what brand and model skate I was using. The interesting thing about that question is I was only 6 months or so out from making the switch from a pair of pro stock Bauer 1000 old school leather skates to the recently released Bauer APX skates. The doc said the first thing I wanted to do was go back and find another pair of Bauer 1000s or at the very least buy one of the lower end pairs of Bauers that would not be as stiff as the APX I was using. He began discussing all of the negatives that go along with the stiffness of the newly designed skates and how he sees younger and younger players with Knee, hip, & ankle issues. Long story short, went out and found some pro-stock tech mesh vapors and after making that switch and some PT, no more hip pain. Another tangential topic that I think applies here is a chat I had was with Wayne up at Zwickers once upon a time. I think we were talking about the work he used to do for Paul Coffey and then somehow started talking about Kevin Lowe and how he used the 2-piece hinged Microns and Bauer plastic boots forever. Wayne said there was an internal battle at Bauer about continuing the R&D on those 2-piece boots and although all of their research showed them to perform better they just didn't sell and that was the end of them.

This is mostly on point. The basic principles of Graf fit are the breakdown of the numbers. If it's a three digit number, the first number refers to the quality of the skate line. The higher the number the better quality skate. In addition to this, any skate that begins with a G is equivalent to a 7 and would be a top of the line skate. I believe there is such a thing as an F, and that would be a drop below top of the line. So a 7/G would be a top end skate, a 6 or 5 or F would be a lower level skate. This number has nothing to do with fit. The second number is the heel fit, with 0 being standard and then increasing fit a wider heel. The final number is the forefoot fit, with 3 being the narrowest and least coming overall and 9 being the widest and deepest overall. In addition to all of this, there are 3 width options: Narrow, Regular and Wide. So the numbers are basically the fit profile dimensions, and then they can take those same proportions into 3 different widths. So you can have x03, x05, x07, x09, x35, x55 etc. In terms of fit, and the x will vary depending on the level of the skate. And then you can mix in the width options. The peakspeed line fits like a 735 imo. 7 would be top end, 3 means a bit wider heel, 5 is a standard forefoot width. The depth is a bit more than a 703. This will fit similar to a Vapor in a wider width than D. The Classics fit as above. The G9000 I don't know about because the only way to see them is to special order from Switzerland. My shop offered to do it, but only if I guarantee that I will buy them. Obviously there's no chance I'm going to buy a skate sight unseen, so yeah, can't speak to that. G7 is the same fit as a 707. I would say this is like a Supreme E or EE, where a 709 might be closer to a Nexus. The G7 has a comp quarter package though, inline the 707 which is the standard leather style. If you're in a Vapor D then you'll probably do best in a 703, assuming the Vapor is a good fit. You might also like a 735 or a 705.

The point of lateral support is correct imo. Good technique makes lateral support relatively unimportant for skating, but hockey skating doesn't happen in a vacuum, so that lateral support definitely helps for collisions and potential injuries. Those are not usually the result of poor technique, but of contact and accidents. Regarding the hinge on a boot, Graf 707s and Ultra G7s offer the same thing without looking like absolute dust... For those who are interested.

I remember having those eyelets with the small thin laces on the tendon guards. They added no support whatsoever. I think their purpose was to keep the tendon guard against the tendon. And with all this talk about maintaining lateral support while having forward flex, one could argue that lateral support is not that necessay if you have proper skating technique, though it might still be good to limit lateral movement just enough to prevent injury. 🤔

One of the reasons Graf struggled(s). The model differences are not as clear cut as they are for CCM and Bauer. Taking a look at their current website, it looks like they've significantly narrowed their retail selection from what it was pre-bankruptcy. I'm no expert, but pretty knowledgeable. Hopefully if I am way off on my assessment, someone will chime in to correct me. Peakspeed: a pretty standard medium fit. Probably most similar to a Supreme. Their answer to the modern skate. Difference in models are mostly about features and spec. I don't think there are differences in fit. Not sure how moldable they are compared to the current leaders in that area (True, CCM), but back in the day Graf was known for good reaction to the molding process to get a nice "custom" fit as long as you were in a boot shape that was pretty close to what your foot needed. Classic: G755,703,709 - softer classic boots. 703 I believe is the narrowest (similar to Vapor), 755 in the middle, and 709 the widest (closest to a Nexus). I'm in a pair of 535 wide, which are a step down but closest to the 755 and its predecessor the 735. In my experience these have a narrower heel and wider forefoot compared to a "medium all over" fit. Prior to the 535 I was in a Vapor EE, which had similar narrow heel, but I needed the EE width to get my forefoot comfortable and still needed to do some punch outs. G9000: medium-ish fit, similar to the old G75 and G75 lite, which were Grafs first carbon fiber quarter package skates. Stiff (for a Graf) and beefer. I have a pair of the G75 lite as well, and the forefoot is pretty similar to my 535, with more depth/volume around the heel and across the ankle joint. Heel pocket is wider and the ankle padding is denser. The 535 really grabs my foot around the heel, the G75 lite really grabs my foot around the achilles tendon and lower calf. G7: not too sure on fit, but it does look like this model has the upper eyelets of the boot "hinged" to allow better forward flexion. Construction of the boot looks to be more inline with the classic series.

The "implication" is (you should argue what is explicitly stated vs. what you deem is implied but I digress) is that dropping an eyelet provides forward flexion which is impeded by todays very stiff skate and forward ankle flexion is beneficial to good skating. Period. Other discussions are tangential to that point.

Look how long mike gartner's record for fastest skater stood for.

Some people should reread before they hit Submit.

There’s way to many people out there that are using the wrong skates for them.

So many people missed out on the Easton Mako skates. We are loyalists though so I can understand. If it weren't for my desire to randomly change things up, I would've missed out how well the Makos worked for me. It was the first time I really didn't over-tighten my laces and, as a result, I felt much more comfortable skating.

Guilty Once you start dropping eyelets. To me you've basically admitted your skates are too stiff. Not poo-pooing the value of some of these tips. They have their place. I mean, they wouldn't exist if they didn't offer some sort of value, perceived or otherwise. It's not for everyone and some aspects can be addressed by switching hardware. A softer boot or ditching those waxed Elite laces will help with forward flexion. Adding some custom insoles for proper heel and arch support. If you want to dig a little deeper you can see if your holders are aligned and shimmed to met your specific needs. I always said, it's not the hammer, it's the carpenter. Well, that's a total crock. The hardware matters.

One of the reasons I will ride my Nexus V-cuts (Tech Mesh) into their grave is that skates today are too stiff. I need that forward flex and when I have demoed the newer, ultra stiff skates, I can't skate in them at all.

Lange was ahead of its time. Using ski boot technology for stiffness, but incorporating a hinge to allow for some forward flex.