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flip12
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Everything posted by flip12
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There's that video where SVH talks about modifying Blake Wheeler's boot in that spot to accommodate his tight turning radius. Maybe the new toe cap design improves on that problem area? It seems to be right where the arrow portion of it extends over to the side of the boot.
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Is it the forefoot that's touching when you bottom out?
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Any idea what it was you didn't like about the CXN?
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Ah, I missed that part about the shims moving on his old Supremes. I'm pretty sure heel lifts don't need to move like that. Maybe a different place could install them. But, yeah, in that case, I can see why you want to find a holder with the pitch built in. Cobras are another option, but they're not as popular.
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Right! OrrSmith, don't chose the boot for pitch. Think of the pitch on the boot as it comes off the shelf as though it were a "suggested serving" like you see on a cereal box or something. You can eat it with those things if you like, but if you want to go a different direction, that's entirely possible. Essentially: pick the boot for what fits your son's feet best. From what I think I remember you posting in other threads, he was ok with the Mako, but now the boots are too shallow for his feet. If he wants to go back to Supremes because he prefers the more traditional feeling of that kind of boot compared to the Mako, then go with those. If he actually prefers the feeling (and by "feeling" I mean the ride/skating-experience) of the Mako and just wishes they were deeper, then VH might be a more satisfactory solution. Since they're tailored rather than ready-to-wear, it's possible to have a similar feeling boot with the right volume. It's really no problem to swap holders or install heel lifts, change the pitch of the steel, and so on.
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I'm curious because I really liked the past-vert vamping on my Mission roller boots from 20-years ago and from looking at Cruikshank's prototype skate in the making of the Mako video, it appears the boot has roughly the same forward angle as 55-flex, and it looks a lot more aggressive than the standard VH-cut. Edit: on looking at it with 55-flex in mind, it's more that the whole boot is tilted forward, the achilles area as well as the vamping, so it's not a perfect analogue.
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Nothing wrong with your reading, I take the blame on that one, I wrote it very sloppily and ambiguously. I saw how I made it out to be when I reread it I've been focused on art detail work all day, so my language brain has been all over the place.
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55-Flex: From, http://www.55flex.com/ to their webshop, http://55flex.catalystbiz.com/index.php?route=product/product&filter_name=flex&product_id=53 it says it's unavailable at the moment.
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I've been considering 55-flex on my MLX (which apparently aren't available on the company site at the moment). If I can afford to, I'll probably order some VH in the next few months. I'm just trying to figure out ahead of time what kinds of modifications I may be interested in.
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Afinogenov sticking with VH, and going full-retro-vapor in the boots' custom dress: Also, I'm curious, has anyone inquired about extra vamping at the top two eyelets, a la 55-flex?
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Maybe what's needed is a shoehorn for the top of the foot. It could possibly be made of termoplastic: just some shell over the instep of the foot to spread out the pressure / take the brunt of the force applied by the moulded facing that's bruising people's feet. Pop it on the foot for getting in the boot, once the foot's in, slide it out.
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I've only had very basic physics as well, and that's certainly not adequate to explain what's going on. I'm pretty sure I have a faulty model in my head, but I'd love for it to be corrected. To complicate matters further, the traditional explanation of pressure creating the liquid layer that makes skating possible has been challenged by resent surface science research (summary article from NYTimes: Explaining Ice: The Answers Are Slippery), though researchers have been unable to reach a consensus on what phenomenon actually is responsible. Still, whatever the nature of ice actually is, it probably doesn't change much in the physical modeling of how to interact with that slippery layer on skates. My thought, with regards to the FBV producing less drag when the flat is wider is that it's actually an effect from the other factor--the depth of the bite. (I think we're on the same page-ish there.) Even if making the blade's flat wider were to increase drag (as my intuition tells me, though it is only an intuition), it might not do so nearly as much as the correlated adjustment of bite angle and bite depth would. I guess the way to check this would be to test the different settings by holding the first or the second number constant. If the depth is kept the same and the bite angle is changed or the bite angle is kept the same and the depth and width of the flat are changed, what is the effect on blade drag? With FBV's particular shape, I can't see how to separate the effect of a wider flat from the other changes that automatically come with it.
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I think it might be more helpful to shift the discussion from glide to drag. They're essentially inverses of each other, but the difference is, drag is something you can model physically, while glide is just what it feels like to have less drag. Unless I'm picturing the scenario wrongly, isn't there less drag on narrower steel than wider steel (if everything else about the sharpening is held constant). I'm thinking anecdotally: Micron V2 steel attempted to replicate the decreased drag on speed skaters' steel, which is narrower than hockey steel. The greater width for hockey and figure skater steel being desirable for better spontaneous turning.
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That's the whole area I wish they would rework design and construction-wise. It sounds like the skates are still selling better and better, but I imagine the junction of the heel/achilles turns some people off.
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I'm curious, what's different between a generous ankle measurement with more wrap than needed and 55-Flex? Isn't that exactly what 55-Flex does?
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They had to do modifications for Blake Wheeler because of the width of his forefoot. It's discussed here in one of the VH feature videos.
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If you turn everything into a slip-n-slide, you could potentially increase the incidence of injury from strange deflections of said elbows off a shoulder directly into the boards or whatever. -
Good to note, I haven't seen the new boots in person yet so in that way it was unfair to say. Since the replacement isn't as much of an issue now, I'll just add that I like how the Mako/MLX tendon guard sits in the notched area at the back of the boot, so that it twists and pulls lower, closer to the ankle joint, if it is taped. That really comes down to personal preference then. On a scale of tight to loose tendon guard tape, I prefer loose.
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Not exactly your point, but Fedorov and Gonchar didn't really tape with anywhere near the same firmness, they're pretty much at opposite ends of extremely loose (Fedorov) and very secured (Gonchar). If you really want to tape and use a boot like VH, I'd suggest you go with the Mako instead, since its tendon guard is replaceable just as it was on the MLX.
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Yes, it would be nice if this were elaborated somewhere. As it is, Va Tech's Hockey STAR scored the helmets on rotational and linear impact, so if our helmets are ever to get better at handling rotational impact it will be through such testing and books on the table methods. If you just search "rotat" in the original article, you'll see how they incorporated rotational forces into this experiment. They didn't do it for Football STAR, and they only did it for Hockey STAR (according to their own account of it) because of constructive criticism they received on their Football STAR studies. According to their own 10 Year Plan, it's going to be ongoing.
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From the VA Tech lab's track record of football helmet ratings, it sounds as though it's likely to be ongoing. I haven't read their papers all the way through, but there should be a portion of the discussion at the end of the paper where they outline their plans.
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I can't help but think that VH will improve their durability just like almost any other first-generation skate. Look at the one90's heel separation and brutal tongue, the Mako's shredding shell and prickly upper cuff, the Vapor 8 had facing-shredding and rock-hard tendon guard that were addressed with the Vapor 10... The improvements look like they address the durability issues that have come up, although I'd still like to see some things adjusted a little bit. mc88, I've had a similar feeling of discomfort in the top edge of my MLX, especially since I'm used to Graf's radiused padding at the top which allows for extreme ankle rotation, but my plan to fix it is to just spot heat that area and remold it with my ankle rotated out the way it normally is for forward strides. It took me a while to think of that versus just rolling the top out some arbitrary amount with my fingers. What I really think needs to happen is they just need to make the boots even shorter a bit, with an upper pillow similar to what's on their short track boots, and also make the top eyelets more aggressive, like Mission's old Past-Vert eyelets (thanks JR for reminding me about those!), like in Cruikshank's prototype that led to the MLX.
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Got it, sorry for the repetitions :)
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Still for the baking process or for skating in after they've been molded? Sorry I keep asking the same thing, it just hasn't been crystal clear from what I've read on your trouble shooting process. Sorry it's still troubling you too. The reason I thought maybe trying to give a little more volume back (which I thought forming a little bit looser in the uncomfortable section might help do) was I experienced similar excruciating arch pain in Graf 705's that were extra-stiff from having not been skated in for several months. When I skated in them everyday, I could lace them to firmly wrap my foot throughout the arch and they were perfect: no hint of pain and super responsive. Yet, skating in them dry, they wouldn't form to my feet on the sides so I had to lace them less tight to compensate. With these thermoformable shells as with the Mako, it's still a bit of a mystery process to me. I've been going through different approaches to my MLX and still haven't quite nailed it. I've fortunately not had any arch pain in those, however.
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How tight did you lace this area when baking them?
