Sparx Skate Sharpener - At home sharpener

[thelaterskater 16]

I'd love to see everyone else's Sparx setup. Here's mine in my (heated) garage:

 

[lfc26 3]

Quick update guys. I've just finished my first grinding ring which lasted for 25 pair of skates including junior skates with heavy nicks, and senior skates with massively uneven edges.

i've basically sharpened all of my teammates skates an their kids skates.

Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating.

As soon as you are sharpening other guys skates, that are not carefully maintained, getting 40 sharpenings out of one ring is fake news IMO!!!

 

Given the costs of 80$ for a sharpening ring, it definitely seems unreasonable to obtain the machine as an European customer. Sparx will have to come forward by adapting the pricing for grinding rings over here and by distributing the grinding rings directly to their european customers. just my two cents

 

 

Edited January 12, 2020 by lfc26

[colins 246]

33 minutes ago, lfc26 said:

Quick update guys. I've just finished my first grinding ring which lasted for 25 pair of skates including junior skates with heavy nicks, and senior skates with massively uneven edges.

i've basically sharpened all of my teammates skates an their kids skates.

Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating.

As soon as you are sharpening other guys skates, that are not carefully maintained, getting 40 sharpenings out of one ring is fake news IMO!!!

 

Given the costs of 80$ for a sharpening ring, it definitely seems unreasonable to obtain the machine as an European customer. Sparx will have to come forward by adapting the pricing for grinding rings over here and by distributing the grinding rings directly to their european customers. just my two cents

 

 

 

So you averaged 6 passes per skate? That's a lot.

Your statement "Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating." is somewhat misleading. If you exclusively sharpen your own skates every 2-3 hours of skating, you'll get over 50 close to 60 'pairs' sharpened at an average of 2-3 passes per skate. That's what I do.

It's 320 passes per ring, use them however you like, that's how long a ring lasts. And the amount of material it removes per pass is fairly significant, at least when compared to the ProSharp for example.

You might be better off with a traditional machine like a Blademaster 850 if that's the typical type of usage you're going to see. Would be a lot cheaper in the long run.

colins

[stick9 890]

30 minutes ago, colins said:

 

So you averaged 6 passes per skate? That's a lot.

Your statement "Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating." is somewhat misleading. If you exclusively sharpen your own skates every 2-3 hours of skating, you'll get over 50 close to 60 'pairs' sharpened at an average of 2-3 passes per skate. That's what I do.

It's 320 passes per ring, use them however you like, that's how long a ring lasts. And the amount of material it removes per pass is fairly significant, at least when compared to the ProSharp for example.

You might be better off with a traditional machine like a Blademaster 850 if that's the typical type of usage you're going to see. Would be a lot cheaper in the long run.

colins

Yeah, I gotta agree with @colins. 

Sounds like lfc is using his primary ROH ring as a cross grind ring as well as a sharpening ring. Might be worth it to grab another ring for smoothing out badly damaged and uneven edges. I have a 3/4 fire ring I use as a sudo cross grind ring. I clean things up with that then switch to the proper ROH ring for the actual sharpening.

Edited January 12, 2020 by stick9

[lfc26 3]

22 minutes ago, stick9 said:

Yeah, I gotta agree with @colins. 

Sounds like lfc is using his primary ROH ring as a cross grind ring as well as a sharpening ring. Might be worth it to grab another ring for smoothing out badly damaged and uneven edges. I have a 3/4 fire ring I use as a sudo cross grind ring. I clean things up with that then switch to the proper ROH ring for the actual sharpening.

which ROH ring do you guys recommend for getting rid of nicks and especially massively uneven edges?

Do you guys prefer using a deeper hollow like 3/8'' or a shallower one 3/4'' and would you recommend a ROH ring or are Fire ring for that purpose?

Edited January 12, 2020 by lfc26

[lfc26 3]

1 hour ago, colins said:

 

So you averaged 6 passes per skate? That's a lot.

Your statement "Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating." is somewhat misleading. If you exclusively sharpen your own skates every 2-3 hours of skating, you'll get over 50 close to 60 'pairs' sharpened at an average of 2-3 passes per skate. That's what I do.

It's 320 passes per ring, use them however you like, that's how long a ring lasts. And the amount of material it removes per pass is fairly significant, at least when compared to the ProSharp for example.

You might be better off with a traditional machine like a Blademaster 850 if that's the typical type of usage you're going to see. Would be a lot cheaper in the long run.

colins

If we are trying to nitpick on the personal use parameters you may be right.

Nevertheless, you will never ever reach 40 sharpenings while sharpening various skates not owned by yourself.

It's simply not possible, to reach that number with one main ring and given all the different blade conditions.

Sharpening for various people who don't give a f*** about ring usage will yield 25-30 pair of decently sharpened skates at most.

I've just realized, sharpening one pair of skates cost me 3,20$ given the 80$ price tag in europe.😪

 

Edited January 12, 2020 by lfc26

[marka 526]

Howdy,

A couple things:

1st, generally speaking when I do other folk's skates I do 4 passes unless there are problems.  Usually those 4 passes are enough.  You cannot make a categorical statement like you are above.  When I'm doing my own, I usually do 2 or 3 passes.

2nd, if you're doing other folks skates, presumably you're not doing them for free.  Charge enough to cover your consumable cost or don't sharpen them.

 

Mark

[lfc26 3]

13 minutes ago, marka said:

Howdy,

A couple things:

1st, generally speaking when I do other folk's skates I do 4 passes unless there are problems.  Usually those 4 passes are enough.  You cannot make a categorical statement like you are above.  When I'm doing my own, I usually do 2 or 3 passes.

2nd, if you're doing other folks skates, presumably you're not doing them for free.  Charge enough to cover your consumable cost or don't sharpen them.

 

Mark

Hi Mark, thanks for the heads up. And yes, if someone cares about his edges, which unfortunately doesn't seem to be the case in my area, 4 cycles will be enough. I've also got the feeling that most of these skates have been sharpened unevenly before. We basically have two shops in our area and they are doing a horrible job😉.

Anyway, the results that I've seen so far are pretty obvious and in this case, I'll have to stick with my statement. Let's hope I'll see better results with the second ring

Edited January 12, 2020 by lfc26

[stick9 890]

50 minutes ago, lfc26 said:

which ROH ring do you guys recommend for getting rid of nicks and especially massively uneven edges?

Do you guys prefer using a deeper hollow like 3/8'' or a shallower one 3/4'' and would you recommend a ROH ring or are Fire ring for that purpose?

You want to go as flat as possible. Or as close to the ROH you intend on cutting? 

Fire vs ROH for that doesn't matter. I use the Fire ring because I have it.

[marka 526]

Howdy,

29 minutes ago, stick9 said:

You want to go as flat as possible. Or as close to the ROH you intend on cutting? 

Fire vs ROH for that doesn't matter. I use the Fire ring because I have it.

I can't see how it would matter, in terms of # of passes, unless you have an actual cross grinding ring that has more aggressive material removal.  The same amount of steel ends up being gone.

Which is a long way to say that I agree with your take on using a ring (that you already have) that otherwise gets little use as your 'cross grind' ring.  🙂
 

I actually did a pair a couple days ago where a cross grind ring would have been helpful.  1st pair so far.  About an inch of inside edge damage under the ball of the foot.  Ended up doing something like 15 passes with a regular ring to get it (mostly) taken care of.

Mark

[IPv6Freely 2092]

It seems silly to complain about not reaching average ring life when doing above average numbers of passes. 

[lfc26 3]

20 minutes ago, IPv6Freely said:

It seems silly to complain about not reaching average ring life when doing above average numbers of passes. 

Please forgive me for pointing out that getting 40 good sharpenings out of these rings is not likely, given all sorts of skate blades and blade wear....

40 sharpenings are not an average. As of now, that's an idealized advertising bs number for a single user scenario ... really intrigued to see the results after using my second ring.

Edited January 13, 2020 by lfc26

[IPv6Freely 2092]

How do you figure it’s not an average?

[stick9 890]

10 hours ago, lfc26 said:

Please forgive me for pointing out that getting 40 good sharpenings out of these rings is not likely, given all sorts of skate blades and blade wear....

40 sharpenings are not an average. As of now, that's an idealized advertising bs number for a single user scenario ... really intrigued to see the results after using my second ring.

I think they'd need to be able to prove a claim like that. 

But anyway, its been said it's 320 passes per ring. However those 320 are used is entirely up to the user. 

Edited January 13, 2020 by stick9

[Leif 161]

5 hours ago, lfc26 said:

Please forgive me for pointing out that getting 40 good sharpenings out of these rings is not likely, given all sorts of skate blades and blade wear....

40 sharpenings are not an average. As of now, that's an idealized advertising bs number for a single user scenario ... really intrigued to see the results after using my second ring.

That’s a bit strong. There are families who happily use these machines. It sounds like your users really mess up their blades to an unusual degree. I play maybe three hours a week, low level rec, and it is rare that I get nicks that require loads of passes. In fact I’m down to one pass every 3-4 hours skating, or four passes per fortnight which is how often I’d visit the LHS for a sharpen. Uneven edges might require four passes. If you need more, then the skater should avoid their LHS like the plague. It sounds like the issue you have is that you sharpen skates previously sharpened in shops staffed by unskilled workers who don’t have a clue what they are doing. 

Edited January 13, 2020 by Leif

[colins 246]

10 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

How do you figure it’s not an average?

 

Because he's sharpening super damaged and very uneven edges on every single pair he does, and he can't relate to anyone who isn't. 

Nor can he see 10 yards down the road, where if his 'customers' are happy they'll come back with even edges that are just normally worn and he won't have to do more than 4 passes the second time he sharpens the same pair of skates.

I dunno... the guy has come into this thread and crapped on Sparx from the get-go. It's getting a bit tiring to be honest. We all appreciate new info and rational debate about the product, but that hasn't been the case here.

 

colins

 

 

[VegasHockey 1280]

6 hours ago, Leif said:

That’s a bit strong. There are families who happily use these machines. It sounds like your users really mess up their blades to an unusual degree. I play maybe three hours a week, low level rec, and it is rare that I get nicks that require loads of passes. In fact I’m down to one pass every 3-4 hours skating, or four passes per fortnight which is how often I’d visit the LHS for a sharpen. Uneven edges might require four passes. If you need more, then the skater should avoid their LHS like the plague. It sounds like the issue you have is that you sharpen skates previously sharpened in shops staffed by unskilled workers who don’t have a clue what they are doing. 

I skate 5-7 times weekly, about 10-14 hour total, and sharpen my skates once a week with a single pass. I do however skate on a very flat hollow compared to most others. If I change my hollow, as some rinks have harder ice than others, I usually do two passes. 

[lfc26 3]

1 hour ago, colins said:

 

Because he's sharpening super damaged and very uneven edges on every single pair he does, and he can't relate to anyone who isn't. 

Nor can he see 10 yards down the road, where if his 'customers' are happy they'll come back with even edges that are just normally worn and he won't have to do more than 4 passes the second time he sharpens the same pair of skates.

I dunno... the guy has come into this thread and crapped on Sparx from the get-go. It's getting a bit tiring to be honest. We all appreciate new info and rational debate about the product, but that hasn't been the case here.

 

colins

 

 

I really don't care colins. I love my Sparx machine and I can clearly see the benefit for a home-user!!! I just don't love the costs and the fact that they are taking away features yet charging more and more for the sharpening rings!!!

All i wanted to do is to find a way to bring costs down for international users by taking a look at the different consumer/ commercial rings and by pointing out to other customers that sharpenings come around 3,2$ in europe given the quality of sharpenings locally and the amount of cycles you have to do to work things out. (80$ rings!!!!)

The results so far are 25 sharpenings of poorly maintained skates and that's a fact. Basically every skate, except my own pair of new skates, caused an unbearable noise while sharpening. To get rid of that, it took 5-8 cycles per skate=10-16 cyles per pair!!!!

All I wanted to point out above was that Sparx promises a grinding ring mileage that works nicely under isolated conditions. That's all. If you are using the machine for yourself, it's the greatest thing ever, but as soon as there are any variables introduced it's economically unsustainable for international buyers.

that's all from my side

Edited January 13, 2020 by lfc26

[colins 246]

 

Are you losing money at 3,2$ a sharpening? Do you anticipate no repeat business and only damaged uneven edges always coming through your doors?

You bring valuable new experience/data to the group - but your conclusions are difficult for some of us to understand.

[darkhors 88]

I sharpen a lot peoples skates on my Sparx, from 12U kids down to 6U and a bunch of guys that play in my beer league. I think my first ring, I got about 30 pairs of skates sharpened and that was with 2 pairs that I had to do 10 cycles on and 8 cycles, respectively. If someone is bringing me a brand new pair of skates, I politely ask them to have the first sharpening done at the LHS or at a minimum have them cross grind them and then I'll sharpen them after that. Mos of the people who I tell this to are ok with that response because they understand that I can't get a cross grind ring, but they know from others that I'm putting out a good product for them. I constantly get great feedback on the edges they have after I sharpen them. I agree with most here that you know how many passes you're going to get out of the ring and it's your job as the sharpener to figure out how many passes you need to do. Also, if someone brings me steel that has a ton of larger nicks/gouges, I charge them extra as I have to do extra passes on them to get them back to normal. Even with my extra charge, it's still about the same as going to the LHS but they're getting a more consistent cut every time.

[stick9 890]

34 minutes ago, lfc26 said:

I really don't care colins. I love my Sparx machine and I can clearly see the benefit for a home-user!!! I just don't love the costs and the fact that they are taking away features yet charging more and more for the sharpening rings!!!

All i wanted to do is to find a way to bring costs down for international users by taking a look at the different consumer/ commercial rings and by pointing out to other customers that sharpenings come around 3,2$ in europe given the quality of sharpenings locally and the amount of cycles you have to do to work things out. (80$ rings!!!!)

The results so far are 25 sharpenings of poorly maintained skates and that's a fact. Basically every skate, except my own pair of new skates, caused an unbearable noise while sharpening. To get rid of that, it took 5-8 cycles per skate=10-16 cyles per pair!!!!

All I wanted to point out above was that Sparx promises a grinding ring mileage that works nicely under isolated conditions. That's all. If you are using the machine for yourself, it's the greatest thing ever, but as soon as there are any variables introduced it's economically unsustainable for international buyers.

that's all from my side

I think you are taking that 40 sharpening per ring (it's actually listed as 60) a bit too literal. I mean, just because you aren't getting those results doesn't mean others aren't. Hell, I've had the same 3/4 ring for a year and a half.

From the site

Quote

Every Sparx™ grinding ring will last the average user 60 skate pair sharpenings.

Talking to people who know the machine way better than me. I've heard under the proper conditions you can get 90 sharpenings out of a ring.

[IPv6Freely 2092]

I mean it’s simple math... if you use an above average number of passes per skate then you will get a below average number of passes per ring.

So saying it’s a fact that the ring only gets 25 pairs is nonsense. You might have only gotten that but I’m not sure how you connect the lines between you doing more passes than normal and the ring only making it to 60 pairs in perfect conditions. How would you know unless you were doing the average?

So, bottom line here is that the average is 60 pairs. There’s no caveat to that. If half the people get 25 and half the people get 95 then guess what the average of that is? #3rdgrademaths

If this is really going to continue to be a problem for you maybe you should just get it over with and sue them. Well all be waiting to see how that goes.

[Vet88 674]

20 hours ago, lfc26 said:

Quick update guys. I've just finished my first grinding ring which lasted for 25 pair of skates including junior skates with heavy nicks, and senior skates with massively uneven edges.

i've basically sharpened all of my teammates skates an their kids skates.

Getting 40 pair of skates out of one sharpening ring is only reachable if you're exclusively sharpening your own skates by basically maintaining them every 2-3 hours of skating.

As soon as you are sharpening other guys skates, that are not carefully maintained, getting 40 sharpenings out of one ring is fake news IMO!!!

 

Given the costs of 80$ for a sharpening ring, it definitely seems unreasonable to obtain the machine as an European customer. Sparx will have to come forward by adapting the pricing for grinding rings over here and by distributing the grinding rings directly to their european customers. just my two cents

 

 

This is like trying to compare apples and oranges, a sparx unit versus a traditional sharpening unit both have strengths and weaknesses. Your running costs with a traditional unit will always be cheaper but it requires a lot more skill to get a good sharpening. A sparx is plug and push, no skill needed as long as the alignment is correct.

You got 25 sharpenings, let's say you charged 10 euro a sharpening, if I was running a shop I would not be comfortable with that return. However as a home user at 3.2 euro per sharpening versus a LHS charge??? What is there to not like about that cost other than we always want it cheaper? If you are unhappy then maybe charge a per pass cost? Then if they turn up with massively damaged blades you get a higher return for your sharpening (if a financial return is a key driver of what you are trying to do).

[VegasHockey 1280]

59 minutes ago, Vet88 said:

This is like trying to compare apples and oranges, a sparx unit versus a traditional sharpening unit both have strengths and weaknesses. Your running costs with a traditional unit will always be cheaper but it requires a lot more skill to get a good sharpening. A sparx is plug and push, no skill needed as long as the alignment is correct.

You got 25 sharpenings, let's say you charged 10 euro a sharpening, if I was running a shop I would not be comfortable with that return. However as a home user at 3.2 euro per sharpening versus a LHS charge??? What is there to not like about that cost other than we always want it cheaper? If you are unhappy then maybe charge a per pass cost? Then if they turn up with massively damaged blades you get a higher return for your sharpening (if a financial return is a key driver of what you are trying to do).

I think it all depends. 25 sharpens at $10 a sharpen would be $250 bucks and if the ring costs him $60 thats a pretty decent return. Yes, you could buy a Wissota or some other machine for $1200 and charge less per sharpen but if you aren't skilled you're going to have a heck of a time giving people a consistent sharpen which could lead to not having return customers. 

[Giltis 116]

A couple of thoughts

1 - I think it's generally understood that these numbers are estimates only. Especially if you are sharpening skates with heavy nicks, and massively uneven edges. I think even my local sharpener has a surcharge for rusty blades and the such. Same discrepancy would apply if you're just sharpening JR blades vs SR length blades, and akin to complaining that your new car only gets 15 mpg when you drive the way you drive, even though the EPA rating is much higher.

2- That flat bottom sharpening video is an eye opener, and makes me realize why some of my friends could not skate on Flat bottom sharpens.

 

Also as an aside, it's become a huge pet peeve of mine when people say "Fake News" for things, it's lazy and dismissive to an actual conversation.

Edited January 13, 2020 by Giltis