VH Footwear/TRUE by Scott Van Horne

[laserrobottime 149]

The toe box issue was not a measurement problem, rather a construction problem. My smallest toe was placed behind a support piece that had too much carbon fiber layered inside it and caused my toe to jam against it. Bad measurements, of course, would sour this whole experience too.

Overall, this forum is probably not the optimal market for a custom skate like VH. The guys on this forum are pickier about gear for beer league than many of the pros I know.

[bunnyman666 445]

The toe box issue was not a measurement problem, rather a construction problem. My smallest toe was placed behind a support piece that had too much carbon fiber layered inside it and caused my toe to jam against it. Bad measurements, of course, would sour this whole experience too.

Overall, this forum is probably not the optimal market for a custom skate like VH. The guys on this forum are pickier about gear for beer league than many of the pros I know.

Then it was his duty to fix it!

Again- this is a young skate manufacturer who is deep in the process of R&D. It's great that he has a portion of his local NHL team using his product because he is also drawing R&D experience from that, as well.

[jlp15 13]

I have been on my VH's for almost 2 months now. Mine have been great from day one although I had one issue with heel slip but after a 2nd heat mould they have been perfect. Durability wise still holding up great! I may not be as picky as some people on this forum but I have really enjoyed my customs. Measurements might leave room for error if you don't know how to measure I guess... It's not rocket science.

The toe box issue was not a measurement problem, rather a construction problem. My smallest toe was placed behind a support piece that had too much carbon fiber layered inside it and caused my toe to jam against it. Bad measurements, of course, would sour this whole experience too.

Overall, this forum is probably not the optimal market for a custom skate like VH. The guys on this forum are pickier about gear for beer league than many of the pros I know.

They may be pickier because they pay for their gear!

[JR Boucicaut 3795]

They may be pickier because they pay for their gear!

Um, no. The pros' choice in equipment PAYS them. Think about it.

Overall, this forum is probably not the optimal market for a custom skate like VH.

Actually, it is. His product isn't carried by a retailer at this point, and even then, it would be a stock item. And even then, the VAST majority of hockey players don't even consider a custom skate, because, quite frankly, they don't need it. Which is why I probably reject 8/10 people who come to me for custom skates because they don't need it.

It's better to have paid R&D than to make hundreds of working prototypes that never return a penny. It is also certainly better to be pro-active than need a costly and possibly reputation damaging recall.

Right, but at some point that theory won't fly. So, the person whose skates were learned from, how do you take care of the customers BEFORE them? I've seen that in this thread.

[bunnyman666 445]

Right, but at some point that theory won't fly. So, the person whose skates were learned from, how do you take care of the customers BEFORE them? I've seen that in this thread.

One would hope that more R&D was performed on the NHL players that have these skates! After all, pros got many, many prototypes when I operated my components company.

Many issues will probably never surface on an amateur player that would on a pro player. However, if I had a return, I would certainly update their skate if it were within a normal warranty period.

I don't disagree. I think I want to save my pennies and wait until next year to buy these skates. I am certain there is a quality product available from VH footwear NOW; but seeing that there are some quantum leaps on the newer boots, it wouldn't pay me to buy now.

[IPv6Freely 2092]

While I am not suspect about Scott's work, it really, really surprises me that he doesn't want a mould of the foot. I had to do that with custom cycling shoes. I had no issues, especially since the pedorthist was told how specifically to mould the foot for the mesurements. While this would add slightly to the cost, the cost savings in returned boots would even this out.

He does do in-person 3D moulding for his speed skates. I wonder if he would do moulds for ice skates too, if you're local (or willing to travel). Has anyone asked?

As somebody mentioned before (in this, or another thread) the possibilities now with 3D printing to generate 100% custom lasts for "cheap" are going to make custom fitting skates a really interesting market in the near future, i would think.

[customskateworks 39]

He does do in-person 3D moulding for his speed skates. I wonder if he would do moulds for ice skates too, if you're local (or willing to travel). Has anyone asked?

As somebody mentioned before (in this, or another thread) the possibilities now with 3D printing to generate 100% custom lasts for "cheap" are going to make custom fitting skates a really interesting market in the near future, i would think.

Correct. In a few years you're going to be surprised what 3D printing will do for hockey. I've been to a few seminars here in town where they are printing parts from numerous types of plastics. It will only be a matter of how precise your measurement methods are and how fast your CAD technician can get designs to the printer.

[shooter27 116]

He does do in-person 3D moulding for his speed skates. I wonder if he would do moulds for ice skates too, if you're local (or willing to travel). Has anyone asked?

As somebody mentioned before (in this, or another thread) the possibilities now with 3D printing to generate 100% custom lasts for "cheap" are going to make custom fitting skates a really interesting market in the near future, i would think.

I did ask about the 3D molding and Scott recommended against it. His response was:

"You are correct it would be more exact but with hockey skates the bottom of the boot must marry with a blade holder, plus there is much more foam, and the hockey boot is very heat moldable, whereas a custom speed skate boot is not heat moldable at all.

We have made hockey skates utilizing this technology, but the cost was incredibly high and almost all of the testers preferred the custom hockey boots made from the foot tracing vs the scanner."

[mojo122 535]

It would be nice to know why the testers preferred the skates made by tracing over those that were done using the 3D technology? Also the size of the test group would be nice to know?

[Ps12 11]

"We have made hockey skates utilizing this technology, but the cost was incredibly high ..."

This makes more sense. I had asked about 3d scans and scott said the tracings would be fine.

Im ready to order mine this week. After tracing them i thought man ive got wide feet.

Anatomical toe cap will need to be 4.5 inches!

Im hoping it works out well and that i wont have to make adjustments and send them back like others after i heat mold them.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Ps12

[JR Boucicaut 3795]

Question to all who have done it; when you did the tracing, who did the tracing?

Did you put your feet on a piece of paper and trace it with a pen yourself? Did you email or fax it?

[Ps12 11]

I did it with a pen and lined it up so that i drew a line as if i was looking straight over. I might have someone else redo my right foot.

Heres the form.

http://www.vhspeedskating.com/assets/order_form_hockey_player.pdf

Next step is scanning it and emailing with photos and mention problem spots.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Ps12

[laserrobottime 149]

I had my wife trace each foot with weight on that foot, keeping the pen vertical.

I scanned the tracings and verified they were at 100% size before sending.

[JR Boucicaut 3795]

I had my wife trace each foot with weight on that foot, keeping the pen vertical.

I scanned the tracings and verified they were at 100% size before sending.

Standing?

Heres the form.

Interesting.

[DRW1319 3]

For my custom pair I sent in the tracings while standing and the measurements asked for. I also sent in pictures of my feet from all angles. The skates are fantastic. Solved the pain problems I've had for a long time.

[laserrobottime 149]

Standing during tracing yes.

[JR Boucicaut 3795]

PSA -

Sit next time. Your feet flatten out when full weight is on it, giving you a skewed reading for length and width. Traces need to be done in a semi-weighted position, so, sit in a chair high enough in which your leg is bent at 90º and your feet on the floor.

I see it all the time in the store when measuring for skates; they always stand up. I tell them to sit, and explain that you don't skate with straight legs; when they bend they knees their size drops down on the gauge.

[Speedz98 15]

Question to all who have done it; when you did the tracing, who did the tracing?

Did you put your feet on a piece of paper and trace it with a pen yourself? Did you email or fax it?

I had some one trace my foot for me while I stood on a table and placed weight on the foot. I scanned the image and then e-mailed.

[laserrobottime 149]

I was told by Scott to stand with my knees bent and aligned over my toes, so that's what I did.

[JR Boucicaut 3795]

Okay, I see. Your knees were bent.

[iceman8310 105]

This makes more sense. I had asked about 3d scans and scott said the tracings would be fine.

Im ready to order mine this week. After tracing them i thought man ive got wide feet.

Anatomical toe cap will need to be 4.5 inches!

Im hoping it works out well and that i wont have to make adjustments and send them back like others after i heat mold them.

I recommend take pictures of your feet if you can as well.

[SydNap 25]

Received my VHs last night via USPS. I caught the mailman at 4:30 putting them into the lockbox. I told him they were a box of skates, he did not believe me (very light). I baked them last night per the instructions. One thing I should mention is that because of the way that they fit (super snug around the foot like a cradle) and because I skate barefoot, I had to stop mid-process and go find some thin socks. The eyelets were really hot and started to burn my foot. I accounted for everything else....except safety apparently.

The baking resumed and I let them sit overnight. I skated on them tonight for about 45 minutes. They felt surprisingly like my Graf G35s, just lighter and more comfortable. It's been said, but these skates HUG your feet and really lock them into place. There were no hot spots or pressure points (I usally have toe box issues, but not today!), and overall they were very comfortable. The only "downside" is how hard they are to get on and off. I'm ok with it though because my feet were completely locked into the skates. I can't compare that to any other skate I've worn. The best example I could give would be like a really thick sock that you put on that has a blade at the bottom. Overall my foot and skate felt very connected. About a minute in I was skating like I have worn these for several years. Very impressed.

I'll come back and give an update in a few months. I can't speak to durability right now, but these puppies are nice...

Thanks Scott for getting those Graf holders on for me and making such a nice skate..

[IPv6Freely 2092]

The best example I could give would be like a really thick sock that you put on that has a blade at the bottom.

When I describe my Makos, I usually tell people "like a sturdy hiking boot, soft and comfortable but a nice even pressure all over the foot". I'm sure the VH feels similar.

If I start seeing any signs at all of any of the issues I've seen in the Mako thread, I'll be ordering some custom VH. I just need to be able to show my wife physical proof of why I need to buy another pair of skates ;)

[Davetronz 109]

I guess I can chime in a bit with a partial review now.

To answer JR's question on the previous page - I taught my girlfriend how to do the tracing based on my experience with doing customs for other manufacturers.

Tracing was done barefoot, seated, 90 degree bend. I then scanned at 100%, provided measurements from all angles and dimensions on the scans, and sent with about 20 pictures of my feet.

I made a few requests with my skates:

- Increase height of boot by 10mm to provide additional support.

- Narrow AA heels.

- LS3 and edge, not profiled or sharpened.

VH and I discussed not mounting the blades and holders and that I'd do them myself when they arrived incase I had to offset or shim. At the end I decided to have them mounted by VH.

When I received my skates I was really impressed by the quality and construction. Wow, they're light!

During the heat fit I felt a pretty good burn (even through socks) from the copper backing that holds the tendon guard on.

Skates molded very well and I skated on them. During first skate felt a variety of volume issues (too much volume in mid-foot) and heel lock issues (slipping). I also had some issues with the stock LS3 profile (I usually skate on 13').

Did a little bit of work on the skates myself and still wasn't getting what I was looking for.

Discussed with VH and luckily him and I were able to meet up for a good hour plus when he was in Calgary for Speed Skating Worlds. We worked together to reduce the volume with thicker tongues and changes to red insole liner. We also re-heated and clamped the heels on my feet to increase the heel lock. He also fixed the copper backing that was protruding a bit from the one tendon guard. We "opened" up the skate walls a bit so I could get my foot in a bit easier. Great experience with Scott in person. Awesome guy and made the best out of the limited tools we had on-site. Based on my experience in the industry I took what he showed me in regards to the specifics of the VH skate, and told him I would be able to make additional modifications on my own. Honestly though, best in-person experience ever with Scott.

After modifications with Scott I was still having some issues with volume, but the heel lock and any small discomfort was solved. It took a bit of playing around, but I ended up removing both the red and black VH insoles and putting in a pair of Superfeet (I'm not usually a fan, but I found the VH insoles too spongey). I used these together with combinations of both my thicker and thinner tongues, moved the tongues up and down slightly, and have finally found my sweet spot with regards to volume and insole support.

Interesting to note that this is the first pair of skates that I haven't had to offset the holders or shim to correct pronation. I'm perfectly square. This is also the first pair of skates that I haven't had issues with toe boxes, toe irritation, or ball of foot irritation. So comfortable. I feel more load on my thighs in these skates, so I need to stregthen these muscles a bit. I really like the edge control with the skates.

The only durability concern that I've noted is minimal. I've taken a couple shots or blades off the toe caps and the material seems to turn a bit white. I wasn't a huge fan of the "glossy" look, so this discoloration is fine with me. Otherwise, I'm really happy. Considering ordering a custom pair of goalie skates as well. Hats off to Scott.

Oh and to whomever was discussing tongue thickness. Yes, thicker tongues are available for purchase - just contact scott. I have a pair of thinner stock tongues and a pair of thicker tongues.

[flip12 712]

Received my VHs last night via USPS. I caught the mailman at 4:30 putting them into the lockbox. I told him they were a box of skates, he did not believe me (very light). I baked them last night per the instructions. One thing I should mention is that because of the way that they fit (super snug around the foot like a cradle) and because I skate barefoot, I had to stop mid-process and go find some thin socks. The eyelets were really hot and started to burn my foot. I accounted for everything else....except safety apparently.

The baking resumed and I let them sit overnight. I skated on them tonight for about 45 minutes. They felt surprisingly like my Graf G35s, just lighter and more comfortable. It's been said, but these skates HUG your feet and really lock them into place. There were no hot spots or pressure points (I usally have toe box issues, but not today!), and overall they were very comfortable. The only "downside" is how hard they are to get on and off. I'm ok with it though because my feet were completely locked into the skates. I can't compare that to any other skate I've worn. The best example I could give would be like a really thick sock that you put on that has a blade at the bottom. Overall my foot and skate felt very connected. About a minute in I was skating like I have worn these for several years. Very impressed.

I'll come back and give an update in a few months. I can't speak to durability right now, but these puppies are nice...

Thanks Scott for getting those Graf holders on for me and making such a nice skate..

How high are the boots compared to your G35's?