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Vet88
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Everything posted by Vet88
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He has but its not a good result, for some unknown reason the left was made 1/2" longer than the right... He needs to be in the shop on the phone to True to find out why, something must be wrong with the scan data as both his feet are the same length. and imho they need to remake the left skate again, not just pad the toe with foam.
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Orthotics in ice skates do not fix pronation. In a shoe the orthotic has the ground to provide the support it needs to shape the foot. In an ice skate a 1/8" wide piece of steel does not provide the support the orthotic needs so your foot will still pronate. You need to either 1: move the holder inwards 2: shim the outside of the holder 3: learn to skate with your laces undone 4: buy the stiffest boots you can with the narrowest heel you can fit into and when they start to open up after a short while then buy a new pair. Anyone who wants to sell you orthotics on the premise that it will fix your pronation in ice skates is just selling a dream.
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Both of your feet pronate. Have a look at the way the tongue sits in the boot, see how it twists to the outside? This is because your foot is collapsing inwards during any inside edge work and then the tongue gets pushed to the outside due to the pressure of the foot. It's not just the ankle, it's a body alignment issue - forefoot to arch, arch to ankle, ankle to knee, knee to hip, hip to back. Calf raises help, standing on a step edge with the side of your foot and holding your balance, lunges with correct alignment (knee over the second toe) but if you want to naturally fix it (as opposed to holder movement or shimming) there is only one way for skaters to do it, skate with your laces undone. It takes around 1 year of training of focused inside edge work (at least 3 times a week for an hour per session) for the muscle memory to set and then you will not pronate in your skates. Your alignment will be correct, your arch, ankles and legs will be much stronger and you will be a much better technical skater than when you began.
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I'll help here, here is the shim in the True boot that fits perfectly in his size 5 Bauers: https://imgur.com/a/FDhX0Lp and here he is fitting 2 fingers down the back of his heel with his foot in the boot. That is the back of the hand that you are looking at: https://imgur.com/a/1VFOPK1
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Because shin pads don't come in 1/2 sizes and a lot of players prefer to wear them under the tongue. When the shin pad is just a fraction too long the bottom edge of the shin pad rubs against the inner lining around the top eyelet. And this came from our authorized Bauer agent after he had come back from a visit to the Bauer center in Europe and he was explaining why Bauer had done it. But maybe you drop the top 3 eyelets which allows you the extra flex forward in the boot then it is possible for the tongue to brush the lining but if you lace all the way up then it should not be happening. But if you think your tongue should be naturally moving back and forward in the skate then so be it.
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Skates aren't designed to wear like that. You should be asking yourself why this is happening because it is an indication that the skates are not fitting you correctly or you have foot related issues (pronation, alignment, heel twist etc) that is causing the tongue to rub against the boot.
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Another very experienced True fitter has already indicated in this thread how he has received skates from True that had a similar story to smu. Saying it never happens doesn't make it so. Now if there was some visibility of True reaching out to the LHS to understand what went wrong and why and feeding this back into the fitment process to improve things then that in itself would be good customer feedback. But saying that you get sent skates that other fitting centers can't get right isn't a great overall look for the process, whilst it may be good for your business how can a member of the public have a high degree of trust in other fitting centers?
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There is nothing any fit center anywhere in the world could have done to fix these skates. Even if it was a scanner screw up the first time, when the skates went back the second time with the fitting center comments attached, they should never have come back with foam in the toe box as the fix. I have seen the photos of how these fit on him, when he can fit 2 fingers down the back of his heel when his toes are brushing the toe box, when the heel inserts he has that fit ok in his size 5 Bauers are put in the Trues and they slop from side to side by around 5mm, when he can fit a finger down the side of his ankle with his foot in the boot, and when his foot slops around in the boot so much when it is done up that he can hardly feel the tops of the boot then it's a triple whammy, length, width and volume were all wrong and wrong by a long long way. These were so far out the first thing I thought of was that True must have sent him skates made for someone else who was around 2+ sizes bigger all over. Now if the scanner can be this far out then True have some serious issues with the software.
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99% of the time it's not the tongue that causes the wear, it's how open the boot is at the top and how the shin guards fit. You get one side of the shin guard that just slips inside one side of the boot and this will destroy the lining at the top of the boot really fast.
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I think what you meant here is that you skate in a Bauer X60 that is nearly 2 sizes smaller than the skate True have supplied you with. Put side by side the True skate is nearly 1/2 an inch longer (and wider and with more volume). All in all a boot that doesn't fit you anywhere and their attempt to fix it the 2nd time round was to pad the toe caps and put in a sole filler??? wtf. Come on True, this isn't good and a True rep who reads this should be getting someone to reach out to smu and help fix this because something, somewhere has gone wrong about as bad as it can possibly get........
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If your feet were 2 different sizes by a significant amount (ie a size 6 and a size 7) then making a longer boot and padding it in the toe is a valid way to address the length differential. What smu is saying the boots should fit your feet, not be too long or too wide or have too much volume. They should not have padding in the toes because they were made too long or extra thick soles to try and take out volume because they were made too large or need heel inserts because the heel pocket is too big.
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I have arthritis, especially in my lower back and my last lot of xrays of my upper back / neck region showed a lot of wear and tear. I'm not at the fusion stage yet but dealing with back pain is an ongoing grind. However my chiropractor reckons skating is one of the better exercises you can do for your back as it does not generate a lot of concussive loading thru the back and the rotational movement helps to keep everything loose (and I hate swimming as an exercise). If I ever wonder if I could still play sports after spinal fusion I just look at Tiger and know anything must be possible.
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Hmm, all this just to get a ex NHL player to feel comfortable in them, someone who has skated for most of his life. How are they going to dial in the rest of skating population???
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Hi shayne, thanks, will get it later today when I'm at the rink.
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The local rink I train and coach at recently purchased a Prosharp for their rentals and to offer a drop in sharpening service for players. I have been using it to get some experience with the machine and the alignment keeps wandering off center after sharpening 5 skates or so. It's a pita having to keep checking all the time, any thoughts as to why it would do this and what a possible remedy might be?
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You don't need to be a big guy to get benefit from stiff sidewalls. If you pronate in any way at all in skates (and don't skate enough to train it out) then you want them as stiff as you can possibly get. This will help to stop the boot from opening up as the ankle continuously puts pressure on the inside quarter. Eventually they will move but you will get a longer life out of them.
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The problem started back with Rbk skates and when the CCM name reentered the game they kept using the same shitty eyelets, all to save a fraction of a cent. Even if you don't sweat a lot they will still break down over time, I seriously believe it is planned obsolescence... I am like your son, I sweat a lot and have eaten through a lot of rbk / ccm eyelets. I replaced every stamped eyelet on my Jetspeeds, it's worth the peace of mind and prevention of expensive repairs down the track. And it's simple to rationalise, it's not if they will go but when so why not get it dealt with asap and make the problem go away long term. CCM aren't the only manufacturer with this problem but I believe they are the worst.
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Ha, the one I hate is when the little buggers sneak in behind you then take you out when they fall over, those falls always seem to be the worst. Head needs to be on a swivel, I reckon I'm more aware of where skaters are when coaching nippers than ever before in a game!
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Seen this but the stick hit him in the mouth, 4 teeth gone. I always coach with a hybrid these days, its just not worth the hassle to be dealing with dental etc because of some shitty flukey accident. I don't care what it looks like anymore, been able to eat my breakfast tomorrow morning properly is more important to me than getting chirped by some dickhead on the ice.
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Haglunds, Bauer, Pump bump. And I agree with you, I have no idea why the term Bauer bump has stuck for ice / inline hockey environment but sadly that is how 99% of the people out there know them as. Mention the word Haglunds and they look at you blankly.
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Sadly this is a trend that is just going to get worse until kids / parents / coaches / players start to realise what is happening. You shouldn't put a developing player into a stiff skate that is fully laced up until they can balance properly on their edges and have full muscle control / good technique of the edge WITHOUT BOOT SUPPORT. Bauer bumps are going to become a plague and we are just starting to see the tip of the iceberg arriving now.
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Sack the coach? Just kidding but he sounds like a real pita if that is how he coaches kids. I was talking to 2 well known swedish coaches last year and the most important thing they emphasized for kids under 10 in their system - it has to be FUN, regardless of their skill set. For example one of the best times my kids had training was one year when they did a 3 month intensive course for the junior olympics. Different stations with coaches set up around the rink and kids just drifted from station to station trying things out and trying to beat their own pb's. No pressure to try anything, just have fun and the improvement in the skills (video analysis before and after the course) was quite an eye opener for a totally unstructured training course. I'd pull him out now because you aren't going to change how someone coaches, ask around about other teams / coaches. Forget about the level, look for something that makes him enjoy skating and playing again. Even if you just explain to him that we are not going to worry about your skills for the rest of the season (they will naturally get better if he keeps skating), the focus is to have fun with no pressure. Drop him back into his age group?
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And I would hazard a guess that customer experience has lead to that decision. I repeat what I said before, you cannot address pronation by "building" arch support into the boot and or by building a boot such that the inside ankle wall is so stiff it will never flex. Been there, done it and in a year or so the results will be published in a dissertation. If your pronation is mild enough then arch support may help and possibly help enough so that you no longer notice it but the underlying issue remains, your center of gravity (ie center line) is no longer through the middle of your heel to the 2nd toe.
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If you pronate then a True skate, or any skate for that matter, isn't going to solve the issue unless you either 1: make some significant mods to it or 2: correct your pronation with training and relearning how to skate. The issue you have with your bunions is exactly as you describe, you lean inwards which puts excessive force onto the inside of the foot and the top of of the outside of the foot (think top of the pinky toe). The traditional method to address this is to either shim the outside of the skate or get your holder moved inwards or a combination of both. You cannot fully address pronation with just arch and foot supports in an ice skate.
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This more than anything else should tell you to run as fast as you can from the place. It doesn't matter how good the machine is, bad operators will produce bad results.
